Will edit if I think of any more brilliant ideas and/or realize something I have said is ridiculous and/or stupid.
This is a comprehensive compilation of all of the posts about this issue I have made thus far. If I figure out someone really really influential who likes me a lot I will send this to them and maybe they can help us out.
This will not include the following points which have been reiterated several times in several different threads, such as this one:
-Friends Chat by its own rules and definition is not the proper forum for fanthreads.
-By the GCD's definition, fanthreads should be allowed somewhere in its forum
-Theoretically, fanthreads could continue somewhere else (ie, Friends chat, guilds), but they truly belong, are far more effective and will be able to grow with more ease in the GCD
The point of fanthreads is not to be the sole place to discuss something. It is to be a place for people who are fans of something gaia related to get together and talk about that thing. When you post a thread in the GCD as what could possibly be the sole believer in something, it's scary and you get a lot of "I don't care"s or "Your idea is wrong"s. But in a fanthread, people always care, because it's about something they care about, and people tend to be far more accepting of new ideas as a result. This accepting, caring nature creates a firey passion for the subject at hand and opens a whole new world to the user. The love for gaia that stems from a GCD-based fanthread is a unique love that can be hard to find elsewhere. That instilled love in the user, as a result of the fanthread, helps to grow the GCD, as the user's passion for gaia guides their discursive thought processes in threads outside of their fanthread.
I still don't understand why they couldn't have just seen the support for an alternate forum, taken the hint, and begun work on applications for moderators for the forum. Especially given the fact that there are so many fanthreads that diligently abide by the rules of the GCD, it shouldn't be too hard to accept the fact that those threads can be controlled and moderated in accordance with those rules without much difficulty. If that fact can be accepted, and the only reason why a subforum was not made is because of the lack of users to moderate it, that obstacle can easily be overcome.
I'm honestly all for a little bit more strict regulation. If a thread has more than a page of completely off-topic discussion, they SHOULD be warned or penalized. If they care enough about being in the GCD (subforum or no), they'll abide by the rules, and if they slip up and are moved, they'll stay on topic for as long as long as it takes to be moved back and then stay that way so that they can stay. Some occasional side-notes in posts would be perfectly fine, but fanthreads should be there for the sole purpose of discussing their particular topic, and if they must create a thread in an appropriate forum for off-topic chatter, they need to do so.
The possibility of less activity is a sacrifice those threads would have to accept if they wanted to stay in the forum. The Gambino Support Thread made that sacrifice long ago, and we're still kickin'.
I believe that fanthreads and extended gaian discussion threads are an integral part of the GCD, and without them, the core of its users will be less serious, less dedicated and less passionate about gaia. The thing that has really made the GCD home for me and the GST is the passion GCD users have and have always had for gaia. That passion seems to rapidly be falling by the wayside, and getting rid of the fanthreads in the GCD will only further that effect.
In fact, come to think of it, I find that the most dedicated and passionate users are the ones who care so much about gaia that they are willing to talk about one aspect of it for over five thousand pages. Our diligency in discussing this problem at length and working to find a solution that is best for the gaian community is an example of this. If we didn't care so much, we wouldn't try so hard. Gaia should be fostering that dedication rather than treating it like an unruly child and sending it to the corner.
We deserve respect, we deserve for our voices to be heard, and we deserve to be a part of this community that is the GCD, this community which we have been a part of for so long. To be treated in any other way is hurtful and degrades all of the hard work that we have gone through to come this far. To have my thread, the Gambino Support Thread, be treated this way after over three and a half years of dedication and contribution to the GCD, it really truly angers me.
I mentioned it a while ago, but I remember in April of what I think was 2007 when the mods played a cruel April Fool's joke on the fanthreads and moved them to the chatterbox. Even then, when we knew what was going on, and when we knew it was a joke, it still felt like we were being kicked out of our home, and once our threads were moved to the chatterbox, we all realized what a grave mistake had been made. Now the same mistake is being made again, but on much more serious terms. I feel now as though not only am I being kicked out of my home, I am being shoved out of a car going 60 miles per hour into God knows where at God knows what time of night.
And do you know who was driving the car?
My mommy.
As a side note, I must say, I am thoroughly regretting buying a couple of letters and 500 cash earlier this week... I was all giddy about the recent plot update and getting to beta test zOMG, but now I feel as though I have been decieved!
Excellent posts made by equally outraged users:
Madam ZZ
This is too much.
I've remained here through many bad decisions brought on by the Gaian staff--targeting the GST while Gino's Harem was rewarded for being continually off-topic, anyone remember that? Allowing and then restricting a huge Gaian storyline to a small sect of users? Auto-deleting mass waves of avatars due to no longer wanting glitches on the site? The MTV shop? Reducing the site from a forum community about RPGing to an abomination of collective ads? These are only but a few.
