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 Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 2:03 pm
My personal 2 cents on this whole issue:
I work in a local mall, so I'm around stores all day, including stores for tweens and all that. A lot of the clothing I see makes me want to throw up. And I see a LOT of kids who are walking around in high heels or tight shirts, and it makes me want to walk up to the parent and ask them where the hell their brain is.
I was with my boyfriend and a couple of friends at the mall once, and we saw a mother with her child, who was no older than 4 or 5. The kid was wearing a mini-skirt, to the point of when she was walking, if she jumped or moved in a manner that caused her skirt to move, we could see the bottom of her butt cheeks. talk2hand
Seeing pre-teens and what they wear today serious scares me. Yesterday at work, I saw a girl with a parent, and she was wearing one of those half-shirts that tied up under the breasts. She had NO chest, and looked like she was maybe 10 or 11. No reason at all for her to be wearing a very sexual shirt and attempt tp emphasize something that wasn't even there yet.
And yes, while I agree the media has a huge role of children, I also think that the parents share some of the responsibility. My landlady and landlord (common-law) have a 10 year old daughter. The mother is very firm in what the daughter wears, and the father is too (though he's a bit more conservative) - if the daughter wants to wear something they doesn't approve of, she has to give it over to them, and they will give it to charity. Anything they think is "sexy" or inappropriate, she is not allowed to wear. And the daughter knows the rules - she understands them and very rarely puts up a fight when she's told she's not allowed to wear something.
So help me God when I have kids... ninja *not giving her daughter short skirts or tight clothing until she's in her mid-teens*
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Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 3:01 pm
wotfan Quote: My MIL and I get into this arguement all the time. I think like maybe 3 and unders running around nekkid at a beach or in the back yard in a sprinkler or kiddie pool is just good fun. That it's not a big deal. They're little kids nothing is sexual about their nekkidness. I am going to strongly disagree with this statement you may think thats its good clean fun, but there are sick twisted people out there and just because conventionally there is nothing sexual about there nakedness doesnt mean a sexual predator is going to agree, please use caution. People who prey on children sexually do so whether they are clothed or not. They are not specifically attracted to nakedness. Studies show that child predators choose their victims on completely other reasons, hair color, eye color, shape, clothing, skin tone, age, sex, size...etc. They are sick individuals. Now, could someone see my child and think of them sexually. Sure, BUT I can't control their thoughts, I can protect them from ACTIONS to the best of my ability whether they have been seen nude or not. FURTHER most sexual assault of minors happens by family members. Most assault, kidnapping, etc. period, happens by people you know. The odds some random on the beach is going to see my kids, follow me home and then try and break into my home and molest my children is both rediculous and paranoid. I don't agree with that "OMG TEH SEXUAL PREDATORS" nonsense, because it's reactionary garbage that is stealing innocence from our children. We get all het up about dangers that may or may not be there and shield them excessively from life. You don't need to plead for me to excercise cauction like I am some naive idiot. I know that the chance of my child being molested on the way to school at 13 is EXPONETIALLY higher than at 2 when she is never out of my sight (as a SAHM) for more than an hour at her nap time, regardless of whether some "pervert" sees her nude or not.
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Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:31 pm
wotfan Quote: My MIL and I get into this arguement all the time. I think like maybe 3 and unders running around nekkid at a beach or in the back yard in a sprinkler or kiddie pool is just good fun. That it's not a big deal. They're little kids nothing is sexual about their nekkidness. I am going to strongly disagree with this statement you may think thats its good clean fun, but there are sick twisted people out there and just because conventionally there is nothing sexual about there nakedness doesnt mean a sexual predator is going to agree, please use caution. That's like saying that the girl who wears a miniskirt and gets raped was "asking for it" because of the way she was dressed. A ***** is a ***** and he will be a ***** even if your child is clothed. Saying that we have to all go around wearing burkas because there might be a sexual predator out there is too extreme. From the child's perspective, it's innocent and it isn't sexual. Punishing them for running around their house naked doesn't solve anything and I honestly doubt that it will stop ***** class="quote"> Nikolita And yes, while I agree the media has a huge role of children, I also think that the parents share some of the responsibility. I agree. Like everything, I think it's much more complicated than "it's all because of X." I think a huge combination of factors, including media and lack of consistancy/communication/whatever from the parents, probably some dumb luck on who the kids happen to meet or get as a babysitter or whatever thrown in.
