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 Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:25 pm
Fushigi na Butterfly See, the thing is, sex is a very large component to BDSM, but it's really more than kinky sex. If a sub were to ask their dom if they could go out with friends later, the dom would have every right to tell them no and the sub couldn't do anything about it. BDSM at its deepest level invades every aspect of a person's lifestyle. The sub becomes completely dependent upon their dom, which, staying within the lines of the BDSM community, has every right to punish, deny, and demean their sub. This is not a standard BDSM relationship. Of course anything taken to an extreme is bad for you. The Mainstream BDSM community places a high priority on the safety of all parties involved. Safety in BDSMQuote: An anecdote to illustrate: The girl I spoke with told me about her friend who suffered from sever asthma attacks. He and his boyfriend were a BDSM couple. His dom systematically found out what triggered his sub's asthma attacks by causing them, and then would take him home and beat him whenever he forgot any of those triggers. That's not BDSM, that's domestic abuse. Quote: And this is perfectly condoned by the BDSM community. No, it's not. The BDSM Community practices what is known as SSC that would prohibit any such actions. Quote: How does this fit in with the way God says a relationship should be? The things you have said don't. However, the majority of BDSM would fall in the religious category of 'whatever floats your boat'. It's not condemned in the Bible (nor is it talked about at all), so as long as it doesn't violate and specific biblical commandments (love your spouse would be a primary one), than it is perfectly acceptable in the eyes of G-d.
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Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:29 pm
Fushigi na Butterfly As far as the sub agreeing to anything, that's not true. I mean, I guess it is. They agree to anything the dom says simply by entering a relationship with them. The dom doesn't ask permission; the dom just does and if the sub doesn't like it then too bad. In a BDSM relationship, as with any relationship, either party can end it at any time. Quote: Alot of what BDSM couples do would go against basic human rights in the eyes of larger society. No, not really. It's all consensual and its rarely, if ever, actually dangerous in any way. It's just different.
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Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:31 pm
Talmar_Star_Blood Tell me, to who are you talking? Because if you mean all of us, I didn't see your post, where is it? You and Lethkar. And anyone else who joined in the conversation. I didn't really look at the names, just what was in the post. If you want to talk about torture or slavery, make your own thread. ~Cometh the Inquisitor
Crew Member of Unashamed
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Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 4:27 am
Lethkhar Precisely, although I think you're sort of making BDSM sound like it has some kind of doctrine or system of government...Which is false as far as I know... Lethkhar But the point is that the "sub" does have a choice. Sure, they may be giving their will to the "dom", but the "dom" doesn't really have it since they can stop at any time. It's more or less a form of roleplaying. Everything that the "sub" does is by their choice. They are choosing to obey the "dom"; no one is forcing them to obey. Lethkhar That's not true. If the "sub" doesn't like what the "dom" is doing, they have every right to end it. The "dom" has limitations, and if they don't realise those guidelines then the relationship will be very short-lived indeed. Lethkhar But the "sub" is consenting to "abuse". It's their choice. This does not violate basic human rights because any pain that is suffered is desired. The "sub" is not being forced into the relationship. It is completely their decisiona and completely their will that they be "abused".
Sub's friends: We're calling the police.
Sub: Why?
Friends: He took you home and smacked you around a bit for talking to someone without his permission.
Sub: But I deserved it.
Friends: No one deserves that; you're in an abusive relationship and we're calling the police.
In the eyes of the two people in the relationship, everything is okay, but to everyone else it's totally wrong. Do they have the right to get involved for their friend's sake? Whose rules do you abide by? Those of the BDSM community or those of the larger society?
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 4:32 am
Cometh The Inquisitor This is not a standard BDSM relationship. Of course anything taken to an extreme is bad for you. The Mainstream BDSM community places a high priority on the safety of all parties involved. Safety in BDSMCometh The Inquisitor That's not BDSM, that's domestic abuse. Cometh The Inquisitor The things you have said don't. However, the majority of BDSM would fall in the religious category of 'whatever floats your boat'. It's not condemned in the Bible (nor is it talked about at all), so as long as it doesn't violate and specific biblical commandments (love your spouse would be a primary one), than it is perfectly acceptable in the eyes of G-d.
