Welcome to Gaia! ::

~*The Official Post Your Progress Guild*~ Writers Support!

Back to Guilds

We support fellow writers by tracking and displaying word and page counts. 

Tags: Writing, Write, Poetry, Novels, Stories 

Reply Member Journals
Phade Rants (Twenty Rants Strong!) Goto Page: [] [<] 1 2 3 ... 4 5 6 7 8 [>] [»|]

Quick Reply

Enter both words below, separated by a space:

Can't read the text? Click here

Submit

General Phade

Fanatical Cultist

PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 10:05 pm


PHADE RANT #6

August 7, 2010

This Is Bad...

So for the past few days I've been plagued with hating the world and everything in it. It annoys the crap out of me when I get like this because it gets in the way of everything. I don't enjoy gaming, I don't enjoy playing with my cat, I don't like my music, and I don't like my writing.

Now I'm well aware that it's a phase I go through now and then, but its aggravating me because I'm expecting a response to a query letter in the next two weeks or so and I need to do something to keep myself occupied so I don't think about it.

But I have absolutely no desire to do anything. It's frustrating as all hell. I can't even enjoy working on my posters, and that's usually the thing that keeps me sane during these bouts.

It's times like these I want to dropkick a baby or something. I just really don't want that baby to be my book...

*Grimace*
PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 11:15 pm


Awe! You'll get through it. *Hugs* Forget about that stupid query letter. Find something to do. This is the perfect time to find a new hobby...or sleep a lot. That's what I do. blaugh

We all know how you feel. We all get these damn bouts. That's why were here, to support each other during these hard times and to cheer each other on when we succeed. You wrote a query letter. That's something to be celebrated. Be happy, not worried.

Go Phade! mrgreen

KaNugget

4,450 Points
  • Popular Thread 100
  • Invisibility 100
  • Forum Dabbler 200

General Phade

Fanatical Cultist

PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2010 3:53 pm


Oh, I know everyone gets them. It just seems to come every three months or so for me. It's regular. I'd call it "Writing PMS," except I feel that'd be slightly offensive to Psychotic Maniacal Sanity... X3

And on a completely random note, I was on the verge of buying a Devil Imp potion when I thought, "hey, I should probably see what this looks like on me." So I went to see if it looked good on me.

I was appalled. I mean, it turned me white! I wanna be a devil imp and stay black, damn it!
PostPosted: Sun Aug 08, 2010 1:24 pm


Hahaha, when I was reading your post I was thinking exactly the same on PMS xD.

Ah, Gaia Devil Imp Potions are racist... As for your writing, I'm sure you will kick yourself in gear. Take a break perhaps?

DesertRoseFallen
Vice Captain

5,900 Points
  • Citizen 200
  • First step to fame 200
  • Forum Sophomore 300

General Phade

Fanatical Cultist

PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 4:24 pm


PHADE RANT #7

August 10, 2010

Blow My Mind

You know when you write something forever ago and then happen across it again you get a completely new reaction to it? You laugh because it's so bad or go, "Whoa. Where the hell has this been hiding?" when it's really good? I had one of those moments today. I was looking over some earlier chapters of Book II and I got to this scene I scarcely remember writing.

It was a frickin' sex scene.

Now, being the masochist I am, I sent said scene to a friend of mine who's a huge romance addict. She reads sex almost religiously. It's kinda scary. But what I found scarier was that she enjoyed it. Apparently I can write good sex.

I find that oddly rewarding and yet ever-so disturbing.
PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:36 pm


PHADE RANT #8

August 10, 2010

Tools

Yes, I'm double-posting today.

While I don't make a point of habitually posting in the Writer's Forum, I do float around and read what people have to say. Aside from the few jerk-offs who feel the need to tear any opposing viewpoint apart down to the last little detail, I find most of it rather interesting. But there's one thing that a lot of people are saying that I simply can't agree with.

Self-Proclaimed WF Veteran
To understand your characters, you need to realize they are not people, but a piece of a story and that you need to make that piece work best with all the other pieces.


