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Thank you Hikaru. I cant find the right codec anywhere for my version of the movie now. Im pissed.

It's not about Barret being black it that he's obviously a father figure to Tifa.



She says and dose just about everything except to say I love you. It's not her fault if Cloud's slow. Even Aeris says that he's slow.



Wrong. I hate Akane from Ranma 1/2 but I know that her and Ranma are a cannon couple and that they love each other. And even if I liked Aeris and hated Tifa I still see more to Cloud and Tifa's relationship the Cloud and Aeris's relationship.



Well lets see. When Aeris first meets Cloud they start talking and end up on the subject of Tifa. In which Cloud has the opportunity to say "Tifa is my girlfriend" or "Tifa's not my girlfriend" but either way it seems to peek Aeris's interest. Also while getting back to sector 7 She brings up Tifa's name at least 4 different times. Then Aeris finally meets Tifa and it's pretty obvious that Tifa and Cloud have some romantic feelings toward each other no mater how small they might be at this point. Aeris sees this and what dose she do. She makes like she's Tifa's friend while completely disregarding her obvious feelings toward Cloud and proceeds to be all flirty with him right in front of her. Now if that's not two-face I don't know what is.



It's one thing to be comforting and caring but it's something else completely when you abnormally happy even if something really horrible happened. Why do you think Barrit got so pisted of at her when she told him to just forget it. She's very inconsiderate of others feelings.



Oh really tell me one time where you saw a Goth and a prep go out with each other and didn't break up because of their personality clashing. I bet you can't tell me one because it's just not done.



You know I have just finished watching my friend play FF8 for the second time since the first time I saw it played back in the day and I must say that the only thing that she dose like Aeris is flirt. Renoa is neither loud or overly happy in times of heart ship like Aeris. Why you keep comparing Aeris to Renoa I'll never know I mean not only dose she look almost exactly like Tifa but she's quiet and soft spoken like her. Like I said the only similarity she has to Aeris is the flirty part. As far as the whole two face thing; That was impossible since their wasn't any other love interest and if your thinking about Quistis she's not even a factor because she was never in love with Squall she only liked him for a little bit.



Ahh twisting things around again. She wasn't telling him to get over it. She was telling him that he shouldnt run away from the people he loves just because he thinks he can't protect them.



Tifa did what no one else would do she told him the truth of what he was doing right to his face. And I will quote what LunarSong said earlier.

Cloud:I feel lighter now. I must of lost weight... all that dilly dally.
Tifa: *smiles*

Cloud TOOK Tifa's advice.

SO that's that



This is completely false. Tifa didn't even want Cloud to go to solder and you can tell this by reading her dialogs when they were at the well. Cloud get the idea of going to solder all by himself. And even when Zack "A REAL SOLDER" came along was she intrigued by him? No. All she cared about was Cloud. Tifa could give a rip weather he was in Solder or not.



This can also be said for Zack and Aeris too.



Wrong. Zack was still in love and sort of dating Aeris at the time and Tifa obviously had strong feelings for Cloud. So again nothing would have happened.

ramnaxhikaru

Wrong. I hate Akane from Ranma 1/2 but I know that her and Ranma are a cannon couple and that they love each other. And even if I liked Aeris and hated Tifa I still see more to Cloud and Tifa's relationship the Cloud and Aeris's relationship.

I dont really like ramna so I wont talk about it
and I dontwant another debate to start

ramnaxhikaru

Well lets see. When Aeris first meets Cloud they start talking and end up on the subject of Tifa. In which Cloud has the opportunity to say "Tifa is my girlfriend" or "Tifa's not my girlfriend" but either way it seems to peek Aeris's interest. Also while getting back to sector 7 She brings up Tifa's name at least 4 different times. Then Aeris finally meets Tifa and it's pretty obvious that Tifa and Cloud have some romantic feelings toward each other no mater how small they might be at this point. Aeris sees thisher obvious feelings toward Cloud and what dose she do. She makes like she's Tifa's friend while completely disregarding and proceeds to be all flirty with him right in front of her. Now if that's not two-face I don't know what is.

thats not a twoface >>
a two face would be someone who is nice one side while they are also evil
and the people around them only see one of those sides
and in time theywill be decieved
thats not aerith
and there was no confirmation that they were anything beyond friends
plus Aerith didnt even know Tifa, so its not like she knew that she liked Cloud
and there is no law that you cant flirt with a guy that you like
so I see nothing wrong
plus if tifa really thought her and Cloud had something
she would've said something
and I'm pretty sure if she knew that they had something she would let them be
but they didnt so thats that

ramnaxhikaru

It's one thing to be comforting and caring but it's something else completely when you abnormally happy even if something really horrible happened. Why do you think Barrit got so pisted of at her when she told him to just forget it. She's very inconsiderate of others feelings.

