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 Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:49 pm
DaikonNairu -Ren- xxEternallyBluexx And anyway God gave us the animals to do what we would with, but we're not supposed to murder each other. So, there's nothing wrong with animal cruelty in the eyes of your god? You could leave a dog in a hot car without the windows rolled down for 8 hours or more and that would be fine? No that's sick and wrong. sad We're supposed to be responsible for animals, but killing a mosquito is fine. Humans come before animal, but animals should be looked after because He gave us stewardship over them.
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Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:02 pm
I don't really think it would make any sense for the father to have say in an abortion. First of all, not all women know who the father of their fetus is, so if both people had to sign, these women just wouldn't be able to get one. Second, what about in the case of rape; it would be silly to let a rapist have a say in whether or not to keep the baby. And third, while it may be his child too, it's her body, and I couldn't imagine having to live with something in my body for 9 months just because some guy wanted me to. Anyway, yes, it's definitely an awful situation, but I think only women having a say in an abortion is just the most reasonable solution we have. There's not really any way around it, at least not any way that wouldn't hurt a lot of women.
Anyway, as far as whether or not a guy should have to play a part in his kid's life once it's born, I really don't know. I know a lot of guys who are total douche bags and who have nothing to do with their kids, and it's probably for the best. But on the other hand, most kids I know who grow up knowing that their father is out there but just doesn't want to see them always seem upset by this. So... I really just don't know.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:57 am
xxEternallyBluexx Shiori Miko Semiremis Shiori Miko Someoneiknow zabazor It is not in their body, so I think they should have no say. Now if we can implant the child in the male urethra (largest part of the sex organ other than the scrotum) then he can have the choice. The baby is not the woman's body either. So why should they have the say if the child gets to die or not. No, the baby is not her body but it is a parasite. It takes from her body to nurish itself. If the women does not want the baby, it's stealing from her. If it was a bug or something doing that, would you issue with her taking medicine to get rid of the parasite? but it's not a bug... It's human. Why does a human's life have more value than a bug's life? I shouldn't of researched Buddhism, I feel bad whenever I slap a mosquito. Because most bugs barely even have a brain. There's things that make life worth living, which I doubt a mosquito knows anything about. And anyway God gave us the animals to do what we would with, but we're not supposed to murder each other. Just so you know I'm vegetarian because I view an animal's life just as important as I would a human's.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:04 am
xxEternallyBluexx DaikonNairu -Ren- xxEternallyBluexx And anyway God gave us the animals to do what we would with, but we're not supposed to murder each other. So, there's nothing wrong with animal cruelty in the eyes of your god? You could leave a dog in a hot car without the windows rolled down for 8 hours or more and that would be fine? No that's sick and wrong. sad We're supposed to be responsible for animals, but killing a mosquito is fine. Humans come before animal, but animals should be looked after because He gave us stewardship over them. I'll keep that in mind if I ever come across both a serial killer and a search dog in distress. Humans first. rolleyes
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 9:33 am
Someoneiknow DaikonNairu -Ren- Vengeful Elegance What about the fathers? Why don't men have a right to chose not to be a father? Its because the father doesn't have to carry it around in his body for 9 months (give or take) before the birth. Its just as unfair for a man to make a woman give birth to a thing she doesn't want as it is to disregard the father's feelings completely. I'm sure most women who are pregnant by men that actually want the baby will take their feelings into account, but ultimately it is the woman's choice because it is the woman that has carry and birth it. Then how is it fair that a man has to pay child support for 18 years? 18 years is a lot longer than a fat gut for 9 months. Thank you!
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 9:35 am
DaikonNairu -Ren- Someoneiknow Then how is it fair that a man has to pay child support for 18 years? 18 years is a lot longer than a fat gut for 9 months. It is not physically damaging for a father to pay child support. It is however damaging for a woman to carry and give birth to a child. But she doesn't have to. It is her choice.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 9:38 am
Strychnine Lovers Guys shouldn't be able to tell women what to do with our bodies. If the father doesn't want the child, maybe he should have been more responsible and made sure there was no way the women would've gotten pregnant (condoms, contraceptives, birth control), and if they were just that stupid, they deserve to pay child support. If a woman is horrible enough to purposely get knocked up by a man who she knows doesn't want children she deserves to raise it alone.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:26 am
I don't think anyone should have a say in abortion.
A fetus is a human being, as proven by basic biology. Nobody has the right to kill another human being, except in the most dire of circumstances in which one's life is in physical danger. Namely, self defense. Roughly 75% or more of all abortions are done out of convenience, and not because of a significant health risk or from rape, which removes implied consent from the picture.
