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Posted: Wed May 16, 2007 8:04 pm
No one can prove when life begins. It is up to the woman to decide.
Trying to rationalize abortion using this argument is utter nonsense. If we don’t know when life begins, then we can’t say it has begun at birth, or at age five, or at 50. By this logic, the law could never convict someone for murdering a 30-year-old woman because there is no way to prove that she was alive.
The fact is, no scientific, biological, or medical textbook says that life begins at any point other than conception. Further, simple deductive reasoning proves that life begins at conception because that is the only time it can begin. Any other point is strictly arbitrary.
However, even if it were true that no one can prove when life begins, that is not a justification for legalized abortion.
The pro-life position is that the unborn should be left alone. Obviously, a person does not have to prove anything about the unborn in order to justify taking that view. On the other hand, the pro-choice position is that it should be legal to butcher the unborn by the millions because no one can prove that they are living human beings. To appreciate just how irrational this is, imagine that the judge and jury in a capital murder case sentenced a man to death because no one could prove that he was not guilty. The public would be justifiably enraged. They understand that the state is the one taking action and that, therefore, the burden of proof belongs to them. The prosecution is required to prove that the man is guilty in order to convict him, but the defense has no obligation to prove anything in order to justify leaving him alone.
In other words, our judicial system is designed to err on the side of life. We would rather let a thousand murderers go free, than execute even one innocent person.
The question is why we don’t apply this standard to the unborn. Why aren’t we saying to the pro-choice mob, “Before we’ll let you kill the unborn, you have to prove that they are not living human beings.” After all, to say that no one knows when life begins is, at the very least, an acknowledgement that it might begin at conception. Shouldn’t we leave the unborn alone until we find out for sure? Saying we can execute the unborn because no one can prove when life begins, is no different than saying we can execute an accused murderer because no one can prove he’s innocent.
Amazingly, when cornered on this, some abortion apologists will contend that abortion should be allowed even if we accept that the unborn are living human beings. The question then becomes, if the humanity of the unborn is irrelevant when deciding whether they can be killed, why is the humanity of a five-year-old relevant when making the same decision?
As for this brainless contention that women must be allowed to decide when the lives of their children have begun, imagine two children who are conceived at the same moment. Three months later, one mother talks about her baby, knows its sex, has named it, and has even seen it on an ultrasound screen. The other mother believes that the life of her child hasn’t begun yet and decides to have it killed by abortion. The pro-choice mentality is that both mothers are right, despite the fact it is physically impossible for that to be true.
Also, if women are to be the ones who decide when life begins, why should they lose that right by giving birth? If a woman who sincerely believes that life doesn’t begin until speech is possible, kills her three-month-old daughter, should she be charged with murder? What makes her belief that life begins at speech less valid than another woman’s belief that life begins in the second trimester, or at birth, or at any other arbitrarily chosen point? And what gives society the right to charge this woman with murder, while saying that women are the ones who decide when life begins?
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Posted: Wed May 16, 2007 8:10 pm
 
.::Ebonysays::. Do you have a fanlist? heart
If not, I'm #1, 'kay? .::[/Ebony]::. 
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Posted: Wed May 16, 2007 11:02 pm
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 2:39 am
Yes! I'm so glad you posted these!
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:15 pm
Ebony the Peacian Vampire  
.::Ebonysays::. Do you have a fanlist? heart
If not, I'm #1, 'kay? .::[/Ebony]::.   If only I had some more fans! LOL! Well I didn't write these but I love how upfront this guy is on the arguments!
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:32 pm
This is for the more religious debates!
The Bible does not condemn abortion and Jesus never spoke out against it.