I stayed a member of Gaia throughout all the bad times, for years, because I loved the community.
But it's no longer a community; it hasn't been a community for a long time now.
The storyline was what first got me into actually investing time and effort into Gaia, and for too long now it has been the only motivator to get me to log in anymore. Removing main-topic threads is a bad idea; thirty or more three-or-five-post-only threads are not going to encourage me to continue discussing the Gambinos; as for "friend chats," I do that on LJ, not Gaia.
If they intend to do away with every last shred of what made this site a community, I'm sure they've accomplished it with this.
I've remained here through many bad decisions brought on by the Gaian staff--targeting the GST while Gino's Harem was rewarded for being continually off-topic, anyone remember that? Allowing and then restricting a huge Gaian storyline to a small sect of users? Auto-deleting mass waves of avatars due to no longer wanting glitches on the site? The MTV shop? Reducing the site from a forum community about RPGing to an abomination of collective ads? These are only but a few.
I stayed a member of Gaia throughout all the bad times, for years, because I loved the community.
But it's no longer a community; it hasn't been a community for a long time now.
The storyline was what first got me into actually investing time and effort into Gaia, and for too long now it has been the only motivator to get me to log in anymore. Removing main-topic threads is a bad idea; thirty or more three-or-five-post-only threads are not going to encourage me to continue discussing the Gambinos; as for "friend chats," I do that on LJ, not Gaia.
If they intend to do away with every last shred of what made this site a community, I'm sure they've accomplished it with this.
Caryn
I wouldn't mind community projects so much because then at least I wouldn't feel so... I don't even quite know what the word is I'm looking for. I guess I feel like this decision is basically just saying "GTFO" to all the fanthreads that people have been working so hard on and so devoted to for years. If it were still in SOME subforum of the GCD, it wouldn't feel quite so personal and insulting, I think.
Liccy
Goodness... At first I thought it was April Fools all over again. gonk
I don't get it... doesn't the description for the forum read as follows:
Gaia Community Discussion
Discuss what's happening on Gaia - the events, the stories, the NPC's and more.
Seriously... if one can't talk about NPC's or become a community that discusses about something in Gaia in the GCD, Gaia's really gotta do some major reconfiguration on their description for their forums.
And why "friend's chat" of all places?
Okay, I understand that maybe newbies would like to get to know Gaia a bit more, after their initial postings at the Welcome Forum, and come across the fanthreads for more info... but isn't that what the GCD was supposed to be for in the first place? GYAH!!
Now, as an ex-mod in training, I got to feel how hard it was to monitor the forums and threads and while at the same time answer PM's about whatnot... but this is just cheating to push this supposed problem (of fanthreads turned runaway topic HOT's) under the rug... or to a different forum altogether.
I don't get it... doesn't the description for the forum read as follows:
Gaia Community Discussion
Discuss what's happening on Gaia - the events, the stories, the NPC's and more.
Seriously... if one can't talk about NPC's or become a community that discusses about something in Gaia in the GCD, Gaia's really gotta do some major reconfiguration on their description for their forums.
And why "friend's chat" of all places?
Okay, I understand that maybe newbies would like to get to know Gaia a bit more, after their initial postings at the Welcome Forum, and come across the fanthreads for more info... but isn't that what the GCD was supposed to be for in the first place? GYAH!!
Now, as an ex-mod in training, I got to feel how hard it was to monitor the forums and threads and while at the same time answer PM's about whatnot... but this is just cheating to push this supposed problem (of fanthreads turned runaway topic HOT's) under the rug... or to a different forum altogether.
Gloria Kyrie
What an absolutely perfect way to end this horrible day. neutral What next, you guys, separate forums for theories and speculation? Because obviously there's some difference between those two words? Moving fanthreads has done nothing for this forum, and I hope it'll show soon enough.
All the different things going on here, the fanthreads, the community projects, the theory threads, it was all what made the GCD so much fun! 05-06 was my favorite year on Gaia, because we had the perfect mix of all these things going on, only made more fun by the plot. And people b***h about how the fanthreads had become HOTs...when they don't know the GCD was like that everywhere before. All this cracking down...this is ridiculous.
Fanthreads belong here, whether people liked it or not, and if anything, they should have talked it over with fanthread owners and worked something out.
All the different things going on here, the fanthreads, the community projects, the theory threads, it was all what made the GCD so much fun! 05-06 was my favorite year on Gaia, because we had the perfect mix of all these things going on, only made more fun by the plot. And people b***h about how the fanthreads had become HOTs...when they don't know the GCD was like that everywhere before. All this cracking down...this is ridiculous.
Fanthreads belong here, whether people liked it or not, and if anything, they should have talked it over with fanthread owners and worked something out.