The means of pregnancy are well known, it is not a random malignancy or a happenstance that occurs for no reason- One has to have sex to become pregnant, and there is as much implied consent to possible pregnancy as there is stepping into a boxing ring and being possibly punched.
This said, with consent to pregnancy and knowing that the fetus is a human being by the most basic of definitions, it is morally and ethically wrong to kill this human being except, again, in dire circumstance.
The pro-life stance is not telling women what to do, and it is not an issue for women alone. NOBODY should kill a fetus, be it a priest, a doctor, a man, a woman, black or white. It is no more an invasion of rights and privacy than laws against murder, barring a cruel, malicious act of violence against other human beings.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:30 am
Shiori Miko Someoneiknow zabazor It is not in their body, so I think they should have no say. Now if we can implant the child in the male urethra (largest part of the sex organ other than the scrotum) then he can have the choice. The baby is not the woman's body either. So why should they have the say if the child gets to die or not. No, the baby is not her body but it is a parasite. It takes from her body to nurish itself. If the women does not want the baby, it's stealing from her. If it was a bug or something doing that, would you issue with her taking medicine to get rid of the parasite? Biology fail. A parasite has to be of a different species.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:13 pm
divineseraph I don't think anyone should have a say in abortion. A fetus is a human being, as proven by basic biology. Nobody has the right to kill another human being, except in the most dire of circumstances in which one's life is in physical danger. Namely, self defense. Roughly 75% or more of all abortions are done out of convenience, and not because of a significant health risk or from rape, which removes implied consent from the picture. The means of pregnancy are well known, it is not a random malignancy or a happenstance that occurs for no reason- One has to have sex to become pregnant, and there is as much implied consent to possible pregnancy as there is stepping into a boxing ring and being possibly punched. This said, with consent to pregnancy and knowing that the fetus is a human being by the most basic of definitions, it is morally and ethically wrong to kill this human being except, again, in dire circumstance. The pro-life stance is not telling women what to do, and it is not an issue for women alone. NOBODY should kill a fetus, be it a priest, a doctor, a man, a woman, black or white. It is no more an invasion of rights and privacy than laws against murder, barring a cruel, malicious act of violence against other human beings. I agree whole heartedly with you. I also find that most women who say they are "raped" are just trying to provide an escape for what they know they did was wrong. More or less a justification of getting an abortion. Pure psychology would say that if a woman was even arguing that they had an abortion because of said "rape" they were never really "raped" but half heartedly consented to sex but didn't really know what they were getting themselves into, because the fact that women who were actually truthfully raped are to ashamed and scared to admit they were raped.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:52 pm
divineseraph I don't think anyone should have a say in abortion. A fetus is a human being, as proven by basic biology. Nobody has the right to kill another human being, except in the most dire of circumstances in which one's life is in physical danger. Namely, self defense. Roughly 75% or more of all abortions are done out of convenience, and not because of a significant health risk or from rape, which removes implied consent from the picture. The means of pregnancy are well known, it is not a random malignancy or a happenstance that occurs for no reason- One has to have sex to become pregnant, and there is as much implied consent to possible pregnancy as there is stepping into a boxing ring and being possibly punched. This said, with consent to pregnancy and knowing that the fetus is a human being by the most basic of definitions, it is morally and ethically wrong to kill this human being except, again, in dire circumstance. The pro-life stance is not telling women what to do, and it is not an issue for women alone. NOBODY should kill a fetus, be it a priest, a doctor, a man, a woman, black or white. It is no more an invasion of rights and privacy than laws against murder, barring a cruel, malicious act of violence against other human beings.
People commit suicide and live in terrible neighborhoods. We live in a world with an ever-so increasing population. I feel that, yes, maybe abortion is slightly wrong. However, I feel is is pretty much a thing of life. Like I said, a choice of good life over life.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 3:26 pm
Captain_Shinzo divineseraph I don't think anyone should have a say in abortion. A fetus is a human being, as proven by basic biology. Nobody has the right to kill another human being, except in the most dire of circumstances in which one's life is in physical danger. Namely, self defense. Roughly 75% or more of all abortions are done out of convenience, and not because of a significant health risk or from rape, which removes implied consent from the picture. The means of pregnancy are well known, it is not a random malignancy or a happenstance that occurs for no reason- One has to have sex to become pregnant, and there is as much implied consent to possible pregnancy as there is stepping into a boxing ring and being possibly punched. This said, with consent to pregnancy and knowing that the fetus is a human being by the most basic of definitions, it is morally and ethically wrong to kill this human being except, again, in dire circumstance. The pro-life stance is not telling women what to do, and it is not an issue for women alone. NOBODY should kill a fetus, be it a priest, a doctor, a man, a woman, black or white. It is no more an invasion of rights and privacy than laws against murder, barring a cruel, malicious act of violence against other human beings.