she isnt abnormally happy! show me when she is
she didnt say to forget to be insentive she just wanted him to not dwell on the past and looks towards the future
bad things always happen but you just have to stay positive and work for tommorow
and how is she incosiderate of others feelings? she's really sweet and people are drawn to her mother-like nature

ramnaxhikaru

Oh really tell me one time where you saw a Goth and a prep go out with each other and didn't break up because of their personality clashing. I bet you can't tell me one because it's just not done.

and you're sterotyping
cloud is not the king of depression
nor is aerith the queen of mary sueness
they arent complete opposites
its a good balance
and I have seen opposite couples work
just becuase it doesnt work out for celebrites
it can work out inreal life

ramnaxhikaru

You know I have just finished watching my friend play FF8 for the second time since the first time I saw it played back in the day and I must say that the only thing that she dose like Aeris is flirt. Renoa is neither loud or overly happy in times of heart ship like Aeris. Why you keep comparing Aeris to Renoa I'll never know I mean not only dose she look almost exactly like Tifa but she's quiet and soft spoken like her. Like I said the only similarity she has to Aeris is the flirty part. As far as the whole two face thing; That was impossible since their wasn't any other love interest and if your thinking about Quistis she's not even a factor because she was never in love with Squall she only liked him for a little bit.

I've played ffviii and beaten it myself but anyways
tifa is nothing lke rinoa! except for looks which really does matter
Squall is the brooding, dark soldier with a mysterious past. He is very much of an introvert and a loner, never opening up to anyone. Sound familiar? It should, because he acts exactly like Cloud. He even has the same job-- he is a mercenary (Squall was hired to protect and help out Rinoa; Cloud was hired by Aerith to be her bodyguard). Heck, he even carries an oversized weapon and has Limit Breaks that are reminiscent of Cloud's. During the course of the game, Squall begins to open up to Rinoa, much in the same way Cloud opened up to Aerith and was able to laugh and cry. Squall's moment of greatest emotional breakdown was when he thought he had lost Rinoa, saying to her:

"(Rinoa... You feel so cold. Are you going to be like this forever?)... Isn't there anything I can do?! You were so full of life. Now you don't even make a sound. I want to hear your voice...."

Compare that to Cloud's speech at Aerith's death (the moment of Cloud's greatest show of emotion)::

"... Aerith. This can't be real!" "Aerith is gone. Aerith will no longer talk, no longer laugh, cry... or get angry.... What about us? What are WE supposed to do? What about my pain? My fingers are tingling. My mouth is dry. My eyes are burning!"

-Rinoa is the cheerful, optimistic, and flirtatious daughter of a noted general. Just like Aerith, Rinoa is someone of importance, often referred to as "princess" (Aerith was the last of the Cetra, and the rightful heiress to the planet). I have heard CloTis attempt to compare Rinoa with Tifa. This is absolutely laughable, because Rinoa is nothing like Tifa. She has dark hair and eyes. That is the only way Rinoa resembles Tifa. In all other things, Rinoa is just like Aerith. Tifa was an introvert; Aerith and Rinoa are extroverts. Tifa could not express her feelings to Cloud; Aerith and Rinoa are outspoken and flirtatious with Cloud and Squall. Tifa was a physical fighter; Aerith and Rinoa are both mages. I am only scratching the surface here, too.

It is also interesting to note that Squall and Rinoa made their promise to each other in a flower field. They promised to be reunited there. And just who is associated with flowers, Tifa or Aerith? Aerith, of course! In fact, Aerith is shown meeting with Cloud in a field full of flowers in FFVII: Advent Children

ramnaxhikaru

Ahh twisting things around again. She wasn't telling him to get over it. She was telling him that he shouldnt run away from the people he loves just because he thinks he can't protect them.

I know that what she meant
but the way she was getting the message across
wasnt the best way for cloud

ramnaxhikaru

Tifa did what no one else would do she told him the truth of what he was doing right to his face. And I will quote what LunarSong said earlier

Cloud:I feel lighter now. I must of lost weight... all that dilly dally.
Tifa: *smiles*

Cloud TOOK Tifa's advice.

SO that's that

do you really think Cloud felt lighter only with what Tifa told him?
no
he for himself with had to stop dragging
with help not from just tifa, from aerith and vincent...everyone

ramnaxhikaru

This can also be said for Zack and Aeris too.

but you see it didnt work out for zack and aerith
and they both moved on

ramnaxhikaru

Wrong. Zack was still in love and sort of dating Aeris at the time and Tifa obviously had strong feelings for Cloud. So again nothing would have happened.

I dont think that he was still in love with her
because wouldn't he have mentioned her to cloud even once?
he didnt
and neither in advent children did he ever talk to her in a way to show romantic feelings
walking through the same doesnt mean they are in love
they are both dead and were walking back to the lifestream
plus I think that zack and tifa are waay more compatiable

I praise you all the way! blaugh What a beautiful analysis! I'm so glad there is a strong Cloti supporter!

