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 Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:59 pm
Okay... So, I'm 16 years old. I was raised in a Roman Catholic house hold, and I got to a Catholic High school. But, around the age of 8 I started questioning my religion, instead of sitting there like a mind-washed dog, just doing and believing all that I was told. One of the first things I ever thought about was "Why is it that when I pray, God never answers me back?... sad " This was quite upsetting to my 8 year old mind, and I didnt understand it one bit.
Now, I have my own reasons as to why I dont think there is a god, or if there is, why I dont think that the Catholic god isnt just. My mom and dad tell me reasons everyday on why the things I think arent right in the Catholic church; "People suffer because God has a bigger plan for them, and humans just dont see the bigger picture, hun." Well, that answer was just not going to cut it for me. I havent openly told them that Im atheistic (quite frankly because they would without a doubt disown me...), but I have told them, once in a while, my opinion on something they're sitting around talking about and making a big deal of it. Like, birth-control for an example. I think its nothing to be concerned about; if you dont want to have a kid for your own reason, you shouldnt have to risk having one by accidnet. But, apparently, God wants you to have 20 kids you cant take care of? No, wait, he just dont want you sex unless you want kids. Wait... I thought sex was a gift from God for us to enjoy?? See how confusing this is? It seems like no one I know personally can see what I see... stare
But, what I made this topic for is to ask any Atheists why you dont believe in god, and maybe some tips on how you defend yourself from crazy Catholics and/or fire-n'-brimstone preaching Christians? Also, if anyone is in the same position as me, stuck in a Roman Catholic world that frowns upon free thinking and questioning, tell me about it! I'd love to hear from anyone on how they have dealt with it or how you're living with it. Thanks for reading my first post! heart
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Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:13 pm
Fūma Kotarō and Tsuruhime…
pfft. unless i see this "god", i will not believe in them. and other than the bible, of which there are 50 bajilion versions (all which contradict each other sooner or later), who says that this "god" is male? for all we know, the "god" is a goddess.
and the bible. which one is the right one? i've look around, and a lot of what's in there is BS or written down after it all happened by at least a century. yeah, there's some good stories in there, but not enough fits for me.
i've always been at a public school, so i've never had that problem. (holy crap, i can't spell today) my dad doesn't believe in the heaven and hell concept at all, my mom's all "whatever" to it all, and i think it's a load of BS used to control people. after all, what is religion but a cult?
eternal_PrinceofFire (as i think it's spelled) on here says that it's bullshit, like me...but he says it in his sig. next line: offended? I don't care :3
if someone believes in one, i respect it, so long they don't shove it in my face and try to get me to join. that's when i have problems.
or as my friend yavanni on deviantART says: Christianity isn't a religion. it's a part of you or it's not.
gaia_gaiagold that's my two cents gaia_gaiagold
Bestest/craziest/strangest couple ever
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:47 pm
I have a belief in god.
But look at the lower case 'g'. There's a reason for that. Let me just explain a couple of things first.
1. There is an innate and intimate questioning of faith and the relationship of man and God in the Roman Catholic faith. It comes with the faith itself. There are several quite spectacular theologians who have examined the issue and find the Roman Catholic faith doesn't stress several major concepts that are fundamental to the faith.
*Acceptance of others - A person who is Roman catholic should accept fellow with love and respect, it's not our place as human beings to judge, we live by our IDEAS, they live by their IDEAS. God is the only true judge. There are no exceptions to this rule. You accept and turn the other cheek, it's not your place to judge.
*Faith is a private matter - in the book of Matthew it generally lines up in almost all versions of the bible to say, "one should go into one's room to pray."
*Faith vs. Public - Christ is commented as saying "Give unto God what is God's and give unto Caesar what is Caesar's" Thus proving that Christianity is yet again solely an idea of it's followers with no place other than among it's followers. To some this is a justification for the idea of not actively bringing in members to the religion.