WF Regular With A Love For the Word ******** class="quoted">Characters are kin to the setting and the plot- they are all devices that move the story along, and without said writer, they are nonexistent and useless. Your character's are nothing without you writing them, and do nothing unless you write them as such. They are, first and always, devices to move the story along. They're tools. Treat them that way.


WF Guest That Seems to Have Vanished
Characters are made for one thing. They're tools used by the writer to tie the knot in a plot, players in the infinite pantomime of the written story, killable aspects of a writer's personality or personalities the writer sees in others. Anything else said about the subject is simply delusional fancy.


See a pattern here?

I call bullshit on this.

If characters are tools, then they're nothing but cold, hard, and emotionless things--nothing that's going to capture the reader's fancy. If that's the case, why have them at all? Saying your characters aren't real or your characters are tools is like saying you as a person aren't real or your emotions are simply tools to get you through life.

While they may not be physical entities, characters do indeed exist as a part of the author. The different personalities an author gives their characters are similar to the different aspects of the authors own personality. They have to be; that's how you, as the author, connect with your characters. If you can't connect with them, what makes you think the reader will be able to?

Then there's the whole "My Characters Talk To Me!" thing, or "My Characters Write Themselves/The Story!"

Civilized WFer
The characters don't ever take control of themselves.

I disagree with that. People who claim their characters talk to them aren't necessarily lying. I don't believe you can mentally sit down and have a conversation with your character about how great your day has been or how horrible the last movie you saw was, but I do believe its possible to communicate with your character.

WF Regular
I do agree that the whole MY CHARACTERS ARE ALIVE concept is childish, however, the whole mind set "My characters aren't real, I don't give a damn what they do" is also wrong.

There is a connection between author and character, especially if this is a character you as the author have worked with for an extended period of time and know inside out. If you read through a paragraph and at the end determine that what your character just did is something they wouldn't normally do, that's communicating with them. You wrote what you wanted to happen, but your character, through the past actions they've taken, are saying they wouldn't do such a thing. And yes, I'm aware that you as the author make their mindsets and force them to do whatever you please, but after you've created them, you can't have them do something they normally wouldn't, even if you want them to. If you do, it feels forced and unnatural. Likewise, if you sat back and said, "yeah, s/he would do that in this situation," that's also communicating with the character--it shows you understand them.

If the action is blatantly out of character, the fault is yours as the author. But there are times when you just know a character so well that you can sit down and write non-stop about their adventures. You can put them in a situation and just know what they do to get out of it without having to sit back and think about it--it just happens. That kind of character influence, where it feels like the character took over, is perfectly acceptable. If this happens, chances are what you've written is true to that particular character. Even if it doesn't work in the context of your story and you have to go edit it, you still had that moment where the character "took over." This was put better by an acquaintance:

Another Civilized WFer
Saying "My character does what s/he wants and I just sort of write it down" is basically short form for "I have a character that, considering the very in-depth and painstakingly particular traits, history, and personality that I designed for them, simply would not react any other way than X to situation Y. If I did happen to say '********' and write them however I damn well please, ignoring those factors of their personality, my writing would suck big hairy balls."

Then there's the idea that all characters are offshoots of the writer.

Narrow Minded WF Guest
This means that you cannot write in the mindset of anyone but yourself. this means you are narrow-minded, and you need to expand your thinking more. otherwise you'll be writing about you in the forest, you at prom, you in space, and all of your characters will be static and similar.

Again, I disagree. Every character ever created has a little bit of the author in them. How the author reacts to a situation will be reflected in their character, even if it's unintentional. It's not a matter of ensuring such a thing does or doesn't happen, it's a matter of worldly experience.

You couldn't effectively show that the character is giddy or furious without having been giddy or furious yourself. You witness others in such moods, but you can't capture the essence of the character's current frame of mind without having experienced it yourself. It's a matter of writing what you know, and therefore, your experience and emotions is implanted in your characters, however little.

In terms of them all reacting similarly, I don't believe that's always the case. A character that's always serious is going to act differently than a character who takes life as a joke. The serious character could very well be the serious side of the author simply blown out of proportion to create the personality of that particular character. Likewise with the one who goofs around.

