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What's your opinion of schooling?
  America's got it easy!
  It's the same as everyone else!
  *is afraid to go to school in Japan now* Uh....
  Hmm...undecided
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t r i m t r i m CAVALRY

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:07 pm


Well, so far as I'm concerned, American school systems are by FAR the easiest in the world (quite literally...next to the fact that some DON'T have school). In most cases, you have to "try" to fail.

Take Japan for example (albeit, a rather extreme example). Japanese teens have to take a final graduation exam at the end of senior year. If you fail once, you try again; fail twice and well...life is over as you know it. After all, failing means disgracing your family and family is important. A reason why the suicide rate is so high for teens in Japan.

Take France for another example. Over half the high school students have repeated at LEAST one year of schooling. They too have to take an exam (le bac) to graduate and move on into Universities. Fail once, get another try. Fail twice and you repeat senior year (1st grade. Their's is backwards.)

I'm sure you're thinking that "Oh, well that's just the equivalent to the SAT," and you're sorta right, but DAMN, I've heard that these tests are freakin HARD.

And schools aren't as personalized as they are in America.

And Look at Canada, they have tons of Immersion Schools (immerse you into a school that is entirely in a foreign language) and have a similar system to France.

I'm just saying that we Americans have got it pretty damn easy...

*NOTE: Don't flame me if some of these facts are wrong. They come from my teachers, so sources are unknown and vary...
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:09 pm


#4375 in the world and dropping.

Tetsudai


lidless_i

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:12 pm


Well, one of the problems with American school might be the fact that it's run on federal money. No matter how badly the schools do at educating their students they will never be shut down here.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:17 pm


i think is s very stupid country

HuricaneWolf


Blood`Eternity
Captain

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:25 pm


Since this is more so a discussion on what we think about schooling systems I moved it to debate & discussion.

American schooling systems are weak, but look at the bright side.. even if they do get there highschool diploma with ease those who dont deserve to be rich and successful will either be to pathetic to go to college or will drop out, then they can become the scum of america [which is needed], they will do our dry-cleaning, they will do our fast food work and our construction and all those little low paid jobs so that we can buy all those things we like to buy.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:25 pm


We do have it easy. A friend of mine (shes very bright, but just dosnt have alot of common sense) deicded she wanted to fail. She didnt dso any homework, didnt study, didnt listen in class. Basically she didn't do everything your supposed to. For her six weeks grade she got a b average. Then she was moved up to honnors math (something unheard of in the middle of a semester) a weeks after she started trying again. The teachers reason? "This student is bored in regualr classes and far exceeds the regulars corriculum in knowledgle" Not kidding Im serious. She TRIED to fail and even then she couldn't.

I'm in one of the top 100 school districts in the country. I feel sorry for everyone thats in the bottom 100.

Edit: Oh and as for so called "History CLass" needs to be renamed "Nap Time"

Spirit_of_Yarn


lidless_i

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:32 pm


As far as dropping out goes, I dropped out recently but not due to lazieness. I dropped out because I disagree with the way that the public education system is being run. I am in the process of getting my GED. (Which so far, seems alot like taking a seventh grade level SAT test)
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:35 pm


Spirit_of_Yarn
We do have it easy. A friend of mine (shes very bright, but just dosnt have alot of common sense) deicded she wanted to fail. She didnt dso any homework, didnt study, didnt listen in class. Basically she didn't do everything your supposed to. For her six weeks grade she got a b average. Then she was moved up to honnors math (something unheard of in the middle of a semester) a weeks after she started trying again. The teachers reason? "This student is bored in regualr classes and far exceeds the regulars corriculum in knowledgle" Not kidding Im serious. She TRIED to fail and even then she couldn't.

I'm in one of the top 100 school districts in the country. I feel sorry for everyone thats in the bottom 100.