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Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 7:41 am
i think that it is rediculuse to blame the parents in setuations like this because people need to take into account how many things are brought into a childs world that their parents cant control like friends for example as parent we all know that we cant chose our kids friends but the best way in my oppinion to stop your child from dressing this way is to start early and be ferm dont let them dress that way and explain to them why they cant dress like that and with any hope by the time they reach their teen years you will have drilled these things into their heads enough were they make the right choices and dont dress that way
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Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:33 pm
RinoaRose i think that it is rediculuse to blame the parents in setuations like this because people need to take into account how many things are brought into a childs world that their parents cant control like friends for example as parent we all know that we cant chose our kids friends but the best way in my oppinion to stop your child from dressing this way is to start early and be ferm dont let them dress that way and explain to them why they cant dress like that and with any hope by the time they reach their teen years you will have drilled these things into their heads enough were they make the right choices and dont dress that way Quick reminder to please improve your typing skills when posting in this guild. It's one of the guild's rules as well, so if you're not clear about this, please go back and read the rules sticky on the guild's main page. Your entire post was one big run-on sentence, and I had a hard time understanding some of your spelling/grammar when reading your post. In regards to your post itself, parents still need to play a role. If their child is buying things that they don't approve of, then the parent needs to step in and say something about it. Take the clothes away, restrict their allowance if they have one, etc. Being passive about what one's child wears doesn't do any good. There's no "right" way to dress. I personally think it's more a matter of what is considered "appropriate." For example, I have a problem with toddlers being dressed in short skirts by their parents. I have a problem with tweens wearing clothes that accentuate a flat chest, because those clothes are made for someone who is older and more physically mature (ie - actually has breasts, etc). On the other hand, I see nothing wrong if a child wants to wear all black, or wear knee highs or stockings or wear lots of dark make-up, etc.
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Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:27 am
Nikolita RinoaRose i think that it is rediculuse to blame the parents in setuations like this because people need to take into account how many things are brought into a childs world that their parents cant control like friends for example as parent we all know that we cant chose our kids friends but the best way in my oppinion to stop your child from dressing this way is to start early and be ferm dont let them dress that way and explain to them why they cant dress like that and with any hope by the time they reach their teen years you will have drilled these things into their heads enough were they make the right choices and dont dress that way Quick reminder to please improve your typing skills when posting in this guild. It's one of the guild's rules as well, so if you're not clear about this, please go back and read the rules sticky on the guild's main page. Your entire post was one big run-on sentence, and I had a hard time understanding some of your spelling/grammar when reading your post. In regards to your post itself, parents still need to play a role. If their child is buying things that they don't approve of, then the parent needs to step in and say something about it. Take the clothes away, restrict their allowance if they have one, etc. Being passive about what one's child wears doesn't do any good. There's no "right" way to dress. I personally think it's more a matter of what is considered "appropriate." For example, I have a problem with toddlers being dressed in short skirts by their parents. I have a problem with tweens wearing clothes that accentuate a flat chest, because those clothes are made for someone who is older and more physically mature (ie - actually has breasts, etc). On the other hand, I see nothing wrong if a child wants to wear all black, or wear knee highs or stockings or wear lots of dark make-up, etc. Sorry about that sweatdrop . see i disagree with some of the statements you made like: Quote: On the other hand, I see nothing wrong if a child wants to wear lots of dark make-up I can understand were you are coming from but you have to take into cosideration the child's age. I mean I have seen tons of little 5 year old girls running around wearing heavy make-up(and those are usually the little girls dressed like sluts sweatdrop ) and i just dont agree with it. I mean sure I will allow my little girl to play dress up and put on that kind of make-up made for little girls but I personally would never let her leave the house wearing it(I wont even let her leave the house wearing lip gloss). In my oppinion little girl should NOT be allowed to wear anything that can be veiwed as sexual i.e. short bottoms, tight tops, high heels, and heavy make-up. And another thing you also have to take into account that sometimes parents dont know what their kids are wearing because lets face facts kids know how to hide things pretty well if they dont want us to know. I mean just because you send you daughter to school wearing one thing dosent mean that she is going to keep wearing it once she gets to school. I personally remember going to school every mourning and finding girls changing in the school bathroom and just because you dont buy those kind of cloths for your kids dosent mean that their friends parents dont buy them for their kids, and as we all know girls love to borrow and lend cloths to their friends.
