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lymelady
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:44 pm


Less children to take up resources means more resources for the children left. So that's pro-child.

Many believe that as a species we've reached our carrying capacity.


Oh, and of course, all of these children will be wanted...except for the ones whose mothers decide after birth, I don't want to be a mother! And then go on to beat those children.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:42 am


Pyrotechnic Oracle
Smothering it would seem. I'm sure the choicers once they read this will be bussy searchign all their sources to try and debunk on.


*raises hand*

A) the woman had the right to schedual the abortion.

B) The Clinic personel were doing wrong if they killed it AFTER it was born alive. (notice how the article states this is being assessed?)

C) I feel sorry for the woman who had to give birth to the child she didn't want.

D) I think the article said that she went for an abortion, and it must have not worked or something cus it said she came in later complaining of pain, why would she return complaining of pain if she knew she hadn't aborted? wouldn't she have then gone to the hospital thinking "AIYAH baby's dropping!" She must have thought something went wrong with the abortion or somthing *shrug* least thats how I'm reading it, it really makes little sense elswise.

*points to the above post that considers the weight and time*

Not the womans fault people, clinic, evil clinic. Now if Clinics wern't so protested about they could be better monitored and things like this might become figments of the past.

After all if they are sactioned under scrutiny you really can easily control when and why things happen, and proceedures. Right now the only clinics are private due to all the protest, which means the gov has limited control over them as far as regulating them for humane actions, such as saving this baby.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:45 am


lymelady
...except for the ones whose mothers decide after birth, I don't want to be a mother! And then go on to beat those children.


I thought pro-life meant the woman couldn't decide until after birth? I agree beating is bad.

[Edit: the above is asking for clarity of the statement made.]
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:58 am


lymelady
She didn't abort. She had a baby and dumped it in the trash.

But she's still being labeled as Pro-choice. It's...a little too nasty for my tastes.


This may just be me, but I doubt any Pro-choicer would agree with killing the child after it was born.

Pro-Choice isn't "Pro Abort" or even "Anti having a baby" or "Anti motherhood" I would ask you to kindly stop confusing the term. Pro Choice means we simply support women having the OPTION to abort available to them should they need/want to. If they abort, *shrug* fine by us, if they keep it? Still fine by us.

In this case the woman did choose to abort, obviously didn't (which was more than likely out of her hands), and thus we have a dead baby.

Imagine if the doctor lied to her, saying she had aborted, but really the doctor didn't do the operation. I see that as a potentially great crime there.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 6:57 am


Quote:
Not the womans fault people, clinic, evil clinic. Now if Clinics wern't so protested about they could be better monitored and things like this might become figments of the past.

Oh, I see. So you're trying to turn this whole thing around and make the death of a child the fault of the pro-lifers?

You seem to be saying "If you guys didn't protest so much, the clinics would be better!" when in fact we protest because the clinics are doing an awful thing by being in existence in the first place.

Anyone who chooses to have an abortion should know there are JUST as many risks as in pregnancy.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 6:59 am


she was still wrong to get an abortion that late in her pregnancy, so really that argument about it being the doctor's fault dosen't matter at all.

andyz cool


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 7:12 am


Faeyas
lymelady
She didn't abort. She had a baby and dumped it in the trash.

But she's still being labeled as Pro-choice. It's...a little too nasty for my tastes.


This may just be me, but I doubt any Pro-choicer would agree with killing the child after it was born.


Except those ones who think that no human being really ever deserves their life, because humans are worthless creatures.

And yes, that's an almost exact quote.


Quote:
Pro-Choice isn't "Pro Abort" or even "Anti having a baby" or "Anti motherhood" I would ask you to kindly stop confusing the term. Pro Choice means we simply support women having the OPTION to abort available to them should they need/want to. If they abort, *shrug* fine by us, if they keep it? Still fine by us.


