Could we make ranking up in the guild more easily accessible? A great deal of the guild's features are locked off until higher ranks, and yet the climb to these ranks feel like massive chores. To get to chuunin from genin takes 7500 mission points, which is colossal amount of mission points when you consider that into consideration that a D-ranked mission only rewards 150 mission points. Furthermore, a D-ranked mission is the highest ranking mission a genin is allowed to embark on. If an rpc were only to do D-ranked missions in order to rank up, then they would need to complete fifty missions. And since each mission requires four to six post, you're literally looking at over hundreds of paragraphs written.
I know this guild also provides ac rewards in terms of chuunin exams and special village ordeals. According to the ac system, however, an rpc should reasonably be able to get all of the mission points they require without the intervention of another character. I think we can all agree 50 D-ranked missions is not reasonable. If we could lower this to 2500 for chuunin, and then maybe lower the other ranks too, then this would make the guild function much easier for newer rpcs. I'm not saying you should make it so that an rpc can become sannin rank without two weeks of activity, but I'm also saying that within two weeks of activity I shouldn't still be below 1/4th of the amount of ac I require for my rpc's first rank up.
AandOE
XAyame_HatakeX
Ergo War
Azeiel The Risen
Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:02 am
Mattysandwich
Could we make ranking up in the guild more easily accessible? A great deal of the guild's features are locked off until higher ranks, and yet the climb to these ranks feel like massive chores. To get to chuunin from genin takes 7500 mission points, which is colossal amount of mission points when you consider that into consideration that a D-ranked mission only rewards 150 mission points. Furthermore, a D-ranked mission is the highest ranking mission a genin is allowed to embark on. If an rpc were only to do D-ranked missions in order to rank up, then they would need to complete fifty missions. And since each mission requires four to six post, you're literally looking at over hundreds of paragraphs written.
I know this guild also provides ac rewards in terms of chuunin exams and special village ordeals. According to the ac system, however, an rpc should reasonably be able to get all of the mission points they require without the intervention of another character. I think we can all agree 50 D-ranked missions is not reasonable. If we could lower this to 2500 for chuunin, and then maybe lower the other ranks too, then this would make the guild function much easier for newer rpcs. I'm not saying you should make it so that an rpc can become sannin rank without two weeks of activity, but I'm also saying that within two weeks of activity I shouldn't still be below 1/4th of the amount of ac I require for my rpc's first rank up.
AandOE
XAyame_HatakeX
Ergo War
Azeiel The Risen
Just as a quick hint, D-rank are not the highest ranking jutsu you can embark on as a gennin. They are the highest rank you can do on your own without kage approval, but going to the kage or ultimately an NPC at the office will give you higher ranking missions to do. I think the highest rank you're allowed to do that way is a B-rank mission, the same as your jutsu rank cap.
Could we make ranking up in the guild more easily accessible? A great deal of the guild's features are locked off until higher ranks, and yet the climb to these ranks feel like massive chores. To get to chuunin from genin takes 7500 mission points, which is colossal amount of mission points when you consider that into consideration that a D-ranked mission only rewards 150 mission points. Furthermore, a D-ranked mission is the highest ranking mission a genin is allowed to embark on. If an rpc were only to do D-ranked missions in order to rank up, then they would need to complete fifty missions. And since each mission requires four to six post, you're literally looking at over hundreds of paragraphs written.
I know this guild also provides ac rewards in terms of chuunin exams and special village ordeals. According to the ac system, however, an rpc should reasonably be able to get all of the mission points they require without the intervention of another character. I think we can all agree 50 D-ranked missions is not reasonable. If we could lower this to 2500 for chuunin, and then maybe lower the other ranks too, then this would make the guild function much easier for newer rpcs. I'm not saying you should make it so that an rpc can become sannin rank without two weeks of activity, but I'm also saying that within two weeks of activity I shouldn't still be below 1/4th of the amount of ac I require for my rpc's first rank up.
AandOE
XAyame_HatakeX
Ergo War
Azeiel The Risen
I completely agree with this suggestion. I have been posting every day in this guild since May and I am not even close to becoming a Chunin. I do love that this guild is cautious about promoting people and has done very well to avoid favoritism. You have to work hard for your characters to see the benefit and I admire that spirit about Shinobi Nations. I do believe that there are limits and that the current layout to advance ranks is just too hard. I am a very active member of this guild and I feel like I am not being rewarded for participating. Every village has numerous Genin who try to rank up but get bored with cutting grass and then go inactive. That is not a healthy situation for the guild in the slightest. I think it would be advantageous for the entire roleplay to lighten the AC requirement load.