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Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 9:05 pm
You do have good points. smile
I am sorry, I should have clarified myself a bit better. When I meant dark makeup, I meant something along the lines of 15 or 16 year olds wearing lots of black eyeliner and eyeshadow, etc. I don't see anything wrong with that, aside from the fact it can get them labelled a "goth" or something like that.
And I do agree with you completely on the other part - I do think that young children should not wear anything sexual. What happened to the good old day of kids wearing pants and a t-shirt? whee
And yes, kids can hide clothes they want to wear. Kids can be sneaky. But the parent still needs to play an active role in what their child wears. Some parents don't let their kids go shopping for clothes or go to the mall alone until they're a certain age, and so on.
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Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2006 6:36 am
Quote: And I do agree with you completely on the other part - I do think that young children should not wear anything sexual. What happened to the good old day of kids wearing pants and a t-shirt? icon_whee.gif See I miss those days to(thats why i bought a sewing machine). Now I make most of my daughters clothes for a few reasons: a) Its way cheaper than buying clothes for her(and that is very important to some one like me who has 3 kids and is raising them all alone) b) This way I can control exactally what she wears (because lets face facts I really dont want her looking at those kind of clothes because that could lead to her wanting to wear them) c) Its fun to watch her watching me making something she knows is just for her 4laugh
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Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2006 6:43 pm
I believe that it is the responsibility of the parents to instill their child with morals, self-respect and common sense, and to explain to them why certain things are wrong. This should be done at an early age. Not so early as two or something like that, because children that small can be easily overwhelmed trying to comprehend social 'rules.' At least by the time they enter school, though, so that the parents will be able to influence their child before everyone else has a chance.
My parents spoke to me about these things when I was a little girl, and I've never had a large problem with peer-pressure, bandwagon impulses, etc. Now, that isn't to say that everyone that is spoken to at a young age will have the same results, but I believe it helps.
As for the media and society, well, parents still have a large sphere of control. A parent's daughter can desire a short skirt, but that doesn't mean her parent will buy it for her. Also, they can explain just why they won't buy said skirt. Borrowing friends' clothes is another issue. Just because a child wants to dress a certain way, though, it doesn't mean that the media is entirely to blame. Many kids are very worried about what their peers think, and just want to fit in.
About the woman that forced her daughter to wear make-up and 'grownup' clothing, that's the sort of thing that sickens me. Don't children need to go at their own pace? Way to teach your kid how to think for herself, mom. :/
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Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:08 am
See I don't understand this borrowing or sneaking around stuff.
I NEVER did any of that. And it wasn't because I wanted to. It was because I knew...KNEW my parents (especially my mom) would be able to sniff out what I was doing and that I was lying.
I'm sorry, if you can't tell someone is lying to you or sneaking around doing something they aren't after observing them for awhile in your own home, you're not very observant.
I don't believe for a second these parents that get on tv saying "oh I just didn't know what johnny was doing.." No you were bad parents, you didn't PAY ATTENTION. If your child was being tormented DAILY at school and planning retaliation, UH there would have been CHANGES IN THEIR BEHAVIOR.