The problem with that is that you think that it's okay for a woman to kill her child, as long as it's young enough so that you don't have to feel bad about it, and that doesn't seem fair to me to take advantage of a young human being like that, simply because you don't believe it should be classified as one.

And I wouldn't be one to talk about using certain terms. I've explained SEVERAL times why pro-life doesn't mean anti-woman, and I'm still called anti-woman. And anti-choice, for that matter.

I don't think pro-choice means "Babies suck!", but I DO think that pro-choice dehumanizes a human being, because you're saying "Sure, kill it if you want to, and if you don't want to, that's cool too."

A decision like that seems too casual, considering in one of those decisions, a human dies.


Quote:
In this case the woman did choose to abort, obviously didn't (which was more than likely out of her hands), and thus we have a dead baby.

Imagine if the doctor lied to her, saying she had aborted, but really the doctor didn't do the operation. I see that as a potentially great crime there.


Oh, crap, you're SO right. Then a woman would have had to have had a child, and someone would be alive, rather than dead.

That is QUITE an atroscity, indeed.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 8:45 am


Quote:
This may just be me, but I doubt any Pro-choicer would agree with killing the child after it was born.
Wrong. Lyme can tell you a feel stories about this one.

Quote:
Pro-Choice isn't "Pro Abort" or even "Anti having a baby" or "Anti motherhood" I would ask you to kindly stop confusing the term. Pro Choice means we simply support women having the OPTION to abort available to them should they need/want to. If they abort, *shrug* fine by us, if they keep it? Still fine by us.
Do you support the legalisation of abortion? The you are pro-abortion.

Quote:
In this case the woman did choose to abort, obviously didn't (which was more than likely out of her hands), and thus we have a dead baby.
And it obviously seems like you don't care. If the child is, for any reason, born alive it is required by law that the cinic notify the nearest medical authorities.

Quote:
Imagine if the doctor lied to her, saying she had aborted, but really the doctor didn't do the operation. I see that as a potentially great crime there.


Hey, guess what. The child may have been born alivea dnthen smothered with a bio-bag. It already is a potential great crime.

But yes, her giving birth to a live human being who can hopefully gorw up loved by his mother, or loved by people who want him, or at the very least gorw up and experince life and make his own choices would be a terrible crime!

Tiger of the Fire


DCVI
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 8:46 am


Quote:
This may just be me, but I doubt any Pro-choicer would agree with killing the child after it was born.

It is just you. I know choicers who have little respect for infants. If abortion went out the window they'd support infantacide. I have heard the words, I have seen the sentence.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 8:48 am


Faeyas
lymelady
...except for the ones whose mothers decide after birth, I don't want to be a mother! And then go on to beat those children.


I thought pro-life meant the woman couldn't decide until after birth? I agree beating is bad.

[Edit: the above is asking for clarity of the statement made.]


Nope. Pro-life means that we belive that a human is a perosn through all stages of human life and shoudl be protected in the womb, a woman should be held responcible for the life of the child if she willingly consented to sex and that obtions for abortion shoudl not be made legally available to her, and that society shoudl change and adjust to give a little more help to woman who are pregnant as oppsed to tellign them they're gogin to fail at life if they don't kill. We are in no way against her decisions to obtain an abortion by other methods.

Tiger of the Fire


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 8:52 am


Faeyas

*points to the above post that considers the weight and time*

Not the womans fault people, clinic, evil clinic. Now if Clinics wern't so protested about they could be better monitored and things like this might become figments of the past.


Its being asessed, and its a possability. One I'm not willign to rule out and nore are they. Thats why they are assessing it.

Yes, lets make things the pro-lifers fault. As its the only thing most choicers know how to do these days. Lets make it the fault of the lifers instead of concidering it could be your own stances fault.

We want to make all legally sanctiona abortions a thing of the past.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:39 am


Faeyas
lymelady
...except for the ones whose mothers decide after birth, I don't want to be a mother! And then go on to beat those children.