Rychi
I guess they didn't want to give on-topic threads that actually followed the rules any special treatment. Because they said that if they did, there would be even MORE backlash. Which, I find is hard to believe. The most vocal people are the ones who have established and on-topic threads.
It would have been easier to say that the topics moved were not consistently on topic, rather than move all of the threads saying that NONE of them were on topic.
Sheshira
From another thread I posted in:
Exactly.
A fanthread subforum looks good on paper, but once you realise that all the fanthreads in there would go off-topic and be moved out it starts to look a bit daft.
"Your fanthread is not suitable for the fanthread subforum."
I can easily explain that.
A GCD fan thread or permanent is one that has to remain relevant and on topic about whatever they are discussing be it items, NPCs etc.
Being a part of Sheep of Fleep thread I understand what a true hang out thread looks like. I've been a part of the Believers' thread in the past and understood what a "fan thread" that started out with relevant, on topic discussion and go into pure hang out thread looks like. I've also seen fan threads in the GCD stay completely on topic far longer and with more dedication than even some of the shorter, temporary threads in the main forum. It's those threads that I don't necessarily want to see shunted out of GCD because it is community discussion.
So for me that statement "Your fanthread is not suitable for the fanthread subforum" would make sense given the obvious rules that would be in effect of a possible fan thread subforum.
Seth Darkheart
terradi
I don't know ... but you're not the first to suggest it. The thing is, if they go offtopic, they're really not community discussion anymore or ... well, anything other than a hangout thread, I think. Friends Chat or Chatterbox both could house them. I'm not sure that a subforum is really necessary or appropriate.
Exactly.
A fanthread subforum looks good on paper, but once you realise that all the fanthreads in there would go off-topic and be moved out it starts to look a bit daft.
"Your fanthread is not suitable for the fanthread subforum."
I can easily explain that.
A GCD fan thread or permanent is one that has to remain relevant and on topic about whatever they are discussing be it items, NPCs etc.
Being a part of Sheep of Fleep thread I understand what a true hang out thread looks like. I've been a part of the Believers' thread in the past and understood what a "fan thread" that started out with relevant, on topic discussion and go into pure hang out thread looks like. I've also seen fan threads in the GCD stay completely on topic far longer and with more dedication than even some of the shorter, temporary threads in the main forum. It's those threads that I don't necessarily want to see shunted out of GCD because it is community discussion.
So for me that statement "Your fanthread is not suitable for the fanthread subforum" would make sense given the obvious rules that would be in effect of a possible fan thread subforum.
T h e s t e p H
Being a spiteful person by nature certainly doesn't help me in this regard.
I, for one, cannot be civil about this. This was handled wrong from the start, and the "options" we've been presented with and were forced to come up with ourselves are just so offensively pathetic that it really makes me sick.
We should not be forced to retreat to the guilds, and let me go on record as saying that I am absolutely against that idea.
We weren't violating the GCD rules. This thread, and several other fanthreads, were well in line with Community Discussion, and to toss them into Friends Chat or make the owners "restructure" the threads so we can just shut up and be happy with being shuffled into Community Projects is disgusting.
I've lost my respect for them. All of them. And if you told me tomorrow every one of them had been stripped, I'd be one hell of a happy camper.
There is no point in being a moderator if you're not going to do the damn job, read the damn threads, and actually take the time to sort through them.
To just dump us all off in FC with no warning, no options, and no justification is a spit in the face,
and telling us we have the right to be pissed and rant! Good Knight, just pat me on the head and call me a poor thing, why don't you?
I could b***h about this all day. I really could. And the sad fact is they've really kind of killed this for me.
This thread is the main reason I bother to log on everyday, and as far as I'm concerned from where I sit they're trying to kill it.
I just sit here and think of all the times I really looked over my posts to make sure that they were GCD friendly, or saw the topic starting to stray and tried to bring it back, so as not to give those jackasses an excuse to axe us.
Of course, I was under the impression then that moderators actually moderated and bothered themselves with doing their job and reading the posts and making sure things stayed on topic.
I can't make any sort of call on this, Rei, because I don't want to settle. I don't want to take their offer to be herded into a forum we don't belong in because these mods are, apparently, incapable of moderating. I'd really rather start a new topic every week there and flood the GCD with repeat topics and just generally be a mega b***h about this than just take their pathetic attempts at placating us after the fact. Hell, I'd rather cut off my nose to spite my face and stay right the hell where I am than take that offer.
The only thing I can say is don't you dare take us to the guilds, Rei, because if you take us there this thread will die. It will not survive being maintained by the five or six of us that post here regularly.
This following will die if you take it to the guilds.
Now, I actually do have something Edmund related to discuss, but I'm putting that in a separate post, because if this one is deleted I don't want my Gaian Community related message,
something which I've always tried to keep to,
deleted with it.
Community Member
It starts at 9pm EST [6pm PST].
I do hope I'll see you there.