With that being said, I want to thank you mods for all of the work you put in for this roleplay experience and hearing out our input. Please consider this feedback carefully as you always do.
Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:13 am
I Tortured Sleep I
Just as a quick hint, D-rank are not the highest ranking jutsu you can embark on as a gennin. They are the highest rank you can do on your own without kage approval, but going to the kage or ultimately an NPC at the office will give you higher ranking missions to do. I think the highest rank you're allowed to do that way is a B-rank mission, the same as your jutsu rank cap.
Good point! While it is true that Genin can do up to B-Rank missions with Kage approval, I have been dreading having to grind missions because, frankly, missions should be done for character development and enjoyment in addition to promotion. I would be happy if there were more guild story arcs and events that could reward my character with enough AC to advance while still having a good time. Posting in Shinobi Nations should not have to feel like work, but I am willing to apply myself and have shown that through my activity. I think many others with new characters feel similarly.
Could we make ranking up in the guild more easily accessible? A great deal of the guild's features are locked off until higher ranks, and yet the climb to these ranks feel like massive chores. To get to chuunin from genin takes 7500 mission points, which is colossal amount of mission points when you consider that into consideration that a D-ranked mission only rewards 150 mission points. Furthermore, a D-ranked mission is the highest ranking mission a genin is allowed to embark on. If an rpc were only to do D-ranked missions in order to rank up, then they would need to complete fifty missions. And since each mission requires four to six post, you're literally looking at over hundreds of paragraphs written.
I know this guild also provides ac rewards in terms of chuunin exams and special village ordeals. According to the ac system, however, an rpc should reasonably be able to get all of the mission points they require without the intervention of another character. I think we can all agree 50 D-ranked missions is not reasonable. If we could lower this to 2500 for chuunin, and then maybe lower the other ranks too, then this would make the guild function much easier for newer rpcs. I'm not saying you should make it so that an rpc can become sannin rank without two weeks of activity, but I'm also saying that within two weeks of activity I shouldn't still be below 1/4th of the amount of ac I require for my rpc's first rank up.
AandOE
XAyame_HatakeX
Ergo War
Azeiel The Risen
Just as a quick hint, D-rank are not the highest ranking jutsu you can embark on as a gennin. They are the highest rank you can do on your own without kage approval, but going to the kage or ultimately an NPC at the office will give you higher ranking missions to do. I think the highest rank you're allowed to do that way is a B-rank mission, the same as your jutsu rank cap.
Good point! While it is true that Genin can do up to B-Rank missions with Kage approval, I have been dreading having to grind missions because, frankly, missions should be done for character development and enjoyment in addition to promotion. I would be happy if there were more guild story arcs and events that could reward my character with enough AC to advance while still having a good time. Posting in Shinobi Nations should not have to feel like work, but I am willing to apply myself and have shown that through my activity. I think many others with new characters feel similarly.
Yeah. The crappy thing is I've seen both ways not work. I know originally the rank was raised because people would burn through a few missions and rank up like you wouldn't believe, and that's not how that should go. You shouldn't be able to go from Genin to chuunin in a week, or even in a month. I can understand not liking the grind, I absolutely hate it. But ultimately, you can both get character development in and work your way up.
I've also seen it where, the cap was lowered and storyline was prioritized, but in order to do it they capped how many missions you could do a day and people get bored that way too. In situations like this, there's really no win. Either people get bored, or people burn through missions and rank up wayyyy to freaking fast. I would be interested though, to see if they changed the way stuff works. The AC to reach chuunin was raised recently, like within the past year. I'm eager to see he crew's response.
Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:26 am
B-ranked missions give 500 mission points. Even if a genin does 10 of them they still wouldn't be high enough rank for Chuunin. Furthermore, to get permission for these missions requires your village kage, which cannot always be relied upon. I also don't know what a village npc is, but if it's also something kage controlled then it cannot be relied upon as a solid means of ranking up.