2. Honestly, as a person who believe in god with a lower case g I find the Roman Catholic faith lacking. As long as it doesn't hurt me or others. I think people should believe what they want and live whatever lifestyle they want. the lower case g represents the fact that to me god is a verb, not a proper noun. God isn't a name, god is a relationship. god is a relationship based on three things, complete love, understanding, and acceptance. These three things force a relationship to be completely positive in it's nature and beneficial to all people in the relationship. So when you have a beautiful relationship between two people like a true friendship or true love where the love is infinite and equal to both, that's god. Not some omnipotent being who we can't hear or know if he exists.
3. Just tell every Christian who tries to say otherwise to your ideas, "you think one way, I think another. Let's move on because if we sit here and attempt to talk about this it's not going to work. You can lead a horse to water but you can't necessarily force him to drink it."
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:58 pm
 I can relate to you, as a closet atheist. There's really one thing I do to prevent the hell that would come from my parents, and that's to pretend I'm still a good Catholic while inside I try not to scream "THIS IS ALL LIES." As to ward them off, there's always the whole quote that the person above me has posted. If they insist, tell them "Your god told you to love everyone and accept them for who they are. If you won't do that, then how can you call yourself a Catholic/Christian?" That should shut 'em up. Or call police and file harassment, I guess...
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:04 pm
I put my faith in humanity, not any god or gods.
It isn't entirely just not believing in one, although that is a good portion of it. I just don't care one way or the other if there is one. Mankind has to move forward on its own two feet, rather than fall into stagnant surroundings from taking an easy way out of responsibility.
I won't go against other people's beliefs if they understand that there is a time and place for it, but to counter any bullshit they fling I'd enjoy dismantling their arguments and fallacies.
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:11 pm
Don't throw me out for my opinion, it's hard to beat some of these opinions, but I hope maybe I can help. IIToxxicTess48II Okay... So, I'm 16 years old. I was raised in a Roman Catholic house hold, and I got to a Catholic High school. But, around the age of 8 I started questioning my religion, instead of sitting there like a mind-washed dog, just doing and believing all that I was told. One of the first things I ever thought about was "Why is it that when I pray, God never answers me back?... sad " This was quite upsetting to my 8 year old mind, and I didnt understand it one bit. God wants to Answer you back, you're probably not listening or just a bit oblivious! If you just allow it, it'll happen. Although I cannot speak from a personal standpoint my mother can. IIToxxicTess48II Now, I have my own reasons as to why I dont think there is a god, or if there is, why I dont think that the Catholic god isnt just. My mom and dad tell me reasons everyday on why the things I think arent right in the Catholic church; "People suffer because God has a bigger plan for them, and humans just dont see the bigger picture, hun." Well, that answer was just not going to cut it for me. I havent openly told them that Im atheistic (quite frankly because they would without a doubt disown me...), but I have told them, once in a while, my opinion on something they're sitting around talking about and making a big deal of it. Like, birth-control for an example. I think its nothing to be concerned about; if you dont want to have a kid for your own reason, you shouldnt have to risk having one by accidnet. But, apparently, God wants you to have 20 kids you cant take care of? No, wait, he just dont want you sex unless you want kids. Wait... I thought sex was a gift from God for us to enjoy?? See how confusing this is? It seems like no one I know personally can see what I see... stare Birth control isn't a bad thing necessarily, and having 20+ kids isn't a requirement. Sex is actually a sin if you can believe it, God wants to let you grow and prosper with as many kids as you can handle! Of course, that brings upon the subject of abortion one day or the other, now that's wrong. Just putting it out there. IIToxxicTess48II But, what I made this topic for is to ask any Atheists why you dont believe in god, and maybe some tips on how you defend yourself from crazy Catholics and/or fire-n'-brimstone preaching Christians? Also, if anyone is in the same position as me, stuck in a Roman Catholic world that frowns upon free thinking and questioning, tell me about it! I'd love to hear from anyone on how they have dealt with it or how you're living with it. Thanks for reading my first post! heart Although I'm not an Atheist, I still feel obligated to speak on my behalf. My parents are both Christians however my mother is more leaning on the religious side than my father, who is a bit more political.
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:12 pm
Wow, well, all of this has been really good reading so far. Thanks.
It all makes sense. Especially the point of "Good Christens are supposed to love and accept everyone as they are."
But, my parents are so... Whats the word? Ignorant? Thats one of the words to call them...
I came home today after school, and they started to complain about Glee. The television show Glee.