I thought pro-life meant the woman couldn't decide until after birth? I agree beating is bad.

[Edit: the above is asking for clarity of the statement made.]
I believe she's commenting on how Pro-Choice devalues motherhood and children, stating that, if you don't want to be a mother, even if you are pregnant, you don't have to. So, if they decide a few years after birth that they didn't want to be mothers after all... *shrug*

Because, "I should have aborted you!" isn't really something that Pro-Lifers can say.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:08 am


Mcphee
Faeyas
lymelady
She didn't abort. She had a baby and dumped it in the trash.

But she's still being labeled as Pro-choice. It's...a little too nasty for my tastes.


This may just be me, but I doubt any Pro-choicer would agree with killing the child after it was born.


Except those ones who think that no human being really ever deserves their life, because humans are worthless creatures.

And yes, that's an almost exact quote.


Quote:
Pro-Choice isn't "Pro Abort" or even "Anti having a baby" or "Anti motherhood" I would ask you to kindly stop confusing the term. Pro Choice means we simply support women having the OPTION to abort available to them should they need/want to. If they abort, *shrug* fine by us, if they keep it? Still fine by us.


The problem with that is that you think that it's okay for a woman to kill her child, as long as it's young enough so that you don't have to feel bad about it, and that doesn't seem fair to me to take advantage of a young human being like that, simply because you don't believe it should be classified as one.

And I wouldn't be one to talk about using certain terms. I've explained SEVERAL times why pro-life doesn't mean anti-woman, and I'm still called anti-woman. And anti-choice, for that matter.

I don't think pro-choice means "Babies suck!", but I DO think that pro-choice dehumanizes a human being, because you're saying "Sure, kill it if you want to, and if you don't want to, that's cool too."

A decision like that seems too casual, considering in one of those decisions, a human dies.


Quote:
In this case the woman did choose to abort, obviously didn't (which was more than likely out of her hands), and thus we have a dead baby.

Imagine if the doctor lied to her, saying she had aborted, but really the doctor didn't do the operation. I see that as a potentially great crime there.


Oh, crap, you're SO right. Then a woman would have had to have had a child, and someone would be alive, rather than dead.

That is QUITE an atroscity, indeed.

Adrian, you're starting to sound so much like me, it's scary. XD
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 4:40 pm


MiNdCaNdY
she was still wrong to get an abortion that late in her pregnancy, so really that argument about it being the doctor's fault dosen't matter at all.

I don't want to argue, as this is in no way the place for it. But I figure that sharing information should be ok.

In Florida, elective abortion is legal until 24 weeks. This women claimed to be at 22 weeks, though her baby weighed 2 to 3 pounds (I guess they aren't sure of the exact weight?) and most 22 week old fetii weigh only 1 pound. So this woman might have been at or even over the limit.

Also, this isn't the only Florida abortion clinic that has had problems. I would blame the clinics themselves for this issue, not protesters or any other political group. However, the new footage (from the article - all of this is from there) did state that some clinic workers did help authorities recover this poor baby, while others made the authorities search harder.

Just so that anyone who didn't want to or couldn't watch the new footage can see the story they said. Anyone who doesn't trust me (and I can't blame you if you don't) can watch the footage from the link on the first page.

WatersMoon110
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lymelady
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 6:11 pm


You're right. The other clinic having trouble had the same owner, too.

My personal belief? This woman was well over 22 weeks pregnant, over 24 weeks pregnant, even. The size certainly is more consistant with 28-30 weeks. That's illegal except for health or life saving purposes, in Florida. If this was the case, it wouldn't have been in their interests to call an ambulance if the child had a survival chance, because then the clinic might have been shut down for performing an abortion so late.

I haven't confirmed yet, but I've seen people mention that the Florida Abortion Council successfully blocked it when the state tried to regulate abortion clinics, back in the 1980's. Does anyone know anything about that?
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The Pro-life Guild

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