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 Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 4:20 pm
ShadowCat495 Taralanthalasa ShadowCat495 Ever heard of prophets? Not saying Burns is one, but he basically doing the same thing as everyone else, which is, giving his opinions. Being homosexual isn't wrong. Most cases, it can't be helped. Homosexual sex, however, is. (yesh, that sounds a little weird, but I didn't know how else to word it) By the way, repeating things, that were stated in the bible, to others, is not judging.... How is being homosexual not a sin, but homosexual sex is? Really, I see no difference. Like being heterosexual isn't a sin as well as heterosexual sex isn't. The two go hand in hand. Telling someone something is wrong without understanding or knowing the whole story is judging, no matter how you look at it, no matter how you word it. Prophets wrote the books in the bible, they shared their faith with others, but didn't push it upon people who didn't want to know more about the faith... to my understanding anyway. Jesus didn't push the faith on anyone. Yes, sharing our faith is good. Much other faiths share theirs. It gathers people, but only those who want to it. Telling it to people who close their minds to it, it isn't beifical to anyone, and unless they open their hearts to God at some point, nothing is going to happen. Being a homosexual isn't a sin. You can't control that, I know, but the Bible says if a man lays with another man as a woman, they shall be put to death (something close to that...goes for women also). It makes since... only this way though(to me): A man(or woman) is heterosexual. They go out one night and deside it would be fun just to mess around with someone of the same gender, something they have never done and never plan to do again... and possibly something that has never "floated their boat". Anyway, they couldn't care less about it because they feel nothing toward other men(or women). That would be going against their nature, and therefore, a sin. Homosexual sex between two people who love eachother, or two people who are attracted to one another, shouldn't be considered a sin (in my mind) if it's natural for the two of them.
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 4:30 pm
DemigoddessHalfdemon i like burnination Se Ga Takai yes, in Deuteronomy, but many people keep proclaiming how that law has been replaced by Christs law of Love, why has that Love not been extended to Homosexuals, then? because Paul declared to the Judaizers that apart from sexual sins and the Ten Commandments the Law does not need to be followed. i'm pretty sure act of homosexual sex falls under that. DemigoddessHalfdemon i like burnination DemigoddessHalfdemon Burnination. You say that there is an absolute right and wrong. That morality is not relative. So I ask you: Who decides what is right, and what is wrong? God. Whose God? the only real God. Please define for me "The only real God." There are many different religions in this world, and most of them contradict the others in some theological point. So, tell me please, are you saying that only one is right? And how do you know that that one is the "right one"? I'd say she's got you on this one. The only way we can truely find out which is right is when death comes. Funny thing though, it'll be too late to change our minds at that point. It's all a risk, religion, eh?
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 4:46 pm
i like burnination Taralanthalasa i like burnination Taralanthalasa i like burnination gah, another case of my being unable to articulate myself in the manner that i wish. the defintion i found for judging was "condemning someone based on moral grounds." the two are not mututally exclusive. judging means that one has the power to condemn. i do not have the ability to declare anyone to be anathema, because obviously only God can do that. however, at the same time i can tell an unbeliever that they are going to Hell because it is not my judgement but rather God's and i am merely repeating the judgement. i am not going to get into evangelistic procedure, but i will say that obviously such a saying would be out of love and not without an explanation of why. now, if i tell someone something is wrong, i'm not really condemning. if i did it out of love and out of concern for the state of their eternal soul, Christian or not, then i am entitled to do so. why do you think people have the spiritual gift of exhortation? Did you happen to take a look at the difinitions Priate and I gave? And you can't give God's judgement. Only God can do that. You don't know how He's going to judge people on judgement day. Really now, come on. Your judging in God's place. Which is against the Ten Commandments. no! i am not judging in God's place! exhortation is not judging. look that word up and tell me if it is condemning someone. and honestly, in either of those definitions i saw nothing that came close to what i was talking about. by that definition, you are judging me quite severely. are you saying i am sinning? isn't that taking God's place by judging me in that way? oh no, now i'm judging you. the cycle continues. and what? are you saying that every single prophet was wrong in doing what they did? are you denying that people can speak on authority from the Holy Spirit? Christians who exhort another are sinning? Taralanthalasa Talking to people about the Bible is great. If their