And how its all propaganda, and how its "brainwashing." That, and they voiced, once again, how much they dislike gays/homosexuals. Which really grinds my gears!!
And, Zekil, its nice to hear that Im not the only one who feels like that. Sitting back quietly while I feel like screaming: It kills me.
I know that Im not alone, and neither are you, but its nice hearing about it, ya know?
But, again, thanks for the replies so far. I like reading other's advice; It really helps. heart
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:16 pm
As a very proclaimed athiest I don't believe in a god or such, but I don't shove it down peoples throats. I will also respect religous people to an extent... Unless they try to convert me or something, then s**t gets real. I will also say my two cents in a religious discussion from my growing up during the summer in a hard-core Christian eviroment where girls and boys were seperated and went through training to be good little angels and proper ladies. Most of the time it's just proving things people think are in the bible aren't true.
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:36 pm
I don't think anyone has a real, hard hitting answer to the question, "Is there a God?" There are factors to take into account. The Earth was made up billions of years ago and we evolved through evolution, but where did this whole "God" idea initiate from? And its funny how other religions are very simular to each other.
Also, there are some aspects of religion that are good for us, good for learning about ourselves and society. Being together with family, having good, clean fun with other friends, staying loyal to only one lover. And its apart of your culture. Religion is apart of someone's culture. I don't go to chuch and junk, but I'll recongnize Lent- its a decent habit to have, giving up something you really like for forty days lets your appreciate what you have.
I agree that some people are brain washed. I choose to participate in Lent because I like to excerise my self control. Others participate because Father said its time. Now thats just not right.
But in the end, I just really wanted to say that, in my mind, I'll believe it when I see it. If there is a God, I don't want to be steered down the wrong path. If there isn't, well then... there isn't, and I wouldn't have been led down the wrong path. So yeah.
[/two cents]
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Posted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 7:28 pm
I grew up as a Catholic as well. I never became one of the crazy ones though. My grandmother happens to be one of the hardcore Catholics. I have a tattoo that she doesn't know about. She views them as bad since it "destroys God's temple. I never really understood that at all. The body turns to dust in the end, so it all isn't really forever lasting. Anyway, I do believe in God, but I don't attend any church. Except for if a friend invites me to go with them. I have always believed in letting people choose their own religions. There is no right or wrong and we wont know for sure until we die. I think life should be lived happily. There is no reason to hate anyone based upon religion. We are all the same, even for what I believe in I'm supposed to love everyone equally. It's not our place to judge others.
Speaking of religion, there are some crazy even just Christians (not Catholics). They are my friend's parents. He told them that he's gay and now they are trying to "cure him". What the hell? First off, he's 18. Second, it's not a disease. What really confuses me is that they are messing up my friend's boyfriend's life. They went to the church he plays bass for and told them that he's gay. What the hell? Who does that? My friend's boyfriend was fired from his job and that is another issue. Also, they are trying to force him to break up with his boyfriend. They thretened to get a restraining order against him, which will not work since my friend is again 18. Gosh!
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Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 2:40 am
You are the apple...
I am a Christian, I fully believe in God as my Lord and Saviour, so I'll toss my two cents in on this thread, if y'all don't mind...
First off, if you don't believe in a god, cool. More power to you. Religion is a belief system, beliefs are not truths, and I'm not gonna be like "YOU NEED TO REPENT AND FOLLOW THE LORD BLAH BLAH BLAH *rageface.jpg*". That's not me, that'll never be me. All I can do is merely live my life as an example of how I feel the Lord has blessed me, and hope that brings out a curiosity in others. I'll share my story and beliefs with whoever wants to hear 'em.
Second, I'm not too familiar with Catholicism, a fact which I'll have to change at some point, but I'll give you what I know of the Christian side regarding birth control. Sex is meant for marriage and marriage only. Something I really haven't lived by and am trying to change. Birth control, I don't know for a fact, but I would imagine there's no real issue with it, as long as it's used in the bonds of marriage. Another person could fact check that one for me as it's 2 in the morning and I don't feel like doing it myself lol.