I also agree with Kumurai on two counts. The first is that missions should not have to feel like a chore. A lot of these missions are generic, and hold no relevance to the rpc who participates within them. Yes a talented rpcer can make anything turn into a story for their character, but at the end of the day why should the grind be so steep? I also respect his point that this is in part created so that you're not spammed with new and high ranking ninjas which could otherwise prove to be a challenge to the stability of the roleplay. But a better balance has to be brought between these two extremes.
I appreciate your response Soul, and I can see that in the past this has been an issue. But I argue that within a month's time of active roleplaying, you should be able to get chuunin. That's not unreasonable in my mind. Do you at least see the value in that?
I Tortured Sleep I
Apologies for the double quote. Wanted to clean this up better.
Unfortunately, the truth of the matter is that if someone put their mind to it they could go from Genin to Sannin in a few weeks by spamming missions. It is an inevitability and impossible to completely regulate a roleplayer's behavior. This is an issue that is very difficult to balance and I can understand that because it is such a foundational system for the roleplay with big consequences. As it stands, I think the requirements are just too high. It feels as if I am being punished for having a new character. I do not think this is an either or where it has to be too hard or it might be too easy for power players.
I agree with Matty's point that completely relying on another person in order to be ranked up in a reasonable amount of time is not a good idea.
Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:36 am
100% with Mattysandwich on this one. It would be nice to have more Chuunin and Jounin in our villages to tutor and train and bond with new genin, and would be beneficial for squads as well.
B-ranked missions give 500 mission points. Even if a genin does 10 of them they still wouldn't be high enough rank for Chuunin. Furthermore, to get permission for these missions requires your village kage, which cannot always be relied upon. I also don't know what a village npc is, but if it's also something kage controlled then it cannot be relied upon as a solid means of ranking up.
I also agree with Kumurai on two counts. The first is that missions should not have to feel like a chore. A lot of these missions are generic, and hold no relevance to the rpc who participates within them. Yes a talented rpcer can make anything turn into a story for their character, but at the end of the day why should the grind be so steep? I also respect his point that this is in part created so that you're not spammed with new and high ranking ninjas which could otherwise prove to be a challenge to the stability of the roleplay. But a better balance has to be brought between these two extremes.
I appreciate your response Soul, and I can see that in the past this has been an issue. But I argue that within a month's time of active roleplaying, you should be able to get chuunin. That's not unreasonable in my mind. Do you at least see the value in that?
Of course I see the value in that, I never said I didn't. But I think you're underestimating how long it should take to become chuunin. In the series it took literal years for anyone to get a rank up, other than shikamaru who was a freaking genius. What is a rank worth if you don't work for it? And even if you got the AC for chuunin fast enough, lets say they did lower the rank cap, you still don't get chuunin immediately. Ultimately, it is always the kage's decision for a title rank up . Body ranks are immediate, but not title ranks.
It ultimately is starting to sound like you have a problem with the responsive time of the kages, and I encourage you to talk to these people about it. A village NPC can be pretty much controlled by any other crew member, even one of the more active ones, and is a way to act when kages are busy with life stuff ( which a majority of them are ). You have to make an effort for these ranks, which was originally the plan. I don't think the crew wants just anyone to come in, do a few missions for a month, become a chuunin and get a squad, and then decide they're bored now or don't know what they're doing and now we've got a useless chuunin with no battle experience fiddlig their fingers. I understand the frustration, I do. It took me a literal year to get my gennin to chuunin, not only because of the grind but because of life stuff getting in the way for me. I was a B-rank body before I ever got my chuunin rank up. I'm not trying to discourage you here, only try to get you to see that these ranks are something you're supposed to earn. They aren't a right.
Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:02 am
I actually want to challenge that thought that within a few weeks you could get from genin to sannin in this guild currently. As it stands, the lowest post count mission on the D-list rank which rewards AC is four post. A post in this guild is a paragraph. Therefore, the lowest amount of work required to receive a D-ranked mission is still four paragraphs. That means if you only did the lowest amount of words per reward missions, then you would still need to write two hundred paragraphs in order to have enough AC to be chuunin. I don't believe that you could spam that out within a few weeks, and that would only get you to chuunin.