Edit: Oh and as for so called "History CLass" needs to be renamed "Nap Time"


XD Actually, I think it's how poorly psychologists work. In different countries, people think different things, and people think they know about the humans mind thinks. THINK AGAIN. LOLZ. Failing.....? Yeah I think I would fail in Japan. Unless they educate us well. Educating well and being harsh is different >_<

Daunter


Zophell

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 6:53 pm


To be honest I can’t in all honesty comment on the state of Japanese schools or any schools outside the usa as I have never even visited Japan and more importantly I have never attended there schools. That being said I’d like to say that school is not difficult in academics but rather environment. I believe George Bernard Shaw (Nobel Prize winner) said it best "There is nothing on earth intended for innocent people so horrible as a school".

What I am trying to convey is simply that schools (at least in america), intentionally, create an environment that does not foster learning and more importantly creativity and free thought. What we (and by we I mean the youth) are instead handed is an environment that is meant to teach obedience and above all faith in the system.

Now I know a lot of you are sitting there thinking I must have been bullied in school. As much as people and the media would like it it’s not that simple, in short I didn’t really run into many bullies after I broke that kids nose after school (the magic of a roll of quarters).

But I digress, I have found that in school children are often treated in an almost subhuman way. The cares and concerns of the students and even parents go unheard. I have had staff members and teachers that will only address a pupil as student or there student number.

Speaking of teachers I find schools hiring processes to be grossly negligent. I have had not one but two teachers that would literally destroy assignments and wrongfully grade students (still not sure why they did this). Also it seems at times that these teachers actually know absolutely nothing about the things they are supposed to be teaching.

Not to mention I’ve had teachers who outright refuse to help students who are struggling in class even when they asked for help directly. They would just say to them “If you paid attention you’d know all this stuff”. I almost punched that teacher for that.

I have a lot more to say but I kind of feel like posting all this is kind of hijacking the thread so I’ll post more if people are actually interested.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 7:05 pm


Zophell
To be honest I can’t in all honesty comment on the state of Japanese schools or any schools outside the usa as I have never even visited Japan and more importantly I have never attended there schools. That being said I’d like to say that school is not difficult in academics but rather environment. I believe George Bernard Shaw (Nobel Prize winner) said it best "There is nothing on earth intended for innocent people so horrible as a school".

What I am trying to convey is simply that schools (at least in america), intentionally, create an environment that does not foster learning and more importantly creativity and free thought. What we (and by we I mean the youth) are instead handed is an environment that is meant to teach obedience and above all faith in the system.

Now I know a lot of you are sitting there thinking I must have been bullied in school. As much as people and the media would like it it’s not that simple, in short I didn’t really run into many bullies after I broke that kids nose after school (the magic of a roll of quarters).

But I digress, I have found that in school children are often treated in an almost subhuman way. The cares and concerns of the students and even parents go unheard. I have had staff members and teachers that will only address a pupil as student or there student number.

Speaking of teachers I find schools hiring processes to be grossly negligent. I have had not one but two teachers that would literally destroy assignments and wrongfully grade students (still not sure why they did this). Also it seems at times that these teachers actually know absolutely nothing about the things they are supposed to be teaching.

Not to mention I’ve had teachers who outright refuse to help students who are struggling in class even when they asked for help directly. They would just say to them “If you paid attention you’d know all this stuff”. I almost punched that teacher for that.

I have a lot more to say but I kind of feel like posting all this is kind of hijacking the thread so I’ll post more if people are actually interested.

These are some of the reasons that I opposed the school system. The systems defence against my resistance (I commented to the principal that he was doing a magnificent job of supressing free thought, he agreed and thanked me) is why I dropped out.

lidless_i


.theXfallen.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 7:17 pm


Zophell
These are some of the reasons that I opposed the school system. The systems defence against my resistance (I commented to the principal that he was doing a magnificent job of supressing free thought, he agreed and thanked me) is why I dropped out.


I am completely and utterly speechless- and that does /not/ happen often.