Third, regarding Wuppa's post, it seemed a little lacking in tact, so I'd like to clear it up a bit with my own thoughts and hopefully hit what she was saying....Yes, God wants to answer you back, and He will, but sometimes you may miss it or its just a long time coming.
Fourth, I agree with everyone that MOST Christians/Catholics/etc. are hypocrites when it comes to "loving and accepting everyone". I do my very best to be outside that "most". I may fall short at times, but I will certainly never turn down anyone in need of help. And one look at my sig will tell you that I certainly don't hate the LGBTQ community. I personally stand for their rights are human beings.
Lastly, here are a few of my personal beliefs that aren't quite supported totally by the Bible.
- I believe we shouldn't totally take the Bible at face value, since, as many have pointed out, it's been altered who knows how many times over the course of history. My remedy? Take the rules and such written in the Bible and pray on them. God will lead you to the right answer, if you let Him.
- I'm still on shaky ground with this one, but I don't see why God would punish a man or woman for loving someone, including someone of their own sex. However, it's explicitly stated in the Bible that man shouldn't have sex with a man, so personally I don't see a problem with a man or woman marrying another man or woman, as long as they don't have sex. I'm gonna get flamed for that one left and right, I know. However (shameless disclaimer), the beliefs of one person should be allowed until they infringe upon the rights of another. Common idea, so if two gay people want to have sex, go ahead. Some may look down upon it, including me, but I'm not gonna stop them. That's their right and I have no business keeping that right from them.
TL;DR - 1. Religion is a belief system, I'm not gonna force mine on you. 2. In a Christian sense, as far as I know, birth control is fine during marriage since sex is meant for marriage. 3. "Loving and accepting people as they are" is what makes MOST Christians/Catholics/etc. hypocrites and I work to be outside that "most". 4. I don't think the Bible should be taken at face value, but combined with prayer to find out what God really wants from us.
and I am your core.
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Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 7:39 am
I'm so I'm Catholic, and I have the YouCat (Youth Catechism) right here
beside me, so if you want me to explain why your parents might have views
they do, or if you want to actually hear what the church has to say about
anything like gays, sex, and contraceptives, then quote me and I'll tell you.
I always find it offensive when people diss my religion, even if if was their
religion growing up and they think they know everything (which, no offense,
but most of the time they don't). Dissers generally hate hypocrites, just like
Jesus did, so if you really want to know the Church's view of this stuff, I will
tell you, but I'm not going to rant and expect you to listen right now.
You're pretty closed off from accepting my arguement anyways right now, or
that's what it sounds like, so I'll be here if you actually want answers.
<3
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Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 1:15 pm
I guess I'm under the crazy catholic catagory...
For me its a cultural thing, I don't agree with most catholic policies but I did take the vows so technically I will always be.
Truthfully, take a less antagonistic stance, and don't call them crazy, cause that's exactly what they are thinking of you. If anything, just don't bring up the topic and don't comply if someone asks you. I rarely bring up gods with anyone and that seems to work pretty well.
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Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 9:38 pm
Hurr...Religion was always a difficult thing for me.
I don't know - I do go to church, I do believe there is a God, I can't lable myself as a hardcore Christian, however.
But one thing I really don't stand for is forcing religion onto someone, especially if they really don't want to be involved.
My parents are a bit more understanding and realize I need time to think about whether I accept Christianity, but that's because my dad's not a believer in the first place and my mom's not a super strict person when it comes to this.
Your parents should understand that they should accept who you are and give you space and time to think about what you really want to believe it, and then they'll somehow have to get used to your decision.
yum_puddi
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:26 am
I'm a non-denominational first-century Christian. Which means I don't acknowledge the Catholic authority on anything religious. Frankly, hard-core Catholics scare me. But because I don't acknowledge Catholic authority, I don't keep Easter or X-mas, I don't go to church on Sunday, I avoid pork and shellfish like the plague, and I'm the proud user of birth control. And I still consider myself deeply religious.