If I recall correctly, she spouted on about hating Shinra, Mako reactors, and several other things, then looked directly at Zack and said, "Even you too." Or something like that. Thats clear enough that she hates him to me. And if it was fueled by emotion, that would make it that much stronger in her conviction towards it.

And where does it say I HAVE to have a good reason? I posted my opinion. I dont have to explain myself if I choose not too.

Isn't there another one of these?
Anyway... one key point missed with uncannon couplings is that the pairing is based off of character psychology instead of events. Like with the Aeriroth coupling... some people see compatible psychology. (I don't see it... but to each their own.)
If you must use events against my favorite coupling more viable ones would be that Zack is died and only knew Tifa for the span of a tragic. As for the Last Order thing... there's one very BIG problem with using Last Order as evidence for anything. Last Order had many incongerancies(sp?) with the orginal FF7 story.... ex: Sephiroth jumping into the mako instead of Cloud throwing him off a sword into it.... or Tifa meeting and talking to Cloud... he was there but Tifa didn't know this. Small statement aren't very crediable from Last Order.
Even if they were... extreme statement in tragic events isn't uncommon... I'm sure in highly emotional states we have all said that we've hated someone we didn't mean (parents, sibling, etc.) especially at the highly emotional and confused age of fifteen. Such statements comes from association than actual hate... Sephiroth kills father, I hate Sephiroth, Sephiroth is SOLDIER, I hate SOLDIER, Zack is SOLDIER, I hate Zack. Association... not particularly actual hate.
I stated eariler... this is my favorite pairing... I think a romantic relationship is something Tifa needs... and psychologically, Cloud is not compatiable for Tifa... as stated in another thread... Cloud and Tifa is like using a goat to lead a sheep to the pin.

ok I want you ALL to read this, Amylin posted this on the original zack and tifa thread

Not really... brave yes... but Tifa starting a bar and joining a resistance group because of her past does not prove her to be strong.... in fact as you play through the game it proves quite the opposite. When people are confronted with things that make them weak (fears, trauma, sadness, etc) and they don't deal with these things a number of things occur. Some people only do one or two... Tifa does four; avoidance, regression, anger displacement, and repression.
I'll start with regression... regression is when someone is faced with a weakness (that's the term I'll use) or something that maybe associated with such a person will revert to a child-like state. Tifa is not an extreme in this case, but she does regress. That comes from her emotional dependency on Cloud(which is a contributing factor to her break downs). "Cloud will save me." "Cloud is here so everything will be all right." "Cloud, what will we do?" "Cloud, you're so brave." These are all actual Tifa quotes... clear sign of dependency regression; or damsel symdrome. Just as Aeris is a sort of physical damsel; Tifa is an emotional damsel.
When Cloud was present she emotionally depended on him almost as if he were a father. This is very common when women suffer trauma regarding their fathers in childhood as Tifa did. However, in Cloud's absense Tifa would practice repression... otherwise know as bottling it up. Tifa suffered two different stages of repression; masking and convenient memory. This is what lead to a lot of Tifa bashers labeling Tifa a liar. Masking is when a person hides their feelings... generally these people will put on happy faces or faces they think will lead to acceptance. They also will try taking on the problems of others as means of feeling better about their own weakness. Her case of convenient memory relates to her childhood with Cloud. Before her breakdown, Tifa consantly talked of her a Cloud being close childhood friends. She didn't lie because she in a sense forced herself to believe this to suit her emotional dependency on Cloud. Again this can and, in Tifa's case, did contribute to breakdowns.
And Tifa's repression at the beginning leads to avoidance... many times to avoid weaknesses or thoughts there of people will take on a project. This allows subjects to disconnect from the weakness. A sort of, "If I ignore it it will go away." Running a business is a very good way to do this.
Unfortunately, with Tifa's case, since she associated ShinRa with her weaknesses; this lead to aggression. Displaced anger from Sephiroth to ShinRa and further displaced to the reactors. I'm not saying Tifa wasn't against the reactors.... they were part of her association. She more than likely felt on a subconscious level that destroying the reactors was hurt Sephiroth some how.
This act of her joining this resistance group also accounts for her and Barret's emotional weakness... or disturbance would be more accurate. Attacking the reactors as much as we all (including myself) hate to admit it... are terrorist acts. Terrorist attacks both involve both enemy and a 3rd party... many excuse the third party as a nessicary sacrifice, claim it so be part of the problem, or ignore it all together. The third option is what happened in FF7. IF the attacks are examined objectively it is a testiment to the mental and emotional stablity of the group. neutral
Tifa is a great person and character... faults and all. But excusing faults or ignoring never help the situation. At least she is more stable than Cloud.