NOT A BOY OR GIRL! DIFFERENT GENDER! v2.0 (REWRITE 16/06/07)

What are your thoughts on androgynes?

Just like everyone else.	47.7%	[ 1790 ]
Just want to get away with crossdressing without being a REAL TG.	4.0%	[ 149 ]
What the hell? This makes no sense.	7.1%	[ 267 ]
Who cares?	11.1%	[ 416 ]
They're going to hell like all the other queers.	3.0%	[ 112 ]
POLLWHORE GIMME MAH GOLDS!	15.4%	[ 578 ]
Too long, didn't read.	11.7%	[ 437 ]
Total Votes:			[ 3749 ]

[neverwisefool]

EDs Ryuichi Sakuma

odd question...if it's not a boy, or a girl, what kind of cigar does the father pass out at the birth?

candy ones! smoking is bad for you anyway.

[EDs Ryuichi Sakuma]

frickinmuck

EDs Ryuichi Sakuma

odd question...if it's not a boy, or a girl, what kind of cigar does the father pass out at the birth?

candy ones! smoking is bad for you anyway.

*shrug* works for me!

[Maneki Neko 45]

Actually, as far as I know gender is something social and not biological and therefore no baby really has a gender as they haven't been socialized.

That cigar is a prediction of the future I think. xD Like, I'm going to raise jr into a fine man.

I have a question- if gender is something completely made by society, then if you are androgenous in one society, isnt it true if you moved to another place, where gender was defined as something else (Men had to act what this society would consider feminine or women act masculine) then you wouldn't be anymore?

[greatdevourer]

Maneki Neko 45

Actually, as far as I know gender is something social and not biological and therefore no baby really has a gender as they haven't been socialized.

That cigar is a prediction of the future I think. xD Like, I'm going to raise jr into a fine man.

I have a question- if gender is something completely made by society, then if you are androgenous in one society, isnt it true if you moved to another place, where gender was defined as something else (Men had to act what this society would consider feminine or women act masculine) then you wouldn't be anymore?

You know wrong - gender is to do with the physical structure of the brain, the part that makes it matter to us being the part of the brain that deals with body integrity (I have 2 arms, 2 legs and a v****a... wait, where'd that v****a go... s**t). The thing from society are the gender roles, needless exaggerations of biological imperatives forced upon us

[Isadorana]

This is a very interesting post, a large percentage of my friends identify with a "third" gender, and I must admit, I identify with both, sometimes I feel female, and sometimes male... It's a little odd, and most of my friends can tell when I feel like each corresponding gender... Although, I have to say I am curious as to what that makes me... am I an androgyne? I do appear completely androgynous, but most people say I appear to be a female, but I don't know...

[Kaosgirl]

greatdevourer

Maneki Neko 45

Actually, as far as I know gender is something social and not biological and therefore no baby really has a gender as they haven't been socialized.

That cigar is a prediction of the future I think. xD Like, I'm going to raise jr into a fine man.

I have a question- if gender is something completely made by society, then if you are androgenous in one society, isnt it true if you moved to another place, where gender was defined as something else (Men had to act what this society would consider feminine or women act masculine) then you wouldn't be anymore?

You know wrong - gender is to do with the physical structure of the brain, the part that makes it matter to us being the part of the brain that deals with body integrity (I have 2 arms, 2 legs and a v****a... wait, where'd that v****a go... s**t). The thing from society are the gender roles, needless exaggerations of biological imperatives forced upon us

Of course, this wrong knowledge raises a point that should be considered: that it is possible to confuse rejection of the socially enforced gender role with rejection of the gender itself.

This is a bit of a dangerous point, because if it's overstated it leads to the wrong idea - that transgenderism, especially non-binary identities, are primarily a result of that confusion. I want to emphasize that I consider that an erroneous conclusion in general; but it's a question I do think most transgenders should consider. At the very least, failure to think about that possibility increases the risk of post-transition regrets.

[shishikogan]

Isadorana

This is a very interesting post, a large percentage of my friends identify with a "third" gender, and I must admit, I identify with both, sometimes I feel female, and sometimes male... It's a little odd, and most of my friends can tell when I feel like each corresponding gender... Although, I have to say I am curious as to what that makes me... am I an androgyne? I do appear completely androgynous, but most people say I appear to be a female, but I don't know...

i'm the same actually. i feel like i'm both male and female. i do tend to associate myself more with females, but i think that's because i'm physically female so that's how i was socially brought up. but sometimes i feel myself feeling particularly male. my best friend can tell when i'm more male than female, he says i actually give off a different smell even. O.O

yours truly

shishikogan

[Isadorana]

shishikogan

Isadorana

This is a very interesting post, a large percentage of my friends identify with a "third" gender, and I must admit, I identify with both, sometimes I feel female, and sometimes male... It's a little odd, and most of my friends can tell when I feel like each corresponding gender... Although, I have to say I am curious as to what that makes me... am I an androgyne? I do appear completely androgynous, but most people say I appear to be a female, but I don't know...

i'm the same actually. i feel like i'm both male and female. i do tend to associate myself more with females, but i think that's because i'm physically female so that's how i was socially brought up. but sometimes i feel myself feeling particularly male. my best friend can tell when i'm more male than female, he says i actually give off a different smell even. O.O

yours truly

shishikogan

...that's a little disturbing (mostly because he's sniffing you...) my friends never smell me, so I don't know if my scent changes... But I have to admit, that brings up a whole array of questions, most prominent of which is, "does that mean that it truly is genetic?" and if so, can we pass it on to our children?

