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 Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 9:19 pm
ryuu_chan Take a read through what Jesus has to say on the matter. He essentially tells us that God is completely in control AND that humans have free will. When he talks about them both, he speaks like there's no contradiction. Just because God puts us in a particular place and time with a particular personality doesn't mean that we'll never be exposed to Him or His teachings. I mean, all the athiests and other religions in this guild are here debating it... and being exposed to doctrine all at once. And still choosing otherwise. This makes perfect sense to me. I had an interesting discussion with a young man in China a couple years ago. He had never heard of Jesus Christ.
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Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 9:21 pm
ryuu_chan A Different Light I don't follow your logic. You can't control something while it has free will. It's like making a robot and programming it to serve drinks at a resaurant. If someone says "Why don't you ever let your robot have fun and play basketball?" And you respond "It can go play basketball ny time it wants, it just chooses not to." But the problem is that it only knows how to serve drinks. More like the difference between a script writer and actors. The script writer knows every line, knows the background, knows exactly what's going on and how it's going to end. But the actors can still play the scene the way they want. Sorry for the bad analogy. I'm not saying that God is controlling every single moment of your life, play-by-play, but more the direction that's it's going to be going in, and every so often reaching down and tweaking it. I know this one's even more full of holes than my usual. This is me posting exhausted and right after work. I'll have to be back when I'm in my head again. Could you try a different metaphor? As you've admitted; I'll tear this one apart.
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Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 9:46 pm
Lethkhar ryuu_chan Take a read through what Jesus has to say on the matter. He essentially tells us that God is completely in control AND that humans have free will. When he talks about them both, he speaks like there's no contradiction. Just because God puts us in a particular place and time with a particular personality doesn't mean that we'll never be exposed to Him or His teachings. I mean, all the athiests and other religions in this guild are here debating it... and being exposed to doctrine all at once. And still choosing otherwise. This makes perfect sense to me. I had an interesting discussion with a young man in China a couple years ago. He had never heard of Jesus Christ. And now he has. You might have made him curious enough to explore this further... and who knows, he might be a Christian right now.
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Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 9:48 pm
Lethkhar Could you try a different metaphor? As you've admitted; I'll tear this one apart. The problem with this is that spiritual business HAS no earthly metaphor. No matter what we tell you, it's really going to be inadequate to describe what's going on. There's a reason everyone starts out their faith with "there's no words to describe..." Not to mention that it seems like it's your mission to tear through them all anyhow. But we love you anyway. heart
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:38 pm
ryuu_chan Lethkhar ryuu_chan Take a read through what Jesus has to say on the matter. He essentially tells us that God is completely in control AND that humans have free will. When he talks about them both, he speaks like there's no contradiction. Just because God puts us in a particular place and time with a particular personality doesn't mean that we'll never be exposed to Him or His teachings. I mean, all the athiests and other religions in this guild are here debating it... and being exposed to doctrine all at once. And still choosing otherwise. This makes perfect sense to me. I had an interesting discussion with a young man in China a couple years ago. He had never heard of Jesus Christ. And now he has. You might have made him curious enough to explore this further... and who knows, he might be a Christian right now. I really, really doubt that. Christians are tortured in China. Besides, he was a quite devout Taoist.
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:40 pm
ryuu_chan Lethkhar Could you try a different metaphor? As you've admitted; I'll tear this one apart. The problem with this is that spiritual business HAS no earthly metaphor. No matter what we tell you, it's really going to be inadequate to describe what's going on. There's a reason everyone starts out their faith with "there's no words to describe..." Not to mention that it seems like it's your mission to tear through them all anyhow. But we love you anyway. heart Oh, is THAT why you're all looking forward to slaughtering me at the Rapture and then watching me be tortured for the rest of eternity? I guess I just somehow misinterpreted that. rolleyes
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 10:46 am
Lethkhar rofl I really, really doubt that. Christians are tortured in China. Besides, he was a quite devout Taoist. Which doesn't mean that they don't exist. And a few people here were quite devoted to another religion before they became Christians. You'll never really know. Lethkhar Oh, is THAT why you're all looking forward to slaughtering me at the Rapture and then watching me be tortured for the rest of eternity? I guess I just somehow misinterpreted that. rolleyes ... ??? WTF? I have NO idea what you're talking about. None of us are looking forward to suffering of any kind. In fact, if you read through just about ALL your other posts you'd realize that. Nobody here is out to get you. In fact, my only problem with you is that no matter what we tell you, you always have a negative reaction. But then again, that comes from ALL my non-Christian friends when I talk about religion so I'm used to it anyhow.
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:24 pm
ryuu_chan Lethkhar rofl I really, really doubt that. Christians are tortured in China. Besides, he was a quite devout Taoist. Which doesn't mean that they don't exist. And a few people here were quite devoted to another religion before they became Christians. You'll never really know. You're right. The guy could be Christian. I'm just saying it's really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, , really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really unlikely. Christianity does not have the highest growth rate of all religions, especially in China. Quote: Lethkhar Oh, is THAT why you're all looking forward to slaughtering me at the Rapture and then watching me be tortured for the rest of eternity? I guess I just somehow misinterpreted that. rolleyes ... ??? WTF? I have NO idea what you're talking about. None of us are looking forward to suffering of any kind. In fact, if you read through just about ALL your other posts you'd realize that. Nobody here is out to get you. In fact, my only problem with you is that no matter what we tell you, you always have a negative reaction. But then again, that comes from ALL my non-Christian friends when I talk about religion so I'm used to it anyhow. Tell that to Fushigi na Butterfly. She has said herself that she is looking forward to all the Christians slaughtering all the non-Christians. I asked why we wouldn't just have peace, and she gave me something along the lines of,"BLOOD! BLOOD! BLOOD!" And from my perspective, you're the one with all the negative reactions. That's the point of debate; to contradict each other.
