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 Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2007 3:49 pm
LedZeppelinGirl marshjazz @ Led:
Good point. However I think it should be applied to rapist who have had multipule victims. Thank you for seeing my point.
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2007 6:07 pm
band4ever101 Aakiyana @Band4ever: I never said that if somebody important to me got murderered I'd be like "oh well that sucks" and I wouldn't mind if the person stayed out on the street. In fact, I said quite the opposite. If someone close to me got murderered, I'd be devasted, and I'd want the murderer to be punished severly (I believe I've said this several times and I'm about sick of saying it so people stop arguing that), I just wouldn't want him to be put to death. Putting the murderer to death wouldn't give me any type of closure whatsoever. Especially if he dies before he answers the question, "Why?" I wouldn't want revenge either, because to me, revenge is childish. If they were locked up, I would have peace of mind that they couldn't murder anyone else.
@Ty: I agree with the mental illness. A lot of criminals are sociopaths and have anti-social personality disorder. People are still trying to figure how to cure it but it's going to take time, and if we kill off every prisoner that has this disorder how can we lern anything from it or how to stop future killers? I didn't say that was what you would say exactly. If you read my exact entry again. I said I was using an example. I didn't mean that is what you would actually say. But if you feel more comfortable with a murderer who killed a close family member still on the street free to kill again. That's fine. But the majority don't feel that way. <3
@marsh: While I do admit that not everyone feels the way I do, but I see it as this: If everyone believed in revenge then we'd be about one quarter of the population we are now. Maybe less. Because once people start getting revenge for having something stolen, someone's gona retaliate and maybe go overboard and kill that person, then that person will be killed and there would just be endless senseless savage violence that would probably set back human civilization back a thousand years....I could be exaggerating a bit much but you kinda get the picture.
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2007 6:39 pm
Which is why I would rather the government taking the revenge versus the person. If the government does it, then it is multipule people they would have to kill, less likely that they would do it. Whereas one person taking their revenge would only lead to the killer's family taking revenge. And so-on until it results in a fued that eventually kills everyone off.
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 12:00 pm
Better that I have a reading problem than an ignorance one.
Feel free to keep your same views...I can't take them away. But whatever...If you want them to stay locked away they might as well be killed. As anyone who's sat on death row for 35+ years, they would most likely rather be dead than continue to stay locked up without a fate.
I agree with Marsh.
ninja
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Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:01 pm
band4ever101 Better that I have a reading problem than an ignorance one. Feel free to keep your same views...I can't take them away. But whatever...If you want them to stay locked away they might as well be killed. As anyone who's sat on death row for 35+ years, they would most likely rather be dead than continue to stay locked up without a fate. I agree with Marsh. ninja
@ marsh: You do have a good point, but what if the government doesn't sentence the killer or rapist to death like the victim wants, what then?
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Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 9:54 am
Aakiyana band4ever101 Better that I have a reading problem than an ignorance one. Feel free to keep your same views...I can't take them away. But whatever...If you want them to stay locked away they might as well be killed. As anyone who's sat on death row for 35+ years, they would most likely rather be dead than continue to stay locked up without a fate. I agree with Marsh. ninja
@ marsh: You do have a good point, but what if the government doesn't sentence the killer or rapist to death like the victim wants, what then?
Ok ok. So ignorance was the wrong word. I just dont see how your point makes sense. If they would rather be dead, why not kill them. They are taking up space and crowding prisions all around America. If they killed someone...they deserve to die as well. Prisions are crowded because we are putting people on death row for 35+ years. Why do that? I just don't see where you are coming from.
I just believe if you kill someone, you deserve to die. Because you killed someone, so obviously you didn't care about yourself or the family of the person you killed. So why should anyone care about you. I didn't mention this above, but I just thought of this. Some people kill in defense, in that case I don't know what I would say..cause if someone was trying to kill me, I would try to kill them. I guess that makes sense, cause you are defending your own life.
<3
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Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 8:11 pm
What I'm arguing is that death is the easy way out. I mean if I killed a 100 people, I'd want to die rather than suffer anyway, especially if the government is just gonna put me down like a sick dog. Prisons wouldn't be overcrowded if we stopped just putting people in there to sit. We should make them do something, punish them, I mean that's the whole point of the sentencing right?
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Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 8:15 am
Yes, but it is much easier to kill them. Get a gun and line them up. What your talking about costs money and time. And it is so much easier to punish them, by giving them a violent death like their victims.
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Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 4:16 pm
Alright. So, I know I'm going to get some hate for this...
Taking from the first post, Aaklyana had said something about making the guilty person suffer terribly and hope for death. I don't remember exactly where I read that from, but I know I read it. Now here's my theory about punishing do-badders and worse.
The punishment should not be equal to the crime; it should be marginally worse. To explain the meaning of this I'll first give some examples.
George commits the crime of robbery and injures a house owner in the process. It goes down as attempted murder, and he's sentenced. When in captivity, his meals should be sparse. None of this getting McDonald's and homecooked meals bullshit. They should get tiny portions of salad, bread, and water with occasional meat. Just enough to keep them alive. There should be no exercise, no entertainment. The only time he leaves his cell is for his weekly beatings, his biyearly haircut, and the rare trip to the doctors to check on his health. When I say beatings, I mean it to refer to more than physical abuse. You've got to punish the mind as well, otherwise what's the use?
As the crime becomes worse, so should the punishments. Assault with deadly weapon, murder, manslaughter, etc. should all be severely punished. The jailee should be dragged out of his cell twice a day to receive heavy beatings coupled with mind games. He should eventually be at the point where he apologizes and means it; he'll be a broken man. Only then should we kill him; when he's just a shell of a human being.
