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This is totally my opinion (so don't be mad), but....

What's the big deal about this? Both Kingdom Hearts and Final Fantasy were made by the same people, so why not combine them? I thought it was awesome to see Cloud teaming up with Squall or Sora to fight the Heartless and Nobodies. Aerith was probably thrown in there to bring out the soft side in Cloud (I don't know....it's just a guess sweatdrop )

Anyway, to have the world of Final Fantasy and Disney mix together like that made me proud of the game. If there were no final fantasy characters, then i wouldn't even bother with the game. Those characters were a lifesaver to the game (again, my opinion)

I know it's confusing to alot of people that Aerith was thrown in although she died, but she is totally awesome. Seeing Tifa was also great.With all the other FF characters, i believed the game to be a great success and i hope to see more in the future.

sorry for revolting you, please don't be mad. i was just expressing my view on the whole KH/FF deal. If i offended anyone else, i'm sorry

I can see the reasoning in both arguments. I personally don't enjoy the fact they were combined, just where does Sephiroth fit in here? Or any other characters, I mean, by introducing Squall and the others early, it makes it less awkward, but since when do the characters of Final Fantasy come from Hallow Bastion? Is Hallow Bastion even in the Final Fantasies?

cloud's costume in kh1 was different because it was symbolic of his feeling like he needed to redeem himself, much like vincent hence why he's got vince's cape and gauntlet.

he says at one point that he made a deal with hades, and that was why he was in the colliseum, i've always interpreted his deal for his services to hades as he bargained to bring aerith back.

and seph DID have the wing in the original game, remember those lovely freakish final forms? and in CC it's explained WHY several people end up with wings along the way. sephiroth's theme song wasn't "One winged angel" just because it sounded cool, he had a wing.

he also has buttwings in KH, which i'm still not sure if i'll ever forgive them for, but he was the ultimate badass once you ignored the crappy dialogue and got into getting MAULED in midair fifteen times before you could even lift your keyblade.

overall, KH is more a geek value game, it's fun for all ages and has random cameos by all your favs from setzer to tron, who they actually got bruce boxleitner back for his voice. ^_^

a LOT of the characters got makeovers and a thorough watering-down in some places for KH. (cid's kh1 outfit... ewwww wtf... X_X)

it's all an alternate universe anyway, so just go with it and enjoy the randomness the way you would a questionable fanfic.

I wasn't aware that so many people didn't like the Final Fantasy characters appearing in Kingdom Hearts. sweatdrop Then again, with the points that you've given, I can certainly see why.

However, I just never really saw it that way. I was under the impression that the Final Fantasy characters who made their appearances were ones that were all extremely popular, and put in because of that because it would please the most people. They'd try to incorporate said characters into the game in a manner that wouldn't clash with the main story or steal the limelight away from the main characters. I was (and still am) more appalled by certain character's voice acting than anything else about them (Cid and Aerith in particular).

All the plot inconsistencies in the original stories for the Final Fantasy characters and, even more so, the Disney characters, I attributed to the fact that the game is essentially an alternate universe. You have Disney worlds that share the basic premise as their original story, but a lot of t hem are altered because of outside interference. In this case, said interference was the Heartless, Xehanort, Maleficent, and eventually, Sora and his friends. Also, with the way some characters speak, it is implied that they are already at the point in their life that takes place after where the "movie" ends for them.

Mind you, I'm completely ignoring all those crappy sequels that Disney keeps churning out for Cinderella and The Little Mermaid, but I digress...

Regarding the behavior of Disney characters that is considered out of canon with their original self (most notably with Maleficent), I again say "alternate universe". Some of their behaviors have to change with the story as the events unfold, otherwise some characters just wouldn't make any sense. Not that some of them still don't, but that's besides the point. xd

The targeted demographic for the game probably doesn't help the story either. They have had to simplify the story for the first game because they knew young children were going to play it. They would not give your main character a sword because young children were going to play it, and you know how some parents love to throw up a huge, pardon my language, s**t storm, every time something like that comes up. I think that they were under the impression that with Kingdom Hearts II, the story should grow up a little with Sora, since he too is also growing up (and theoretically, the children who are playing this game). Chain of Memories was supposed to fill in the gaps between the first and second Kingdom Hearts.

I was fine with the game, although I can definitely see where you're coming from with all the flaws that the game does have. I wouldn't necessarily blame every single thing that is wrong with the game on Nomura, since the game was done as a partnership between Square-Enix and Disney, and Disney was the one who said what they could or couldn't do with their characters. Square-Enix is a business, and if they have a new franchise that's making a lot of money and selling like crazy, then you know they'll be damned to not produce a series out of it with sequels and spin-offs. Case in point: Final Fantasy VII.

There was, however, one thing that truly irked me, and would continuously nibble at the back of my mind as I played through the second Kingdom Hearts, though.

Since when did Sora become such a successful matchmaker? I mean, he's fourteen. He knows a lot about friendship, but not so much on the romantic kind of love that is shared between two lovers, I figure.

That is, unless there's another side of him that has yet to be unveiled by Square-Enix. One I hope not to see. >.>

Anyhow, since I believe most of the people who have posted already have done a great job in pointing out what they did or didn't like about Kingdom Hearts as a series (including myself), then I think we should go back on topic with the Final Fantasy VII characters, yes? biggrin

Hmm, it would appear so. sweatdrop Well, at least everyone here is thorough, yes? I think that bodes good for the guild and it's future discussions. Besides, this thread did bring some good points to light, and in an intelligent manner as well.

After reading every post, I agree as well. Lots of good points were brought up, discussed, and debated.

Oh, and thank you for sharing your opinion as well, Ushigami and michigami. Your posts were an addition to the best I've read.

Thanks everyone. Wonderful discussion.

Thank you very much, T Terlain.