And most of the time parents just wave it off as "normal teenage stuff" Well while your average teen is a bit moody they're not DEPRESSED all the time and constantly raging or yelling at you for no reason. None of my friends had those types of strained relationships with our parents where we were sneaking out at night. We were GOOD kids because we had GOOD parents.
The ones that were your typical picture of teenage angst usually had parents that were either too permissive or too strict (did you know that out of a survey of children in Juvenile detention they found that juvenile offenders come equally from both types of homes), or just didn't care to pay attention to what their kids were doing even though their kids were crying out LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT WHAT BAD THINGS I AM DOING!
It may take you a bit to catch on to what your daughter is doing if she's changing clothes at school, if you really care. Walk her to class, make her sit in her seat until the bell rings. Talk to administration and teachers to make sure they catch her changing clothing and send her straight home if she's not in what you brought her to school in EVEN if it's still within school standards. She'll get the point real quick.
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Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 10:58 am
Nopen brings up a great point. I know I never had to do some sneaking around with clothing because my mother was ALL up in my life. Looking back it seemed so unfair and mean, but I know she meant well and I am very close to my mother. The one thing she was great with was my clothes, but then again I did the baggy clothes kind of thing back then. xd
I knew one guy, he was a good kid really, but he had his moments where he'd get in trouble. Now, I think that his father was a really involved dad, he would come and eat lunch with him and do random pop ins to the school to see how he was doing. While I don't have experience with raising a teenager myself, I do plan on being extremely involved in my child's life whether they like it or not, lol.
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Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:11 am
Quote: Well while your average teen is a bit moody they're not DEPRESSED all the time and constantly raging or yelling at you for no reason. First off its called PMS!!! Quote: Walk her to class, make her sit in her seat until the bell rings. Talk to administration and teachers to make sure they catch her changing clothing and send her straight home if she's not in what you brought her to school in EVEN if it's still within school standards. She'll get the point real quick. This is a really good idea BUT you have to take into consideration that most teachers dont have the time to watch what your child is wearing and some of them dont even care.
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Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:03 pm
RinoaRose Quote: Well while your average teen is a bit moody they're not DEPRESSED all the time and constantly raging or yelling at you for no reason. First off its called PMS!!! Actually, PMS is (usually) related to a female's period (menstrual cycle). http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/001505.htmThe website does say that other factors may contribute to PMS, such as cultural, biological, social, and psychological factors. However PMS does not exclusively mean that whenever a teenager is moody or depressed that they have PMS. The website also mentions: Quote: It occurs more often in women between their late 20s and early 40s, those with at least one child, those with a family history of a major depression disorder, or women with a past medical history of either postpartum depression or an affective mood disorder. So teenagers would most likely not fit into this description - though yes, I do understand that there are exceptions. On a final note, I would appreciate you not flipping out on other guild members whenever you disagree with them. One exclamation mark is fine - 2, 3 or more makes you come across as a spaz. Please try to monitor what you're typing. Thank you. smile
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Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:38 am
Quote: On a final note, I would appreciate you not flipping out on other guild members whenever you disagree with them. One exclamation mark is fine - 2, 3 or more makes you come across as a spaz. Please try to monitor what you're typing. Thank you. icon_smile.gif I wasnt flipping out on anyone and if it came across that way I'm sorry.
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Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:51 am
RinoaRose Quote: Well while your average teen is a bit moody they're not DEPRESSED all the time and constantly raging or yelling at you for no reason. First off its called PMS!!! I disagree. Your child should NOT be acting like a b***h constantly. And frankly, I don't care what hormones were raging in you, it should not be ok to raise your voice at other people for no (or stupid) reasons. We're humans, that means we have the ability to control how we act, even if our hormones say something different. It's called "societization." You might have a slip up and snap and someone, but a parent who will let you just rampage around yelling and everyone all the time and being depressed and cutting herself and whatever else chalking it all up to "meh, it's probabably just PMS" is not being a good parent. Speaking of which, how the hell do some parents not notice that their children's arms are covered in scars?
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