You're the one writing about them, technically dictating everything they do, but chances are that's what they would have done on their own, anyway. They have to be their own little people in their own respect.

If the author can't see them as people, how can the reader be expected to?

General Phade

Fanatical Cultist


11linda

PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:42 pm


xD I just have to say, I was bored, I think I am going to go into the writers forum and see if I can't add on to what you say.

I agree with you Phade, my characters created themselves, they just happened the come to me with their story. I like my characters. When I was little they were my imaginary friends and even know that I am older they are there just to give me a second opinion... Most people cannot get that because they don't have an imaginary and a person is as real as you make them... No one has seen god, but we believe he is real which makes him a person? I see the bible as another book, though I am christian.

Idk I had a neighbor who just decided to walk by and start talking to a mail box, somethign tells me you can talk to anything...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 11:19 pm


That is why I hate to go onto the WF now. Seriously, I spend 80% of my time on Gaia in this guild. How can your invest yourself in your writing without investing yourself in your characters? How can you write a lovable character if you don't care of them? If you don't fall in love when they do, don't cry when they are sad? When I am writing I become my character. I even go so far to act out their actions. Perhaps that makes me a little crazy and eccentric, but I think my writing speaks for itself.

I'm not here to judge how anybody writes. If it works for them to be completely detached to their creations and see them as only a tool then good for them. But for me, and many others, we see our books as a babies, and therefore our characters too. To me my characters are real. And I love them like my own child.

And yes you do put a little bit of yourself into your characters. I like to say that I'll live 1000 lives before I die. Because when I'm writing, just for a little while, I become that character. And I hope to share those lives with my readers.

Edit: Pour tu!
http://www.gaiaonline.com/forum/writers/i-love-my-characters/t.64156813_1/

KaNugget

4,450 Points
  • Popular Thread 100
  • Invisibility 100
  • Forum Dabbler 200

DesertRoseFallen
Vice Captain

5,900 Points
  • Citizen 200
  • First step to fame 200
  • Forum Sophomore 300
PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 4:13 am


Yes, the WF does have a...distinct view on what characters are. It makes me laugh how people there are so set in their own views and arrogant. Sorry, but once they are published and famous, they have no real standing. I don't see the point of posting there as they nick-pick everything based on their opinion. What makes them think their opinion is so sacred and gospel? Its supposed to be a help forum, not a slagging match.

I say every author is different and no one can tell you how to write. I know very famous authors who 'speak' with the characters yet I can never do that myself.

The 'tools' thing is a complete load of tosh. You do have to look at them as though they are human beings otherwise you have a blank canvas. A tool usually has one purpose, but us human beings don't have on purpose.

The characters writing themselves I can see a bit clearer. It isn't the characters telling you though, it is putting yourself in their shoes and thinking, what would they do. After all, they are a different person all together and everyone thinks differently. Why make them out of character in one move? I find that flaw all over the internet. I find your character is more of a part of you that you mentally sit down with.

I do very much agree the fact that the character will always have a bit of the author in them. Your imagination is fueled by your every day life, whether it was something you read/saw/or remember from your past. The creative writing course I've applied for goes very much in depth into characters. A lot of characterisation there is telling you to draw from your past and your present. A lot of great authors use people from their past who have stood out to provide a personality for their character.

Developing a character is creating a personality. Someone who has certain traits, whether they have to turn the light off twice at night or obssessively check if the windows are closed. Someone who has something happen to them and it affects their lives. One thing I hate is people that write about childhood problems such as bullying, physical/emotional/sexual abuse and no nothing about it. The character is supposed to be treated like a human being. It makes me cringe every time I see someone write about someone having been raped and two days later they are all well and healthy. Don't these people think?!

Ugh...rant over haha.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:46 pm


KaNugget, refer to Desert's opinion of people in the WF.