A few things that I never understood about the Catholic faith: (And some things that generally deter the rants-and-raves of some hard-core Catholics and Christians I know)
gaia_diamond Why the Sabbath was changed from the 7th day to the 1st day. Especially when the 4th commandment COMMANDS observing the the divinely established Sabbath.
gaia_diamond Speaking of the 10 Commandments, didn't they change them up a bit? Wasn't there something later on about not adding or detracting from the bible or am I just crazy?
gaia_diamond Why they celebrate the birth of Jesus in the dead of winter when--if you honestly do the math without an covert motive--it turns out he was born in fall (and John the baptist was born in the spring, 6 months earlier).
gaia_diamond How they count 3 days and 3 nights between Good Friday and Palm Sunday--because I only ever get 1.5 days when I try to count it out.
gaia_diamond Why they pray to statues and pictures of Mary and the Saints. Isn't that called idolatry in "pagan" religions?
gaia_diamond Hell. Seriously, I don't get it. If God loves everyone, why would he send ANYONE to eternal damnation for 70 years of sin? Kinda seems out of proportion.
gaia_diamond Heaven. Again, seriously. Why let imperfect people into heaven? Because if you don't, then you have to send them to hell? What ever happened to the First and Second Resurrections and the Lake of Fire and the Millennium of Peace?
gaia_diamond The whole paying the church to have your sins forgiven thing. Pretty sure that the priests don't have much to say about what God writes in the Book of Life, but hey, I could be wrong and they have the Kindle copy inside their bibles. (Sarcasm)
I've noticed that most extremely religious people try to avoid these topics, because they don't have the answers--or more often, the answers are not what they want them to be. I've gotten all kinds of responses--One of the most memorable was when I confronted a very aggressive main-stream Christian about the Saturday/Sunday Sabbath thing. He tried to tell me that it didn't matter which day we dedicated to God, only that we set aside some time in our schedule. So I responded that if God didn't much care about which day we observed as a commanded Sabbath, then He must not be too particular on which religion I prescribe to so long as I was worshiping Him. That shut him up real quick. ^_^ I've had other people tell me "Saturday is a Jewish thing" to which my response is "Well, Jesus was a Jew." I've gotten some nasty looks (but oddly no compelling arguments to the contrary) for that one.
And for the whole "Why do bad things happen to good people" argument...well, basically because people have free moral agency and the repercussions of a lot of choices--consciously good, bad, or just in the middling gray area--far outlast what most people consider. God doesn't jump in every time someone is about to make a bad choice--can you imagine how many people would be resentful if He did?
Average Jane: "I'm going to go to a club tonight"
God: "Not dressed like that you're not. Go back to your room and read up on humility."
Average Joe: "I'm going to light up a pipe of weed so I can relax."
God: "No, because smoking defiles your body. I don't care if I made the plant like that, you're not supposed to use it that way."
Average Sue: "I'm in love--I'm going to have sex before he asks me to marry him."
God: "I don't think so. You're staying home and if you keep trying to fornicate, you'll never see your boyfriend again."
Average Bob: "I'm going to drive to work today."
God: "I'm keeping you home today, because if you go to work, you'll die in a car accident on the way."
Average Bob: "Then I'll call my boss and tell him that You said I could stay home today, God."
Average Arnold: "I'm going to kill this man because he is evil and deserves to die. Plus, by removing his influence from the world, I'm making it a better place for my children."
God: "Leave his death to me--I'm going to let him keep living for another 40 years, just to see if he can turn himself around."
Obviously I'm being facetious. I honestly don't think God is going to barge into anyone's life and order them around like that, because it defeats the point of having free moral agency. We make mistakes, and there is a random element to this perpetual motion machine we call life, the universe, and everything. So just like in Vegas, sometimes you hit the jackpot and sometimes you don't.
We all know that this life isn't fair and isn't perfect, and frankly I'm frustrated with people who expect some divine being to make life a cake-walk for them just because they pay lip-service to him. He never promises anything of the sort. I mean, seriously, name some of the people in the bible CLOSEST to God, and they went through more trials and miseries than ANYONE else. Lost of the NT guys were martyred. The prophets didn't fare much better--and God actually had a lion maul one to death for disobeying Him. Even King David lost his best friend in tragedy. So where DO people get the idea that they can go to a feel-good service (or feel-guilty mass, in the case of Catholics) every week and somehow get immunity without any further emotional or spiritual investment? SERIOUSLY! WHERE?!?
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