willing to hear it, and take the time to understand it. Other than that, all efforts are in vain. Unfortunately for those who are against homosexual marriage, pulling out bible verses isn't going to help. People don't want to hear it, and it makes matters worse. Honestly. It makes others dislike our beliefs. Think about it. "all efforts are in vain"? doesn't the Bible teach that through God all things are possible? obviously, it's nothing that we do that converts anyone, but God who uses us to speak to individuals. by the way, Christ's teachings made people dislike our beliefs. in fact, so much so that they killed Him. i'm not about to preach a watered down "prosperity gospel" just so people will like our beliefs. i don't expect a world that couldn't accept a perfect man to accept me. I have now bolded the part of your previous post were you state that you "are repeating a judgment" that has not yet been made... because that judgement can only be taken place at death, on Judgement Day, when God Himself tells the person they are going to hell or not. but if they are unsaved they are on the road to Hell, right? On the road to, yes, but not going to Hell. They have not been condemned yet. i like burnination Taralanthalasa ShadowCat495 Ever heard of prophets? Not saying Burns is one, but he basically doing the same thing as everyone else, which is, giving his opinions. Being homosexual isn't wrong. Most cases, it can't be helped. Homosexual sex, however, is. (yesh, that sounds a little weird, but I didn't know how else to word it) By the way, repeating things, that were stated in the bible, to others, is not judging.... How is being homosexual not a sin, but homosexual sex is? Really, I see no difference. Like being heterosexual isn't a sin as well as heterosexual sex isn't. The two go hand in hand. not neccesarily. there is celibacy. Which can go both ways, not just one. Generally, the two go hand in hand.
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 11:46 pm
Taralanthalasa DemigoddessHalfdemon i like burnination Se Ga Takai yes, in Deuteronomy, but many people keep proclaiming how that law has been replaced by Christs law of Love, why has that Love not been extended to Homosexuals, then? because Paul declared to the Judaizers that apart from sexual sins and the Ten Commandments the Law does not need to be followed. i'm pretty sure act of homosexual sex falls under that. the only real God. Please define for me "The only real God." There are many different religions in this world, and most of them contradict the others in some theological point. So, tell me please, are you saying that only one is right? And how do you know that that one is the "right one"? I'd say she's got you on this one. The only way we can truely find out which is right is when death comes. Funny thing though, it'll be too late to change our minds at that point. It's all a risk, religion, eh? well, not exactly. the Gospels have been proven to be authentic documents (none of the writers were well-known and they had nothing to gain considering John was the only one, though exiled, that didn't die for his beliefs) and the Resurrection can be somewhat proven (someone, including the referenced to "hundreds of eyewitnesses", would've spoken up if it didn't happen). The Case for Christ is a very good book on the subject. also, LDS instruct people to pray over the Book of Mormon. if it's true they'll get heartburn (that's what the "burning in the busom" reminds me of sweatdrop ). Taralanthalasa On the road to, yes, but not going to Hell. They have not been condemned yet. exactly. one isn't condemning but revealing to a person that they are on the road paved with good intentions, well-traveled, easy, wide, and leads to death. there is a difference.
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:09 am
Taralanthalasa Arashi Tenshi However, no gay couple should ever, ever force a religious leader to perform the ceremony or insist it be held in any form of religious institute. No matter how much the "bride and groom" wants a traditional marriage and ceremony, it will never be and they shouldn't try to pretend so or force their beliefs on others. umm... So are you saying that I shouldn't even think of having a traditional marriage, if I was to marry another female even though I am a believer of God and feel it would be right for me to marry in a church with my church's Pastor peroforming the cerimony? because I would find that rather offencive, I must say, if you were. Because: I believe that if God truely loves me as one of his childern, then he will except me for me, no more and no less. I believe Jesus died for our sins, and I follow the Ten Commandments as best I can. I know some, not all, of the Bible, also called His Word. I walk with him to the best of ability, and yet you may be saying that I(and others like me) should be denied a cerimony in a church because we're marring someone of the same sex? That would descrimintory, and completely unfair. No, no one should be forced to perform it, but I don't agree with the right being taken away. I don't care which gender I eventually end up marrying, I would like the ability to marry in a church. While it's certainly not something I'd agree with or attend, if that is what happened and you found a minister who agreed I'd have nothing to say against such a wedding. God does accept sinners right where they are, else we're all in a lot of trouble, not just homosexuals.