Desert, it's okay to rant. Note the title of my journal. XD

General Phade

Fanatical Cultist


DesertRoseFallen
Vice Captain

5,900 Points
  • Citizen 200
  • First step to fame 200
  • Forum Sophomore 300
PostPosted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 6:19 am


Haha yes, very true. Don't get me wrong, I admire people who write, who have the patience to sit there and write novels but I don't get the extreme attachment. I know the character's are subconsciously either part of me or parts of people I have known in the past.
I do find it very strange when people have these weird conversations with their characters xD
PostPosted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:15 pm


It's all a matter of opinion. You have do what works best for you. The WF for some reason thinks there is only one way. Don't they know there are 8 different kinds of intelligences and that we all learn different ways?

I admit it. I don't have the natural talent for writing, so I have to compensate with that by using other methods that wouldn't work for the natural writer. I need my ideas to be physically written down for me to understand and comprehend them. So people only need their head.

Everyone is different? Why can't we just understand that and help each other?

KaNugget

4,450 Points
  • Popular Thread 100
  • Invisibility 100
  • Forum Dabbler 200

General Phade

Fanatical Cultist

PostPosted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 6:36 pm


Because people like to be right. People are egotistical maniacs.

I AM GUILTY OF BEING ONE OF THEM!!!

I really don't see how people can view their characters as tools. I don't. It's heartless and I can't see believable, lovable characters being written if they're viewed so... non-existent-ly-ish-esque, for lack of a real word that currently eludes my thought process.

I'm slightly giddy since I just finished watching Extraordinary Measures. Harrison Ford + Brendan Fraser = EPIC ******** WIN

And, on a side-note, I've tested as a Haptic Learner.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 1:13 am


KaNugget - Oh don't get me wrong, I fully understand people have different ways of doing things. I know that very much haha. When revising my A Levels I couldn't sit there and read a revision book like the rest of my year. I wrote out the entire two revision books, transferred them to spider diagrams which covered my bedroom walls and narrowed them down again to small revision cards. It's like that with writing. Luckily I've always written and it is natural for me to do so. Personally, I cannot comprehend actually really working hard on my stories and it not being just a natural flow.
Sorry if I was being a bit picky! I don't meet writers outside Gaia so...I don't have anyone to see doing their own thing.

Phade - I must have seen that film, being a fan of both of the actors, especially Brendan Fraser! Haptic learning is a combination of two ways isn't it?

DesertRoseFallen
Vice Captain

5,900 Points
  • Citizen 200
  • First step to fame 200
  • Forum Sophomore 300

Racheling

Moonlight Sailor

PostPosted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:16 am


To add another perspective on characters...

Thinking of characters as tools doesn't mean someone who writes like that doesn't love the characters they've created, or is doomed to write bad characters that no one can relate to. To me it means I don't let my initial perception of the character bog them down because "that's what Rosie would do, it's just the kind of person she is." At least for me, if I said my characters were tools, I would mean that they are changeable based on the needs of the story.

I wrote a character I loved. She was so much fun to write, but readers felt she was too bitchy and they couldn't relate to her. I decided they were right and completely rewrote her personality. (I like her more now, though the original version was still fun--but she's almost a whole new character.) Because of this, I was able to revise most of the plot at the same time, and the book is 100x better now. This is what I mean when I say they're tools--I can't let myself get so hung up on thinking of them as a real person that I can't tear up their motivation and personality and everything else for the sake of the work.

So yeah, I'd say I lean more toward the characters as tools mindset. I don't learn about my characters--I decide what they're like. I don't feel like they exist as a person outside the story. The trick is to make them feel like they exist for the reader, and that's enough for me. I don't believe that viewing characters this way means you can't write good characters.

I'm aware I work differently than a lot of writers, and I fully believe either method is perfectly fine. Writers should do whatever works for them. I just thought this might help express the "other side." xd
Reply
Member Journals

Goto Page: [] [<] 1 2 3 ... 4 5 6 7 8 [>] [»|]
 
Manage Your Items
Other Stuff
Get GCash
Offers
Get Items
More Items
Where Everyone Hangs Out
Other Community Areas
Virtual Spaces
Fun Stuff
Gaia's Games
Mini-Games
Play with GCash
Play with Platinum