Well, perhaps not. Can I have this principal's address please? I think I need to come to his home for nice little. chat. ^^

All right, time to be serous. That is absolutely terrible. I mean, I've always had a poor view of secondary education, but that is just ridiculous. He reminds me a little of my American History teacher, Mr. Milstead. He always lectured- all day, every day. From these lectures students were expected to learn about both history and Milstead's likes and biases. Then, when the time came to write papers, you hopefelly knew what subjects/positions on subjects to avoid or you there was no way you were getting a good grade on that paper, whether the quality of work was magnificent or terrible.

Hrm, sorry. I digressed, but no more. My high school has always irritated me, and I have a plethora of teachers that I wouldn't mind being rid of. Thus, I tend to rant. Forgive me. Still, I agree with the statements that America's schools are crap. Simply put.

-Nya
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 9:54 pm


*Sigh* And this is why, should my future partner and I choose to adopt children, I'll be homeschooling them. I would much rather trust my child's education to myself, seeing as how I understand the material and care about nurturing creativity and work ethic, rather than test scores.

Let me put it this way: before the state writing test my junior year of high school, my English class (AP English) spent two weeks working on mediocre essays. Our teacher said, quote, "If you write like a scholar, you will fail. The people grading won't understand you." Yet, we had to pass the state writing test to get credit for English. Where is the logic in that?

Calixti


Stronghearted11

PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 12:45 pm


The Indubitable Katie-Kat
*Sigh* And this is why, should my future partner and I choose to adopt children, I'll be homeschooling them. I would much rather trust my child's education to myself, seeing as how I understand the material and care about nurturing creativity and work ethic, rather than test scores.

Let me put it this way: before the state writing test my junior year of high school, my English class (AP English) spent two weeks working on mediocre essays. Our teacher said, quote, "If you write like a scholar, you will fail. The people grading won't understand you." Yet, we had to pass the state writing test to get credit for English. Where is the logic in that?


that's like the state tests here. our teacher explained to us why. i forget all the math to it, but in our school each teacher grades about 200 essays a day, 2 minutes for each essay
i could be wrong but i'll check
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 6:20 pm


Stronghearted11
The Indubitable Katie-Kat
*Sigh* And this is why, should my future partner and I choose to adopt children, I'll be homeschooling them. I would much rather trust my child's education to myself, seeing as how I understand the material and care about nurturing creativity and work ethic, rather than test scores.

Let me put it this way: before the state writing test my junior year of high school, my English class (AP English) spent two weeks working on mediocre essays. Our teacher said, quote, "If you write like a scholar, you will fail. The people grading won't understand you." Yet, we had to pass the state writing test to get credit for English. Where is the logic in that?


that's like the state tests here. our teacher explained to us why. i forget all the math to it, but in our school each teacher grades about 200 essays a day, 2 minutes for each essay
i could be wrong but i'll check


Same in my state. My teachers tell us to dumb down our writting so the people grading us won't fail us because it took to long to read and actully think about waht we were saying. Also ever noticed how the state gives us the stupidest topics? "Whats was your favorite monet?" "What was a profound moment?" Why don't they gives us something to really work with such as "The man fell through the ceilling into an office, as you walk closer you find _______" I had that as a warm up once and ceated a 38 page (handwritten) story, with a friend, about the evils of moose and the story about how they kidnapped two kids. XP So much easier than trying to creat something off of "What was your favortie vacation?"

Spirit_of_Yarn


Gairish McCreeper

PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 9:46 pm


The AP test has to be graded that way simply because of the fact that so many more kids these days are taking the classes, most of them don't belong there. In my school this year, our AP enrollment doubled, it makes what would have been far more personal and meaningful classes crowded comparitavely. Frankly I'm surprised three or four people haven't allready been booted from the class, the first three essays one person turned in were "sixth grade quality writing", to quote my teacher. Thankfully I do have a great teacher, I think even with conditions being a little cramped (she admits that she doesn't have the time to pour over papers and grade them as she normally would, the enrollment of the whole AP program two years ago is our current single class size) I will be able to learn a good deal from her.

America's schools in general, weak as hell, finding the right districts and moving there, that's how you do it. I go to one of the better high schools in Wisconsin, even if our reputation from years ago isn't how we are now, and I grew up in the second best grade and junior high's of the time.
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