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The Lady Shinigami Vice Captain
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 Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:07 am
Yep, I changed my username a long, long, long time ago. And I can change it to emperor shitz. *laughs* The fact that linking a stupid username to a group and using it as a leverage point for the wrong reasons is a little insulting Ree. You should know better than to make such a petty comment.
The Lady Shinigami.
Lady Death. In translation. Any of the 'lady' users of the clan could use the name.
Shinigami Clan. The clan of the gods of death.
Although I do see your point in the reference and advertisement of the username itself wherever I go. Same as your username no?
Partial leadership. Right just like Silver. And if she were the one in a fight, I'd back her up. 'Cuz Silver's cool. She's a good friend and we're family, clan. I would not embarrass her publicly while she's facing down her enemies.
I have not used my leadership beyond extending myself to people who've wanted to talk out frustrations or vent about one thing or another. I'm just nice like that. I have my views on things, when I can't decide I look at the evidence on both sides of the story and make a decision as to what I think is right -- with the help of talking it over with Guyy and Silver if need be.
The matter of fact is, I've only been around longer. That is all.
I figured we'd have problems if we gave out rankings and expectations like this were going to fly.
Hah, posting.. all I'm posting is ooc garbage these days. But I am also amused by it, otherwise I wouldn't be doing it.
People do what they do. Who they associate me with is who they associate me with. Who stays, who goes, where I go, where I stay... such is the rolling tide of life.
The rp - the sands- I've already long ago decided I'd be pulling out. Ever since there was mention of a cold war to break out and my characters were isolated. I was trying to pull my character out of play through plot but I got foiled in the process.
And sometimes I am not any better than that. I am not perfect. I will disappoint people, I will hurt people, I will show behaviour on occasion no one will agree with. It will happen. And when those times come as it has now, people will either accept me for even my faults or they will leave. And I am usually sorry that people end up going but they obviously can't or don't want to put in the effort to stick around anyway.
Because the bad sides of me are a part of me too and yeah they come out. Who doesn't have a bad side to them Ree? Maybe Silver... 'cuz she's just awesome like that. And Guyy. Yeah.. he's pretty cool too.
And if you won't accept me for my faults as well as my good sides, I'm sorry, that's your choice. What you do, is up to you.
What I have chosen to do, is stick around. I ignore the bad sides to people and accept the fact that they will eventually come to surface. And when they do as they seem to be doing now, I let people choose what path they will take.
I have learned the hard way this fact about people. And I still accept people for who they are for all their sides. And I don't put unrealistic expectations on people, I am hardly ever disappointed.
*sighs*
It's no secret Ree. There have been times before this where I've spoken out and you've had a problem with me.. like every time when it comes to ooc junk arguments.
You're the one always ranting at me to stand down and shut up and you make a big scene of it. Telling me always that you're disappointed in my behaviour and such. So far I've let it slide.
I have not seen, or remember, where you've actually stood up with me on a topic that actually mattered.
What offended me was the fact that you walked off in the previous post. You have your opinion, you stated it clearly, and frankly the clan fight you started in that thread made it look that much worse.
I don't have a problem with you differing in opinion.
I have a problem when there is a tantrum, as what was displayed there, shows up because of it.
Not back reading poses a huge problem when you are forming an opinion of a situation. You have to have both sides of the story to make a valid decision.
Just because 'Oh I hate drama, I'll just fight whoever is easiest to make stand down so that the drama stops' opportunity arises, doesn't give anyone the right to start in on an argument.
And even then, once a valid decision is made, you approach the person privately and express it. The rant was unprofessional. But these things happen.
Admittedly you are one of the best role players I've ever come across and no one wants to see you leave any role play or the clan. You have an astounding dynamic in being able to play so many different characters and really give each one their own unique personality and through them you've also twisted plots and have excellently portrayed emotion and have evoked the reader into sympathizing with the characters.
Hopefully we can come to an agree to disagree sort of arrangement, everyone stays and goes back to roleplaying as happily as they did before this all started.
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:29 am
For the first time in my life, I did not look forward to coming home to my clan.
Because I knew what was waiting for me.
The last thing I want is to lose members over this.
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The Lady Shinigami Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:21 am
I want to state it here, rather than in PM's...
Ree I do not hate you.
I don't hate people. I only accept the fact we all have faults. I am looking past the faults and saying I still want to be friends with you and everyone else.