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Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:19 am
Fushigi na Butterfly Oh, without a doubt they do. But there is a very grey area between what is within and what is outside the boundaries of abuse.ANd that grey area is for each specific couple to decide upon. Not us. Quote: But it was consensual. The sub allowed it and felt that it was his position to endure it.No, thats still domestic abuse. Triggering an asthma attack can have harmful, and, in some cases, even fatal effects. This particular situation goes far beyond the 'grey area' of whats allowable. Quote: Right; if you love your partner by slapping them around a bit (and they seriously have no problem with this) then I guess it's okay, right? Basically. A lot of people have different ways of showing love. An example of 'standard' variations is that some people are more tactilely affectionate and others are more verbal. In an M/s relationship, its just a non-standard way of showing love.
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Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:31 pm
Hey, Inquisitor, in one of your posts, you used the word 'G-d,' and you ommited the 'o.' Are you Messianic? Because I've only seen Jews or Messianics do that. Just wondering.
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Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:39 pm
Fushigi na Butterfly Except in the eyes of the larger society. Sure, it's perfectly okay between the couple but outsiders don't see it the same as they do.
Sub's friends: We're calling the police.
Sub: Why?
Friends: He took you home and smacked you around a bit for talking to someone without his permission.
Sub: But I deserved it.
Friends: No one deserves that; you're in an abusive relationship and we're calling the police.
In the eyes of the two people in the relationship, everything is okay, but to everyone else it's totally wrong. Do they have the right to get involved for their friend's sake? Whose rules do you abide by? Those of the BDSM community or those of the larger society? I will admit that your point is valid. However, as a Social Libertarian myself I believe that as long as every single action that takes place is under the consent of all parties involved that it is perfectly fine. I see no reason to infringe on someone's will to harm themselves. However, I can see why someone would think differently. Again, these are really just my personaly politics coming into play here.
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:11 am
Cometh The Inquisitor No, thats still domestic abuse. Triggering an asthma attack can have harmful, and, in some cases, even fatal effects. This particular situation goes far beyond the 'grey area' of whats allowable. Cometh The Inquisitor Basically. A lot of people have different ways of showing love. An example of 'standard' variations is that some people are more tactilely affectionate and others are more verbal. In an M/s relationship, its just a non-standard way of showing love.
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Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:56 pm
Talmar_Star_Blood Hey, Inquisitor, in one of your posts, you used the word 'G-d,' and you ommited the 'o.' Are you Messianic? Because I've only seen Jews or Messianics do that. Just wondering. I'm not personally a messianic, but I did pick it up from one, because I thought it was a rather interesting way of showing respect for G-d's name.
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Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 12:57 pm
Quote: Ah, about this, I forgot to mention there was a point to systematically triggering his asthma attacks; he did it so that he could avoid those triggers. So there was a good reason. Is this still domestic abuse? wait.... what?
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Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:34 am
The reason that my friend's friend would systematically trigger his partner's asthma attacks was so they could discover what those triggers were. He would have asthma attacks and didn't know what the triggers were, so his partner went through and did all sorts of things to cause him to have asthma attacks in order for him to avoid them in the future, but whenever he forgot one of them, he would get a little roughed up.
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 1:03 pm
Fushigi na Butterfly The reason that my friend's friend would systematically trigger his partner's asthma attacks was so they could discover what those triggers were. He would have asthma attacks and didn't know what the triggers were, so his partner went through and did all sorts of things to cause him to have asthma attacks in order for him to avoid them in the future, but whenever he forgot one of them, he would get a little roughed up. Well, thats just basic safety, than.
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Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 4:48 pm
I'm not sure if I've said this before or not, but I'll say it anyways.
This is just like Christianity. There are always misunderstandings based on publicized followers who do things wrong.
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Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:44 am
I see no reason why consensual and safe BDSM would be wrong in God's eyes.
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