Now to your point, Tortured, yes in the series chuunin was not an easy obstacle. But first of all, aren't we a non-canon guild? Second of all, this guild doesn't have any time skips or guild resets which would progress time, making that point completely invalid. As it stands the rpcs who have been teenagers when they began, by the majority, are still teenagers. That's why my current Kage is I think nineteen years old? To your point they clearly did not train years in roleplay, but they had the points (through guild activities and years of activity) and thus were ranked up. Thirdly, a rank up in this guild gives you access to more jobs, more freedom, and more opportunities. If the cap when down to 2500 I am still doing work for that rank. I would still have to do something to prove I have done enough to progress within this guild. As for Kage's being the one to rank up a ninja, I'll cross that bridge when I get to it.
And to your point about taking a year, I'm sorry for you. I'm sorry that your time and effort were ignored and that a year went by without any sort of progression. I'm sure you don't see it that way. You just see it as the way this guild works. But to me, that's unforgivable. You put a year of your life into this guild. You were active, and gave what you could and at times more than you could for the sake of your story and for the story of others. I don't believe that you should only be a chuunin after all of the work you gave. That's your fight, however. I respect it's not my own, or that you don't even think that it is a fight. I just know that if such a thing occurred with me then I would be screaming. You're right that a rank up is not a right, but this is supposed to be fun above all else. I would not have fun being a genin for a year if I was consistently active through it.
I've brought up the matter in the admin chat. Deep breaths, all. A question to think about and discuss: If you had to adjust numbers, where would you put them? 2500 AC was the old threshold for Chuunin/C-Rank, but is that where you'd like to see it? What about the advancement to Jounin/B-Rank? This will help guide the discussion on the topic when we look over it.
Mattysandwich
Kumurai Kaicho
kiwis poet
I Tortured Sleep I
Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:23 am
I will work on a better assortment of mission point requirements. I'm off to a date, however, so that'll be later.
Ergo War
I've brought up the matter in the admin chat. Deep breaths, all. A question to think about and discuss: If you had to adjust numbers, where would you put them? 2500 AC was the old threshold for Chuunin/C-Rank, but is that where you'd like to see it? What about the advancement to Jounin/B-Rank? This will help guide the discussion on the topic when we look over it.
Is there any way we could get bukijutsu ninjas to have more ninjutsu slots available to them? I respect that Taijutsu class also only gains one ninjutsu slot per rank, and the two are treated as similar due to the perceived preference of them both to fight in close quarters. Still, at least Taijutsu has a discipline which allows ninja to gain more ninjutsu slots. Not only does Bukijutsu ninjas not have that, but they actually has a discipline which completely gets rid of their ability to use ninjutsu. Could we change something around to give bukijutsu ninjas at least two slots per rank?
Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2017 8:17 pm
I understand the A.C. threshold shouldn't be a light load exactly, but also reflect time as a genin. I think 5,000 is a decent number to work with. I'm personally a bit against the ability to go from genin to chuunin within a month. Between post activity between others within the village, various menial tasks you end up doing just as regular rpc upkeep such as training, and anything else I'm forgetting a month is just not nearly enough time for a fresh faced genin to have done more than rescue some cats, be a peeping tom for hire, and train solo more often than not. It just simply isn't time enough for character development. However, you run into this problem when there just aren't any opportunities for development available.
Town festivals, team training exercises/drills, mission briefings, small scale tournaments, etc. I think if villages had things happening that made them feel like actually dynamic villages, people would jump at the opportunity to participate. Not only this, but opportunities to award A.C. in different more personal methods than pre-written missions would be great. If higher ranked shinobi had more responsibility in the RP village like leading training exercises with genin, running village patrols, things to get us moving around I would absolutely respect why ranking up requires more time. I'd much rather run multiple escort missions with other genin and a squad leader and have there always be a random chance of combat encounter for multiple irl days at a time to earn my A.C. than spam cat chasing to gain A.C. faster. I just think more village involvement from higher ranking shinobi would make being a genin for a longer period of time seem as less of a punishment for some.
And for running small scale things like that in the village, awarding more Ryo to the higher ranks and maybe extra A.C. to those who participated in something that takes that kind of time could be incentive to get people doing things of that nature that reflect character growth and time spent actually being a genin and doing things for the village.
It would be nice if there were a way for villagers who have time to help out to apply to run things like festivals, skill tournaments, etc in the village as well. Maybe for running things like that and lightening the load of the crew and kages to do something for everyone, the individual could be rewarded with coupons for more A.C. and ryou from missions or something to help them on their way.