I'm saying that I hope you'll accept me, as well, even for my faults.
I want us to be able to be comfortable in the fact even if we have disagreements over things, that we won't give up our friendship or the clan over it.
I am cool with people choosing to do what they will, but I don't find it cool when someone likes to bully others just for a fight for no reason. Which was what that whole thing was about.
When I'm riled up, I tend to slide on my control of not letting my emotions get in the way of things. I say things that hurt people. I realize this and in the moment, forget. We have all done it. Said something that hurts someone else, insulted, done something. Sometimes we really mean it, other times we don't and feel bad for it after and apologize.
It happens. It's something I tend to handwave.
...
how to explain it.. I don't fight entirely fair, although I am trying to learn to, it takes practice to learn to keep a cool head. Although the basics of not name calling or swearing or telling a person where to go during a fight... those I've gotten better with.
It's not something I've grown up with learning and it's not a naturally easy thing for me to do.
But I do want to work out issues. Probably better to do when emotions are not running so high.
I like ya Ree. You're a cool chick. I hope you stay. And I apologize for hurting you.
And I apologize for the fact that people see me as a leader. I may spin a good story, my character Kaori might be a shinigami senior. That was what the ranks were for.. IC only.
But I, Heather the roleplayer behind Kaori... yeah I'm not so different from you or anyone else in the clan. I've just been around longer is all. That is it. There's nothing fancy to it.
I don't have model behaviour all the time. We all slip up now and then. And a quiet note off to the side can prevent a lot of grief.
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:30 am
Now. Let's see.
We have an option here.
Either talk it out. Or let it drop.
I know for a fact that Kaori can seem confrontational. I also know she doesn't dislike any of the people involved in this discussion. Not at all.
We won't contest the name issue. A name is a name. I don't care what anyone calls themselves. Fair enough, Kaori's name does link her to the clan in a way. But it was her right to have that name. Just as it is Ree's right to have her name, and my right to have my name. It's better not to argue over that point at all, so it would probably be better dropped.
And yes, Kaori is my support, as is Silver. But leadership always boils down to me. Perhaps I do not make it clear enough sometimes because I enjoy the dynamic the group has. I'd hate to feel like some kind of dictator.
We're all people. We all have faults. The trick is not letting them control us. And that goes for each and every one of us. I have faults too. I'm way too soft when I should not be for example. I know if I wasn't this would never have gotten this far.
And Silver lacks self esteem, even though she's a wonderful person.
So. Maybe this would be an excellent chance for people to raise issues and voice opinions safe in the knowledge that nothing said in this thread is going to harm clan positions. I will not be issuing so much as a warning, unless it does turn to immature bickering.
I don't care whose mum smells worst. Etc.
I would however like to see you resolve this. You're all very valuable to me.
EDIT: Oh, Kaori posted and I didn't hit preview. xd
Thank you Kaori.
You summed it up well.
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The Lady Shinigami Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:46 am
sweatdrop yeah, I'm confrontational alright.. especially when personally assaulted for no reason. ... oops. sweatdrop
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:50 am
As mentioned, I believe you did have the right to stand up for yourself.
And it went a bit too far, partially due to your stubborn nature, and partially due to too many people putting in their opinion when it really should have stayed between the people involved.
But that's done now. Now we repair, which you are making a great start with by apologising. I know you didn't mean to be rude. *ruffles her hair and smiles*
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 3:00 am
I didn't receive an apology.
sad
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 3:21 am
Lent..
Honestly, you took stance against me. In the first place. And then brought it here.
Pointed fingers without knowing anything and did research after the damage.
I have the view that this argument was not started by me. And it's you to be apologizing for it.
At this moment, what I said to you in retaliation, still stands.
So. What I'd like to know is, have you gotten all caught up with the events from the very beginning? And do you still have the same view?
Not that an apology from me will come depending on the answers. But the apology to you from me comes after yours.
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The Lady Shinigami Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 4:00 am
Kaori, I am highly offended you assume I didn't back read to begin with.
I did. Went back to where it had started on every single thread. Read every word. Every sentence.
I do not like for it to be implied that I am acting in ignorance when I am not. So let's avoid that.
I did take a stance against you, albeit a gentle and sensitive one until You started acting out aggressively towards Me.