[error-dot-tar]

Isadorana

shishikogan

Isadorana

This is a very interesting post, a large percentage of my friends identify with a "third" gender, and I must admit, I identify with both, sometimes I feel female, and sometimes male... It's a little odd, and most of my friends can tell when I feel like each corresponding gender... Although, I have to say I am curious as to what that makes me... am I an androgyne? I do appear completely androgynous, but most people say I appear to be a female, but I don't know...

i'm the same actually. i feel like i'm both male and female. i do tend to associate myself more with females, but i think that's because i'm physically female so that's how i was socially brought up. but sometimes i feel myself feeling particularly male. my best friend can tell when i'm more male than female, he says i actually give off a different smell even. O.O

yours truly

shishikogan

...that's a little disturbing (mostly because he's sniffing you...) my friends never smell me, so I don't know if my scent changes... But I have to admit, that brings up a whole array of questions, most prominent of which is, "does that mean that it truly is genetic?" and if so, can we pass it on to our children?

There's a lot of things about biology that can change how one smells. It doesn't have to be genetic. Supposedly, when people start taking hormone replacement therapy, their scent changes. This suggests it has something to do with hormone levels. I don't know if there's any other factors, but I doubt scent would point to a genetic cause.

[[Blacklight]]

So... you consider yourself androgynous because you don't feel as though you belong to the societal stereotypes concerning males and females?

I'm definitely missing something here, but it seems to me like if you're female physically, then you're female in gender. I don't care what you think you are, there are people that think they're the second reincarnation of Jesus. Thinking it doesn't make it true. What anyone thinks doesn't really matter in the least...

EDIT: Well what do you know, gender is psychological. That explains what I was missing. I guess if you desperately feel the need to define yourself in terms of gender, then that makes sense.

[Wishbone R]

Kaosgirl

greatdevourer

Maneki Neko 45

Actually, as far as I know gender is something social and not biological and therefore no baby really has a gender as they haven't been socialized.

That cigar is a prediction of the future I think. xD Like, I'm going to raise jr into a fine man.

I have a question- if gender is something completely made by society, then if you are androgenous in one society, isnt it true if you moved to another place, where gender was defined as something else (Men had to act what this society would consider feminine or women act masculine) then you wouldn't be anymore?

You know wrong - gender is to do with the physical structure of the brain, the part that makes it matter to us being the part of the brain that deals with body integrity (I have 2 arms, 2 legs and a v****a... wait, where'd that v****a go... s**t). The thing from society are the gender roles, needless exaggerations of biological imperatives forced upon us

Of course, this wrong knowledge raises a point that should be considered: that it is possible to confuse rejection of the socially enforced gender role with rejection of the gender itself.

This is a bit of a dangerous point, because if it's overstated it leads to the wrong idea - that transgenderism, especially non-binary identities, are primarily a result of that confusion. I want to emphasize that I consider that an erroneous conclusion in general; but it's a question I do think most transgenders should consider. At the very least, failure to think about that possibility increases the risk of post-transition regrets.

I'm pretty sure that the dysphoria caused by transgendardism would feel much different than rejection of socially enforced gender roles.

For example, I'm a cisgendered woman. I reject gender roles- but I feel just fine in my body. My brain takes inventory of my body, and everything is where it should be: I haven't got any extra sex organs that brings up error messages in my brain, nor am I lacking anything.

While I can't speak from experience, I think a dysphoria would be much different than an intellectual objection to overly-traditional social constructs.

[Wishbone R]

[Blacklight]

So... you consider yourself androgynous because you don't feel as though you belong to the societal stereotypes concerning males and females?

No. Rejecting gender roles is very different from lacking a biological gender. Tay has GID; she's considered androgyne because she doesn't feel that she belongs in a body with a v****a. And I say 'feel' with the utmost of caution; this is a condition with a set diagnostic criteria, not something she just kinda guesses she might fit in with.

Quote:

EDIT: Well what do you know, gender is psychological. That explains what I was missing. I guess if you desperately feel the need to define yourself in terms of gender, then that makes sense.

Well, it's psychological (identity), biological (hormone and brain shape), and social (roles and stereotypes). That's a lot to keep track of. And then there's sex, which is organs and chromosomes, which connects to biological gender, which determines psychological identity, and gets you socially judged according to your culture's roles and stigmas.

So it's never as simple as the general public makes it out to be.

[ThePsychoticRaccoon]

would i date an androgyne? I doubt it. I like guys. They attract me. No harm in that.

The concept of androgynes confuses me just a bit. In society people are classified as male or female, and to be in between kind of fries our circuits. I have nothing against you, you are just... beyond my understanding -- I don't mean that in a mean way. I think the whole androgyne thing is something you have to be experiencing to understand.

[Anissa_X]

ThePsychoticRaccoon

would i date an androgyne? I doubt it. I like guys. They attract me. No harm in that.

The concept of androgynes confuses me just a bit. In society people are classified as male or female, and to be in between kind of fries our circuits. I have nothing against you, you are just... beyond my understanding -- I don't mean that in a mean way. I think the whole androgyne thing is something you have to be experiencing to understand.

For me, the concept is easy...I don't have a gender identity. If I were switched to male tomorrow, I' d live exactly the same. My body is simply the vessel for my soul.