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:55 pm
Lethkhar Tell that to Fushigi na Butterfly. She has said herself that she is looking forward to all the Christians slaughtering all the non-Christians. I asked why we wouldn't just have peace, and she gave me something along the lines of,"BLOOD! BLOOD! BLOOD!" And from my perspective, you're the one with all the negative reactions. That's the point of debate; to contradict each other. Then I have completely missed that comment, and it seems really out-of-character for her. *shrug* I do realize the point of debate. It just sometimes seems like you're crossing the line between debate and attack. But then again, things are read a little differently online than probably originally intended. Again, *shrug*
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 11:42 pm
ryuu_chan Lethkhar Tell that to Fushigi na Butterfly. She has said herself that she is looking forward to all the Christians slaughtering all the non-Christians. I asked why we wouldn't just have peace, and she gave me something along the lines of,"BLOOD! BLOOD! BLOOD!" And from my perspective, you're the one with all the negative reactions. That's the point of debate; to contradict each other. Then I have completely missed that comment, and it seems really out-of-character for her. *shrug* I do realize the point of debate. It just sometimes seems like you're crossing the line between debate and attack. But then again, things are read a little differently online than probably originally intended. Again, *shrug* This is a piece of an actual conversation I had with Fushigi na Butterfly a few months ago: Fushigi na Butterfly Lethkhar Fushigi na Butterfly Lethkhar Fushigi na Butterfly If by people you mean living humans beings, no, but come Armageddon, the resurrected martyrs will fight side by side with Jesus and the archangels to defeat Satan and his followers- and they will do it without remorse or regret. 3nodding Fight? Whatever happened to "love thy neighbor"? confused I'm not "rebelling" against God. I just don't think He exists. If I were sent to Hell, I would probably come to believe that God exists. I am not a follower of Satan. I don't believe in Satan just like I don't believe in God. I do not want to be your enemy. I do not want to fight anyone. I am a pacifist. Obviously, the Christians are the overly bloodthirsty and violent ones in this situation. I will now draw from Mahatma Gandhi. Based on his philosophy, your brutality will only cause your downfall. While all of us peaceful atheists, Buddhists, Jainists, Hinduists, Jews, Muslims, Bahá'Ãs, Bábis, Gnostics, Deists, Sikhs, Zoroastrianists, and Pagans (And every one of those at least have some pacifist sects, if the religion itself isn't completely pacifist) stand by and watch your brutality and barbarity with disdain, you will go on to prove just how injust you truly are. We will not retaliate. You will be as the British were in India. You will try to suppress us by force. At first it will appear to work. We won't be violent, we won't hurt you in any way. Slowly but surely, your grip on us will begin to fade. Your measures will fail, because you will eventually realise that you need to slaughter each and every one of us to win. And then what would you have won? Nothing. You will be monsters, having eradicated each and every innocent soul in Hell. And I will swell with a sense of justice and morality at your plight. Alongside the majority of my friends, my family, and my heroes. We will have won our liberation peacefully, and overthrown the savage, hypocritical, war-mongering minority cult that labels itself as peaceful and just. I will see you at the massacre. Matthew 12:30 Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. *Shrugs* She's looking forward to slaughtering us. I guess I just assumed it was the same with all Christians. I'm sorry for prejudging. That was my bad. I am also sorry if you have felt attacked. I in no way meant to cause any harm.
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Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 9:30 am
And I can see why you thought Fushigi was after blood. Well, at least that's all cleared up. Tea anyone?
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Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:13 pm
ryuu_chan And I can see why you thought Fushigi was after blood. Well, at least that's all cleared up. Tea anyone? Does this mean you agree with me?
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Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:55 pm
Lethkhar Does this mean you agree with me? I'm not quite sure. I mean, I can completely see where you're coming from, but I read a different tone in all that. I just can't explain it any better. *helpless gesture*
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Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 3:45 pm
After blood?? Me?? sweatdrop I'm just looking forward to the enemies of God getting their rightful punishment. If you don't wanna be a part of it, Leth, you know what you have to do. The choice is up to you.
However, it's only the martyrs that will be resurrected first who join in on the actual battle. -checks pulse- Yup, not a martyr. Who knows though, I plan on being a missionary to Japan and I might get shot or something for it (though that's probably unlikely).
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High-functioning Businesswoman
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Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:27 am
Fushigi na Butterfly After blood?? Me?? sweatdrop I'm just looking forward to the enemies of God getting their rightful punishment. If you don't wanna be a part of it, Leth, you know what you have to do. The choice is up to you.
However, it's only the martyrs that will be resurrected first who join in on the actual battle. -checks pulse- Yup, not a martyr. Who knows though, I plan on being a missionary to Japan and I might get shot or something for it (though that's probably unlikely). Precisely my point; You're looking forward to Christians slaughtering non-Christians. You're are eagerly anticipating the extermination of one group of people by another. That doesn't seem even the slightest bit "Unchristian" to you?
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