My Post:
I see where you're coming from.
However, I don't think the problem stemmed from people letting it go. What contributed to the problem was people not letting it go and talking to other people about it. There were too many things taken for too personally. Things got out of hand and blown out of proportion and people over reacted.
At this point it seems to me all parties willing to step forward to have. Those who haven't don't plan to and will not. There is no point fretting and making an issue of something that wont change.
Normally I would take something like this to PM. But I think it's important that people see this as my stance.
I think everyone involved has been in the wrong. And I think everyone involved is ready to accept that and move on, Kaori. 3nodding
Your Post: It's good to bring out what you want to say. Whatever way is best.
Right, it got to the point that I was banned from black sands --for no reason. As I see it. Thus how can I be wrong for anything?
The only thing I can be wrong for is the way I delivered my anger and that was actually well calculated. It provoked the responses I wanted. And it's pretty much handwaved as far as Rosa and I are concerned.
I am not fretting. Quite contrary. I am smugly sitting back with my arms folded waiting to deal with fretting.
I am not ready to move on even if everyone else is.
What... am I to wait around for another no reason attack / baning to happen? and let everyone walk all over me? I think not. I'm sorry Lent but this is me attacking everyone else at this moment, in a challenge to stop acting like young adults and grow up. To behave like grown adults.
As you can see, my tone was much nicer than yours.
I took a stance against your actions as was my right. I made no damage. What you were doing was immature. I will continue to see it as immature. You were heckling, you were trolling.
I will not apologize for anything, because I said nothing in the slightest out of line to you.
I think all parties involved were incorrect on one level or another. And I have seen apologies from everyone I think who should be giving them with the exception of you. Even Impact came back and swallowed his ego, which we all know is considerable, and apologized.
The fact that after the fact that everyone else had moved on you continued harping on a dead issue is very disturbing to me, and I don't know why you would want to be involved in s**t stirring like that. Frankly, it doesn't seem like you.
Let me also take this chance to respond to your earlier post, which I have yet to do.
You have no right to be disappointed in me. If you are, I don't care, because quite frankly I only care if I disappoint people I respect, and at the moment it honestly saddens me to say you're not one of those people.
I have not placed you on a pedestal. I hold you to the same standards of decency I hold every other human being.
Your own thread? One moment you renounce any type of claim of leadership and then it is your thread? I will assume you mean this only in the sense of saying it is you home thread. So because you are home that makes it Okay? That is ridiculous. I don't care where or who you are, no one just has the right to be a troll. Which you were being, by the definition in the Gaia ToS, which I posted.
No one had anything to do with the argument, because the argument was already settled. You were the only one who wanted to drag it out into a long messy affair.
Impact did not troll you in anyway I saw. He banned you for a reason he saw fit, on a thread where it was his right to do so. Everyone involved was to blame for the tension that ensued before or afterward. He was man enough to apologize for that.
I laugh at the idea I am a troll when I was nothing less than civil to you. Kind even, at the beginning.
I have no problem with anyone standing up for themselves at the proper time or place, and what you were doing was neither of those as far as I am concerned. As I stated, people who had not come forward will not come forward no matter how much you stir the pot. They are already burnt to the bottom.
I don't like down on you for speaking your mind. I look down on you for behaving childishly, and asking others not to do so. I look down on you for doing things I know you don't condone.
Lololol.
Cute, huh?
Get your shits and giggles.
I am done giving a ******** about it. You want to be at their level, fine. I can treat you the same as I would them, if that is what you'd prefer. But it's not what I would prefer, and I don't want it to be like that.
I find it hard to understand why you are being so nasty to me when I have done nothing against you. When I have gone out of my way to be friendly with you my whole time in the clan, even when I have disagreed with you in the past.
No one was starting any fight in that thread but you, Kaori. Everyone else had and has let the issue go, stop holding on to drama. It's weighing you down.
I actually did ask for an apology. I'll drop it because I am not searching back through a thousand posts to find it.
Be human all you want. But you know what, I can't respect someone who says here are my flaws and I proud of them. When you cease trying to better yourself that's a sad thing.
If longevity is the only reason you are where you are, you don't deserve to be there in my opinion. Not after what I have seen.
You know what. Nevermind.
I am sorry. I am sorry about this whole drama mess, despite the fact it is not in the slightest my fault.