To suggest that the Bible is silent on abortion is a lie. In both the Old and New Testaments, the language used to describe born and unborn people is the same. For example, in Luke 1:41, the unborn John the Baptist is called a “brephos” which means “babe” or “baby” in Greek. Then, in the very next chapter, the born Jesus is also called a “brephos.” We are also told that Elizabeth’s baby leapt in her womb upon being in the presence of Mary. Should we conclude that this makes no statement about the unborn? If so, and if the Bible is silent on abortion, then it is logical to also conclude that Scripture is indifferent about whether these women would have aborted Jesus and John the Baptist. After all, by pro-choice reasoning, at this point they didn’t even exist. (A few Scriptural references to the unborn include: Genesis 25:22-24; Job 31:15; Psalm 22:9-10; Psalm 139:13-16; Jeremiah 1:5; Hosea 12:2-3; Luke 1:15; Luke 1:41; and Exodus 21:22-24.)
Moreover, not every word Jesus uttered is recorded in Scripture so there is no way to know whether He ever addressed abortion or not. We should also remember that there is no record of Jesus ever speaking out against slavery – a point which apologists for slavery routinely made. In fact, most of our laws relate to behaviors which neither Jesus nor the Bible specifically addressed.
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:32 pm
 
.::Ebonysays::. Goddangit. xD I was tired that day.
Well, I'm still a fan of yours, 'cause you posted this. This is amazingly helpful. .::[/Ebony]::. 
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:34 pm
Government should stay out of abortion. Don’t subsidize it and don’t prohibit it.
That’s as irrational as saying that if we neither subsidize nor prohibit lynching black people, we’re staying out of racism.
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:35 pm
The fetus is only a potential human life.
Only through mind-numbing stupidity could someone suggest that when human sperm and human eggs unite they produce something that is only “potential human life.” If the word “potential” is suggesting that the unborn is only potentially alive, that is easily disproved. Even in the earliest stages of pregnancy, sonograms show movements and heartbeats that do not belong to the woman. Whatever else the fetus is, it is impossible to logically argue that it is not, at least, alive.
On the other hand, for “potential” to be referring to the word human, a fetus would have to have the potential of becoming either a human being or some other form of life. Perhaps a parrot or a spider. Of course, the problem is that there is no record of such a thing having ever occurred.
So while it may be reasonable to say that a fetus is a potential major league baseball star or a potential school teacher, it is idiotic to say that a fetus is a potential human being. If for no other reason, the fetus is a living human being because that is the only thing it can be.
Also, if the issue is “development,” let’s not forget that human beings develop for their entire lives. A fetus is less developed than a newborn just as a child is less developed than an adult. But being less developed than an adult does not mean that a child is any less a human being. That’s also true of the unborn.
Pro-lifers aren’t the only ones who know that it is a baby who is killed in an abortion. At a National Abortion Federation conference in Philadelphia during September of 1994, Texas abortion clinic director, Charlotte Taft, said, “When [a pro-choice activist in the Dallas community] came into our clinic – we were inviting her to learn more about abortions – this is a quote from this woman – she said, ‘If I believed that abortion was the deliberate ending of a potential human life, I could not be pro-choice.’ I said, ‘It would be best for you not to see a sonogram.’”
Less than two years later, at another National Abortion Federation conference in San Francisco, a New York abortion clinic director, Merle Hoffman, stated “...I mean, we are talking about an abortion here. And uh, also that the staff is uncomfortable when a patient said, ‘I think I’m killing my baby.’ So I’m comfortable with saying, ‘Yes, you are, and how do you feel about that?’”
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:36 pm
Doctors don’t do abortions for the money. Abortions are about $300 but a doctor can make thousands for a delivery.
First, only the earliest abortions can be bought for $300. Later ones can reach $5,000 to $10,000. But even if an abortionist only kills the youngest babies, it doesn’t require a degree in economics to figure out that $300 for ten minutes work is more than $5,000 for nine months work.
Second, when you look at the history of most abortionists, what you find is that they are not only moral degenerates, but also the washouts and losers of medicine. When a person’s medical career has deteriorated to the point of working at an abortion clinic, the choice he or she has is not between doing abortions or delivering babies, but between doing abortions or being out of work. The fact is, without the abortion business, these people would be washing BMWs, not driving them.