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Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 1:11 pm
Arashi Tenshi Taralanthalasa Arashi Tenshi However, no gay couple should ever, ever force a religious leader to perform the ceremony or insist it be held in any form of religious institute. No matter how much the "bride and groom" wants a traditional marriage and ceremony, it will never be and they shouldn't try to pretend so or force their beliefs on others. umm... So are you saying that I shouldn't even think of having a traditional marriage, if I was to marry another female even though I am a believer of God and feel it would be right for me to marry in a church with my church's Pastor peroforming the cerimony? because I would find that rather offencive, I must say, if you were. Because: I believe that if God truely loves me as one of his childern, then he will except me for me, no more and no less. I believe Jesus died for our sins, and I follow the Ten Commandments as best I can. I know some, not all, of the Bible, also called His Word. I walk with him to the best of ability, and yet you may be saying that I(and others like me) should be denied a cerimony in a church because we're marring someone of the same sex? That would descrimintory, and completely unfair. No, no one should be forced to perform it, but I don't agree with the right being taken away. I don't care which gender I eventually end up marrying, I would like the ability to marry in a church. While it's certainly not something I'd agree with or attend, if that is what happened and you found a minister who agreed I'd have nothing to say against such a wedding. Wow, that seems really spiteful. Almost like you don't want certian people to be happy... or have equal rights.
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Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 1:26 pm
i like burnination Taralanthalasa DemigoddessHalfdemon i like burnination Se Ga Takai yes, in Deuteronomy, but many people keep proclaiming how that law has been replaced by Christs law of Love, why has that Love not been extended to Homosexuals, then? because Paul declared to the Judaizers that apart from sexual sins and the Ten Commandments the Law does not need to be followed. i'm pretty sure act of homosexual sex falls under that. the only real God. Please define for me "The only real God." There are many different religions in this world, and most of them contradict the others in some theological point. So, tell me please, are you saying that only one is right? And how do you know that that one is the "right one"? I'd say she's got you on this one. The only way we can truely find out which is right is when death comes. Funny thing though, it'll be too late to change our minds at that point. It's all a risk, religion, eh? well, not exactly. the Gospels have been proven to be authentic documents (none of the writers were well-known and they had nothing to gain considering John was the only one, though exiled, that didn't die for his beliefs) and the Resurrection can be somewhat proven (someone, including the referenced to "hundreds of eyewitnesses", would've spoken up if it didn't happen). The Case for Christ is a very good book on the subject. also, LDS instruct people to pray over the Book of Mormon. if it's true they'll get heartburn (that's what the "burning in the busom" reminds me of sweatdrop ). Oh thats always nice to hear, lol . Anyway. Yes I know that things in the Bible have been proven, even by science, but that still doesn't prove that there is one true God... So the Bible may be authentic, but what does that prove other than those people where good prophets? And would someone have spoken up if the resurrection didn't happen? what if they didn't know it was being written... and what if someone did speak up, but it was written anyway? Taralanthalasa On the road to, yes, but not going to Hell. They have not been condemned yet. exactly. one isn't condemning but revealing to a person that they are on the road paved with good intentions, well-traveled, easy, wide, and leads to death. there is a difference. You specifically said "going to" Hell, not "on the road to" Hell. Anyway, teachancly we are all on the balance beam of heaven or hell. We can all be "on the road to" and manage not to go to hell.