This whole ordeal is stupid. That being said, my opinions are still the same. However, despite the fact I am beginning to feel sorry I ever joined the clan at all, I am ready to move and try to make this into water under the bridge, if that's possible.
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 5:25 am
stare ............................
you're joking.
Hahaha! right?
lolololol!
That sort of thing.
Am I missing something here?
Banning for no reason is ok with you. You'd be ok with a random ban if it happened to you for no reason? Other than for the point that it was meant to start a fight.
Not with me, that's not ok. Simple as that. I want a valid reason. I was banned based on lies and gossip. I am holding them accountable for their actions. I am not returning to Sands.
End of discussion.
But thank-you for the apology, although it was a little general.... I apologize for hurting you Lent.
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The Lady Shinigami Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 8:07 am
Joking about what? *confused face goes here*
The thing is, you weren't banned for no reason. Whether or not you agree with the reasons is a different matter, but the reasons for your ban were posted on both threads at least once.
I am not saying I agreed with the ban at all. I did not. I was very, very angry when I read that. The first thing I saw when I opened my laptop was that Rosa had IMed me while I was gone. Apparently there had been drama. He said he really hoped I didn't rage quit and said that if I did, he understood and wish me the best of luck. So I suppose at least I was prepared. Even prepared, I was outraged as I read of your ban.
I also do not think you were banned just to start a fight. You were already fighting before the ban, after all. You wanted Impact to come forward with who he was talking about and when it was you, you took it very personally, with good reason.
I am not saying I agree with the conflict that happened before the ban, which Impact did start, but you continued it. That is where the situation spiraled out of control, and it should've been taken better care of.
I did see you act unkindly, however you did not deserve that ban. And even Impact later came over and apologized personally. Which was really big of him, especially because of who he is.
You were right. You are still right. Black Sands issues should be handled in the BS thread. It is the way you said it, the way you handled the situation that was inappropriate. Nothing warranting a ban. And I said, and everyone else acknowledged. Even Rosa said he would apologize for what transpired if you agreed to apologize as well.
As you should. I am not 'taking the Sands side'. Or anything of that sort. Just the way I read it, all parties involved handled the drama badly. If there had been less prideful boasting and arguing in the first place it wouldn't have gotten so out of hand.
"EDIT because this seriously pisses me off: Because quitting would be bullshit. Both parties are wrong in their own way and the only thing keeping this fiasco from finally being blown away like dust in the wind is this issue of apologies. Most everyone aside from me and Shini has been reasonable and pushing for a solution, and quitting is neither reasonable nor a solution. It's just being petty and avoiding the situation. Or, in other words, blatant hypocrisy."
Even Rosa admits that both parties were partially in the wrong and responsible, he himself being one of those parties. This did escalate into an issue that really should've stayed more between a few people.
I understand why you don't want to return to the Sands, however as far as I can see all the RPers from there that we already knew weren't assholes, because there are plenty of assholes, handled this with some amount of grace. The fact that there are assholes at the Sands is reason enough for you not to return to the Sands, even if this drama had not happened and got blown waaaay out of control.
This was really just the final nail in the coffin, after all, right? You yourself said you planned to leave. So why make such a big fuss about it? Swallowing your pride and not allowing things to escalate in a way that has negatively impacted a lot of people would've been a more mature thing to do. I know that sort of thing is hard to do, but this sort of thing does affect everybody, unfortunately, and so everyone and their feelings should be taken into consideration.
You were leaving the Sands anyways and it would have been much easier on everyone if it had been quiet, even after that little, initial spectacle.
Thanks for the apology, Kaori. It means a lot to me. A whole lot. I admit to being a sensitive person at times. I am easy to hurt, although I try to harden myself up some and hide it.
I'm sorry if I said anything that seemed written to intentionally, or maliciously hurt you. I assure you it wasn't in the slightest way meant that way.
My only intention was to try and stop this problem before it once again escalated. And it would appear that I failed there as well. But I am surprisingly not really bothered all that much by that fact. I guess this all was sort of important to get out anyways. Clear the air, so to speak.
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:43 pm
Lies, gossip. Behind the scenes rumours and falsehoods. Terrible reasons to be banning someone.
Speaking to someone about the problems and have things worked out, fine. But not pulling a stunt like that.