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:37 pm
Have you pro-lifers ever thought about the possibility that you may be wrong?
Any rational human being considers that possibility regarding any position they take. However, this question is better suited for our opponents. If the pro-life movement is wrong, then we are guilty of trying to deny women a constitutional right. But if the pro-choice side is wrong, then they are directly responsible for the mass murder of innocent children. So the question is, would it be better to be pro-life and wrong or pro-choice and wrong?
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:39 pm
I’m pro-choice but I’m uncomfortable with the idea of women having multiple abortions.
Today, even the abortion industry's own statistics show that almost half of all abortions are repeats, and that it is not uncommon for women to have several abortions. These revelations have forced the pro-choice crowd into "damage control" mode. They have always said that abortion would never be used as birth control, and that women would use it responsibly and only in the rarest of circumstances. For them to now defend repeat abortions would not only confirm the fact that they’ve been lying all these years, it would also be a public relations nightmare
So, their damage control strategy is to create the illusion that even they don't support women having multiple abortions. The good news is, their new position is both illogical and easily exposed.
Imagine that five individual women had their first abortion today, and a sixth woman had her fifth abortion. According to the abortion lobby's newly concocted standard, what the five women did is okay but the sixth woman's behavior is unacceptable. The obvious flaw is that, in both cases, the same number of abortions happened. In short, by abortion industry reasoning, it is okay for five women to kill five children but wrong for one woman to kill five children.
The reality is that repeat abortions are a natural and logical progression of the pro-choice mentality. After all, if elective abortion is morally defensible, and if it is not the taking of an innocent human life, then there is no rational basis for saying that it is wrong for a woman to have 10 or 20 or a hundred of them.
In the final analysis, abortion is either right or it's not, and how often it happens has no bearing on that question. Further, it is naked hypocrisy for the choice mafia to sell abortion as a constitutional right which protects women, and then turn around and criticize those women who freely - or even repeatedly - exercise that right
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:39 pm
Outlawing abortion will not end it. Women will always have abortions.
Using this sort of mindless logic, nothing should be illegal. After all, outlawing rape, armed robbery, murder, and car theft has not stopped them either. So if we are only going to implement those laws that are 100% effective, by the pro-choice gang’s reasoning we should make these things legal as well.
The reality is, laws are enacted because society has determined that the behavior in question is abhorrent, not because society believes the law can completely eradicate it.
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:41 pm
Don’t like abortion? Don’t have one.
This sort of arrogance is typical of people who recognize that their pro-choice position cannot be defended on its own merits. Of course, it must be difficult trying to make the practice of turning mothers of live babies into mothers of dead babies seem appealing.
However, this “don’t like – don’t have” idea has possibilities. In fact, it’s a concept the pro-life movement could enthusiastically support. All we ask is that the same offer be extended to the unborn. That only seems fair given that every time a mom has an abortion her baby also has one. Since it seems unlikely that unborn children like abortion, under this “don’t like – don’t have” philosophy they should be given the option of not having one.
That brings up an interesting question. Would all these people who call themselves pro-choice still be pro-choice if they were the ones being chosen? If it were possible to place them back into their mom’s wombs, and then interview them there, would they still have this cynical “don’t-like-abortion-then-don’t-have-one” attitude? Would they still be making this sort of moronic statement if they were the ones who might be ripped apart alive, ground up in a garbage disposal and flushed down the city sewer system?
MOUSE OF WATER QUOTE: Well thanks for the comments but remember it's not me, it is the site that I copy and paste and all rights are reserved to it, located on the first page!
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Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:43 pm
The fact that the Ku Klux Klan is pro-life shows just what kind of bigots oppose legal abortion.
To appreciate how abysmally stupid statements like this are, imagine that the Klan announced that they oppose adultery. Should we then conclude that anyone who opposes adultery is a racist?
Actually, what these abortion apologists need to be thinking about is the fact that even Klansmen have enough morals to be against the slaughter of children. While that may not say much about the Klan, it certainly speaks volumes about the pro-choice crowd.
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