The longest they'd stay in captivity shouldn't be more than a year, and that's for the very strong ones. Most men would break within six months. Don't be fooled by my usage of male terms; the same should go for women. They're just as strong, if not stronger. Rape should not be used, however, as punishment. That would be giving the guard too much.
I know this sounds really severe, but it's a good idea if we were able to balance things out. The only problem with this idea is that we as humans tend to go overboard; in no time the guards would become sadistic to the point of overkill. We would need something like robots to man the prisons.
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Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:04 am
Wow. You people are incredibly cruel. I wouldn't be surprised if you all lived in Texas.
Just so you all know, Texas convicts more people than any other state and also puts more people to death than most states combined. In the past 24 years, Texas has executed almost 400 people. The largest percentage was done under W, unsurprisingly, at 131 people being put to death in just five years. Bush was also responsible for sending several people with the mental proficiency of small children to death for crimes they didn't even understand. There have also been many cases of forced untrue testimonies, fabricated evidence and coerced juries to get convictions--and not just in Texas. Bush even mocked someone who had begged for clemency. She didn't even beg to be freed, just to not be put to death and Bush literally mocked her in an interview.
Texas is just the worst of the worst in the states. Other states are bad, but no one so bad as Texas.
Here's just one of hundreds of articles about the inhumanity:
http://www.commondreams.org/views/061700-102.htm (full article)
(Original) http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F30816FF3D550C748DDDAF0894D8404482
Even if someone else takes a life, it doesn't give anyone the right to take theirs. Once they're incapacitated, they're not a threat. Revenge is not the answer; rehabilitation is.
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Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:22 am
So you like the current system. It has been working so well, hasn't it? With all the repeat offenders and all.
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Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:29 am
Against the death penalty myself.
It seems rather redundant.
Kill those who kill? I think there is a better way to teach people than that.
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Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:16 pm
marshjazz So you like the current system. It has been working so well, hasn't it? With all the repeat offenders and all. No. If you had read the post, you would have seen that I was attacking the current system for being overly cruel and ineffectual. We do not have rehabilitation. We are on a deterrent system. As I said at the end of my post, I believe in rehabilitation.
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Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:24 pm
nosh276 Wow. You people are incredibly cruel. I wouldn't be surprised if you all lived in Texas. Just so you all know, Texas convicts more people than any other state and also puts more people to death than most states combined. In the past 24 years, Texas has executed almost 400 people. The largest percentage was done under W, unsurprisingly, at 131 people being put to death in just five years. Bush was also responsible for sending several people with the mental proficiency of small children to death for crimes they didn't even understand. There have also been many cases of forced untrue testimonies, fabricated evidence and coerced juries to get convictions--and not just in Texas. Bush even mocked someone who had begged for clemency. She didn't even beg to be freed, just to not be put to death and Bush literally mocked her in an interview. Texas is just the worst of the worst in the states. Other states are bad, but no one so bad as Texas. Here's just one of hundreds of articles about the inhumanity: http://www.commondreams.org/views/061700-102.htm (full article) (Original) http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F30816FF3D550C748DDDAF0894D8404482 About the rehabilitation comment. You can't change someone who isn't willing to change. And most aren't. They are the ones who go out and become repeat offenders. Some are willing...but most aren't. <3 Even if someone else takes a life, it doesn't give anyone the right to take theirs. Once they're incapacitated, they're not a threat. Revenge is not the answer; rehabilitation is.
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Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:29 pm
band4ever101 About the rehabilitation comment. You can't change someone who isn't willing to change. And most aren't. They are the ones who go out and become repeat offenders. Some are willing...but most aren't. <3 If rehabilitation is not possible, then they should remain in prison for life, but not to be killed. The death penalty is as bad as murder. For the record, I support educating prisoners as well as compulsory labor. Every prisoner should have a "9-5" job within the prison. They should work six days a week for free with 7 vacation days including national holidays. Sick days should be taken out of the vacation days. Prisons should have products that are produced from local materials, then sold nationally, if not internationally as well. All profits will go toward the costs of running a prison. If all costs are met, the profits then will be used to assist in the funding of public education and public works projects (such as bulding or repairing roads or building parks). All prisoners will be required to go to weekly therapy and rehabilitation work shops. With this system, criminals are no longer a threat to society. Since they've gained an education, therapy and rehabilitation (in every case possible), they can, upon release, become productive, peaceful, free members of society. If rehabilitation fails and their sentence is finished, they will relocated to a new city, set up with a group home and have daily meetings with a parole officer. If the prisoner shows signs of rehabilitation after 6 months, the meetings will be reduced to twice a week. After another six months, once a week. After a year, once a month. After two years, once every three months. After this final transition, if the convict has continuously shown signs of progressing rehabilitation, then they will only have to meet with a parole officer once a year for the next nine years. After that, if they've only shown improvement, they will be let go. If they become a repeat offender, their original sentence is doubled or tripled depending on the severity of the crime. Rape and Murder criminals get life in prison no matter what. Women can be convicted of rape. If signs of rehabilitation are never shown, they will be returned to the prison to work indefinitely--until signs of rehabilitation (if these appear, they will join the parole program) or natural death. They will continue weekly therapy and rehabilitation training. Those in the parole program also will have to go to a once weekly support group meeting for convicts for the entirety of their parole and they must complete two hundred hours, over the entire course of parole, of unpaid volunteer work. That's what I want.
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