And quite frankly, banning because you get complained about is flucking stupid. Especially when I did absolutely nothing in the BSB thread to warrant their actions. If someone didn't like what I said to them, maybe they should have come to me if they didn't understand why I was angry. But they didn't bother.
The fact that they think they can impose themselves on others outside of their thread amuses me.
Because the reasons they gave are false and they didn't bother to pm me aside about it at all and instead decided to make a big scene about it. I gave them what they wanted.
A drama fight.
Maybe next time, the next person they decide to ban will get valid reasons, quietly in pm's and that person will be able to have a chance to share their side of it, and contest against it. Or work out their problems, in pm's instead of resorting primarily to childishness.
I handled it my way.
I handled it for my own reasons, the way I did. To prove a point. Banning does not = problem solving.
The problem still exists and until they bother to pm me about it and tell me what the complaints about me were in the first place and we work through finding a solution.... I will not return to Sands. Simple as that.
The reason I am sticking by this is because I have the right to be treated fairly. No matter how many people complain about me.
As far as I see it. In this light. I have still done nothing wrong. The complaints, whatever they are, don't exist because they have not been made clear. By stating they are banning me for my behaviour in other peoples threads is stupid. They claim to be assholes, they should ban themselves then.
Thus I was banned for no reason but for the fact they wanted a drama fest. I gave them what they wanted.
Now then. Just to clear one more thing.
By having clan members stating anything about my behaviour when it comes to a drama fest out in the open like that, is asking to get in on the drama fest. Next time take the careful route and pm me instead, because to me it looked like you too were hopping on their band wagon.
I don't care who thinks what about what I do or how I act. If it isn't graceful, so what? Not everyone is graceful with how they do things. Sometimes these things call for one to be ungraceful. Petty? yes. But they understand pettiness apparently.
It was my fight to fight. I fought it how I felt to. And I am still fighting it how I feel to. And I don't care how it makes me look. The way they handled the situation in the beginning was what led to the way I handled the situation in the end.
Guyy said it clearly. It could have all been avoided by a private message.
They wanted it, I brought it. Simple as that.
Your tone has changed Lent in your last post. Now I can see you are on middle-grounds to understanding the situation at least.
Why I don't return to Sands is still me fighting. It's their loss if they don't want to figure it out and work through the complaints they received about me or even validate their view on it to me.
Hah. Blown way out of control. That's funny. lololol. It was what I wanted. To have it blown out of control.
I'd like to also mention that despite the fact I acknowledge I have downsides to myself, it doesn't mean I am proud of them. But that I accept myself even with my downfalls. Changing downfalls can be next to impossible for some people or it takes an incredible amount of time to do it and the right support from people they care about to see it through. So while changes don't happen over night or in an hour or a minute, sometimes these things take years to change for a person to grow in the right direction. For someone to point a finger at me and tell me I'm not working on it is insulting. Especially when that person has honestly no idea of who I really am behind the words I write or the face I have or the body I live in.
Ah yes. I had planned to leave. Because key players in that thread had in one way or another isolated mine. Why bother being there if you're just going to be on your own? The cold war was not cool. And I expressed as such while my characters were there.
Sure, it would have been soooooo much easier if it were quiet. I agree with you on that aspect entirely. However, they didn't want easy. *shrugs* I had gone quiet in Black Sands anyway. They could have just left me alone. But no. They didn't. They picked a fight and I gave it to them.
Eh, don't let my apology mean that much to you. I'm not someone you respect after all. We barely know each other beyond seeing avatars and role playing. Maybe if and when people want to get to know me they may have more respect for me. As it stands I am not bothered. Meaning I have enough respect for people that I hang out in the background if they don't see me as a valid person they want to get to know. I role play and spin stories nevertheless.
You had good intentions, just went the wrong way about it. Don't worry about it, it's over and done with. No regrets, no hard feelings.
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The Lady Shinigami Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:41 am
So we're all in agreement. What happened to Kaori was unjust and handled poorly.
By everyone.
And we've all apologised.
It's time to let it go now. It's gone too far. Way too far.
I don't want my clan members bickering at each other.
I don't want any more tension.
I don't want to lose anyone else.
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:12 am
Agreed.
Forgive and forget, right?
Anyone else?
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The Lady Shinigami Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:35 pm
I won't forget any of it.
Forgive, yes. Forget, no. Too much to learn from it. For everyone.
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Reply