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Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 1:28 pm
i like burnination Taralanthalasa DemigoddessHalfdemon i like burnination Se Ga Takai yes, in Deuteronomy, but many people keep proclaiming how that law has been replaced by Christs law of Love, why has that Love not been extended to Homosexuals, then? because Paul declared to the Judaizers that apart from sexual sins and the Ten Commandments the Law does not need to be followed. i'm pretty sure act of homosexual sex falls under that. the only real God. Please define for me "The only real God." There are many different religions in this world, and most of them contradict the others in some theological point. So, tell me please, are you saying that only one is right? And how do you know that that one is the "right one"? I'd say she's got you on this one. The only way we can truely find out which is right is when death comes. Funny thing though, it'll be too late to change our minds at that point. It's all a risk, religion, eh? well, not exactly. the Gospels have been proven to be authentic documents (none of the writers were well-known and they had nothing to gain considering John was the only one, though exiled, that didn't die for his beliefs) and the Resurrection can be somewhat proven (someone, including the referenced to "hundreds of eyewitnesses", would've spoken up if it didn't happen). The Case for Christ is a very good book on the subject. also, LDS instruct people to pray over the Book of Mormon. if it's true they'll get heartburn (that's what the "burning in the busom" reminds me of sweatdrop ). Oh thats always nice to hear, lol . Anyway. Yes I know that things in the Bible have been proven, even by science, but that still doesn't prove that there is one true God... So the Bible may be authentic, but what does that prove other than those people where good prophets, and may have been high on something to believe that there was only one God? And would someone have spoken up if the resurrection didn't happen? what if they didn't know it was being written... and what if someone did speak up, but it was written anyway? i like burnination Taralanthalasa On the road to, yes, but not going to Hell. They have not been condemned yet. exactly. one isn't condemning but revealing to a person that they are on the road paved with good intentions, well-traveled, easy, wide, and leads to death. there is a difference. You specifically said "going to" Hell, not "on the road to" Hell. Anyway, teachancly we are all on the balance beam of heaven or hell. We can all be "on the road to" and manage not to go to hell.
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Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 6:47 pm
ShadowCat495 And what is "teachancly"? (JK lolz) A typo, lol *sigh*
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Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 8:23 am
i like burnination also, LDS instruct people to pray over the Book of Mormon. if it's true they'll get heartburn (that's what the "burning in the busom" reminds me of sweatdrop ). Holy Heartburn Batman!!!! [/hijack] Yeah, I've always thought that "Burning in the bosom" means you get heartburn. But then, does "stupor of thought" mean you turn blonde?
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Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 10:48 am
DemigoddessHalfdemon i like burnination also, LDS instruct people to pray over the Book of Mormon. if it's true they'll get heartburn (that's what the "burning in the busom" reminds me of sweatdrop ). Holy Heartburn Batman!!!! [/hijack] Yeah, I've always thought that "Burning in the bosom" means you get heartburn. But then, does "stupor of thought" mean you turn blonde? maybe not. most Mormons i've seen have either brown or black hair. maybe it's just the new converts, who dye their hair later. :B
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Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 10:53 am
Taralanthalasa Anyway. Yes I know that things in the Bible have been proven, even by science, but that still doesn't prove that there is one true God... So the Bible may be authentic, but what does that prove other than those people where good prophets, and may have been high on something to believe that there was only one God? "those people"? who exactly do you mean by that? Taralanthalasa And would someone have spoken up if the resurrection didn't happen? what if they didn't know it was being written... and what if someone did speak up, but it was written anyway? just because they didn't know it was being written about doesn't mean they would not have known that Jesus' disciples were asserting that He was ressurrected. the preaching on Pentacost would've surely have been spread by word of mouth. anyone even the least bit disinclined towards Christianity would've said something if they knew the Ressurrection to be false.
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Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 3:42 pm
I believe it should be legal, and I'll explain why.
I'll start with equality, pure and simple. Why should one set of loving, consenting adults be denied a right that other such adults have and which, if exercised, will do no damage to anyone else? Not just because they have always lacked that right in the past, for sure: until the late 1960s, in some American states it was illegal for black adults to marry white ones, but precious few would defend that ban now on grounds that it was “traditional”.
But marriage is about children, say some: to which the answer is, it often is, but not always, and permitting gay marriage would not alter that. Or it is a religious act, say others: to which the answer is, yes, you may believe that, but if so it is no business of the state to impose a religious choice. Indeed, in America the constitution expressly bans the involvement of the state in religious matters, so it would be especially outrageous if the constitution were now to be used for religious ends.
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