People commit suicide and live in terrible neighborhoods. We live in a world with an ever-so increasing population. I feel that, yes, maybe abortion is slightly wrong. However, I feel is is pretty much a thing of life. Like I said, a choice of good life over life.But who makes this choice? Can someone make this choice for you? Can you make this choice for the poor or the ill? No- the choice to enjoy life, or to have life, is for the one who's life it is, and no one else.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:18 pm
Someoneiknow divineseraph I don't think anyone should have a say in abortion. A fetus is a human being, as proven by basic biology. Nobody has the right to kill another human being, except in the most dire of circumstances in which one's life is in physical danger. Namely, self defense. Roughly 75% or more of all abortions are done out of convenience, and not because of a significant health risk or from rape, which removes implied consent from the picture. The means of pregnancy are well known, it is not a random malignancy or a happenstance that occurs for no reason- One has to have sex to become pregnant, and there is as much implied consent to possible pregnancy as there is stepping into a boxing ring and being possibly punched. This said, with consent to pregnancy and knowing that the fetus is a human being by the most basic of definitions, it is morally and ethically wrong to kill this human being except, again, in dire circumstance. The pro-life stance is not telling women what to do, and it is not an issue for women alone. NOBODY should kill a fetus, be it a priest, a doctor, a man, a woman, black or white. It is no more an invasion of rights and privacy than laws against murder, barring a cruel, malicious act of violence against other human beings. I agree whole heartedly with you. I also find that most women who say they are "raped" are just trying to provide an escape for what they know they did was wrong. More or less a justification of getting an abortion. Pure psychology would say that if a woman was even arguing that they had an abortion because of said "rape" they were never really "raped" but half heartedly consented to sex but didn't really know what they were getting themselves into, because the fact that women who were actually truthfully raped are to ashamed and scared to admit they were raped. Or maybe the ones that actually were raped don't want to go through all of the memories again only to be ridiculed by those who would blame them for something they had no control over. I hope you never say what you just did to any woman who claims to have been raped because if she was raped, you blaming her is only going to cause more emotional trauma.
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:31 pm
Shiori Miko xxEternallyBluexx DaikonNairu -Ren- xxEternallyBluexx And anyway God gave us the animals to do what we would with, but we're not supposed to murder each other. So, there's nothing wrong with animal cruelty in the eyes of your god? You could leave a dog in a hot car without the windows rolled down for 8 hours or more and that would be fine? No that's sick and wrong. sad We're supposed to be responsible for animals, but killing a mosquito is fine. Humans come before animal, but animals should be looked after because He gave us stewardship over them. I'll keep that in mind if I ever come across both a serial killer and a search dog in distress. Humans first. rolleyes Well, yeah humans first. Even if it's a completely horrible serial killer versus a loving dog. According to my belief, nothing bad happens to an animal who dies, but bad things can happen to people, so I'd choose to keep the human alive over the dog just because I know the dog would be cared for, while the man needs a chance to find salvation. And society disagrees with your belief that animals and people are equal. That's why the punishment for child abuse is worse then the punishment for animal abuse. And what makes an organism important?
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 7:19 pm
xxEternallyBluexx Shiori Miko xxEternallyBluexx DaikonNairu -Ren- xxEternallyBluexx And anyway God gave us the animals to do what we would with, but we're not supposed to murder each other. So, there's nothing wrong with animal cruelty in the eyes of your god? You could leave a dog in a hot car without the windows rolled down for 8 hours or more and that would be fine? No that's sick and wrong. sad We're supposed to be responsible for animals, but killing a mosquito is fine. Humans come before animal, but animals should be looked after because He gave us stewardship over them. I'll keep that in mind if I ever come across both a serial killer and a search dog in distress. Humans first. rolleyes Well, yeah humans first. Even if it's a completely horrible serial killer versus a loving dog. According to my belief, nothing bad happens to an animal who dies, but bad things can happen to people, so I'd choose to keep the human alive over the dog just because I know the dog would be cared for, while the man needs a chance to find salvation. And society disagrees with your belief that animals and people are equal. That's why the punishment for child abuse is worse then the punishment for animal abuse. And what makes an organism important? Really? You'd save the one that might turn around and kill you right after? If it were choice between my dog or a stranger I'd probably go with my dog. If it was a random cute little puppy over a known serial killer, I'd probably save the cute little puppy dog. I wonder what the legal implications would be.
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