Here's a brain melter if ever there was one...

[Princessofwhatever]

divineseraph

Princessofwhatever

People who are retarded still have hearts like us. They aren't less of human beings than the rest of us. They are judged like the rest of us, by God according to their hearts (which humans often seem too shallow to judge so deeply and accurately. Therefore, only God can truly judge us). Also, disorders and such are purely physical (of the body, brain, genes, etc). Our souls are not physical like that, and our souls are what go to Heaven. Therefore, logically, the disorders no longer exist in Heaven.

So, what is the physical part? How much of us is the physical? Emotions can be altered with chemicals. how much of us is fake? How much goes away? Again, doesn't this, in essence, destroy who we are now?

The physical is comprised of our bodies and brain, things that can be absolutely observed and proven by science, things we can see, hear, touch, smell, etc. The soul is none of these. In death, these things are destroyed, but the soul carries on. The soul is who we are under the shell of our physical selves. Chemical imbalances, mental retardation, all physical ailments are removed from us when we move on, but the soul still lives. Mentally retarded isn't who people are. It's just an aspect of what they are. Therefore, when it is gone, they are still who they are. It's like if someone has Schizophrenia. If they are cured of it, it does not destroy who they are.  

[divineseraph]

Princessofwhatever

divineseraph

Princessofwhatever

People who are retarded still have hearts like us. They aren't less of human beings than the rest of us. They are judged like the rest of us, by God according to their hearts (which humans often seem too shallow to judge so deeply and accurately. Therefore, only God can truly judge us). Also, disorders and such are purely physical (of the body, brain, genes, etc). Our souls are not physical like that, and our souls are what go to Heaven. Therefore, logically, the disorders no longer exist in Heaven.

So, what is the physical part? How much of us is the physical? Emotions can be altered with chemicals. how much of us is fake? How much goes away? Again, doesn't this, in essence, destroy who we are now?

The physical is comprised of our bodies and brain, things that can be absolutely observed and proven by science, things we can see, hear, touch, smell, etc. The soul is none of these. In death, these things are destroyed, but the soul carries on. The soul is who we are under the shell of our physical selves. Chemical imbalances, mental retardation, all physical ailments are removed from us when we move on, but the soul still lives. Mentally retarded isn't who people are. It's just an aspect of what they are. Therefore, when it is gone, they are still who they are. It's like if someone has Schizophrenia. If they are cured of it, it does not destroy who they are.

All well and good... But science can say that a lot of things are physical. Happiness, love, sadness, all emotion has scientific evidence of being chemical reaction. So, what I am now- How much is my soul? Do I still think that ninjas would kick pirate a**? Do I still respect muslims and think they should be allowed entrance into heaven? Am I still a trascendentalist? Do I still prefer silver to gold?  

[Dcaff]

lordstar

perhaps we have more than one chance at life

reincarnation anyone.

Not Biblical. There is no mention of reincarnation in Scripture nor in anything that discribes the doctrine of Christianity. Also, if reincarnation were true, a few other things would come into question:

1. Heaven and Hell. If a spirit is constantly jumping from shell to shell, why does Scripture mention heaven and hell? It seems that eternity wouldn't be mentioned in the way it is described if reincarnation were part of the picture.

2. The purpose of Jesus. The concept of reincarnation revolves around the idea that a person has more work to do before they can move on, which would cancel the need for Jesus if there was some way we could just keep going in essence til we "get it right".

3. Our own uniqueness and the fact that we are told each one of us is made special and different.  

[Princessofwhatever]

divineseraph

Princessofwhatever

divineseraph

Princessofwhatever

People who are retarded still have hearts like us. They aren't less of human beings than the rest of us. They are judged like the rest of us, by God according to their hearts (which humans often seem too shallow to judge so deeply and accurately. Therefore, only God can truly judge us). Also, disorders and such are purely physical (of the body, brain, genes, etc). Our souls are not physical like that, and our souls are what go to Heaven. Therefore, logically, the disorders no longer exist in Heaven.

So, what is the physical part? How much of us is the physical? Emotions can be altered with chemicals. how much of us is fake? How much goes away? Again, doesn't this, in essence, destroy who we are now?

The physical is comprised of our bodies and brain, things that can be absolutely observed and proven by science, things we can see, hear, touch, smell, etc. The soul is none of these. In death, these things are destroyed, but the soul carries on. The soul is who we are under the shell of our physical selves. Chemical imbalances, mental retardation, all physical ailments are removed from us when we move on, but the soul still lives. Mentally retarded isn't who people are. It's just an aspect of what they are. Therefore, when it is gone, they are still who they are. It's like if someone has Schizophrenia. If they are cured of it, it does not destroy who they are.

All well and good... But science can say that a lot of things are physical. Happiness, love, sadness, all emotion has scientific evidence of being chemical reaction. So, what I am now- How much is my soul? Do I still think that ninjas would kick pirate a**? Do I still respect muslims and think they should be allowed entrance into heaven? Am I still a trascendentalist? Do I still prefer silver to gold?

Your choices (concerning practice of free will) would be things that are not of the physical. They are reflections of the heart (not the physical one). Therefore, i would say that what motivates your preferences and ideals at the core remains. It's part of what other people can't judge because they can't see it and don't know it. Sometimes we don't even know that part of ourselves. Even if we do know it, sometimes we can't really verbally describe it to the full extent, to the point where other people would understand. If one can think about themselves and find out if at the the core they are truly good or evil, then they have found a major part of what their soul is. However, as humans, we constantly base our opinions of whether someone is good or evil based upon their words and/or actions, when such aren't always determining factors of whether one is truly good or evil at the core. Also, our perceptions of such are biased by our own views about what is acceptable or unacceptable, forgivable or unforgivable, good or evil, etc. Therefore, often we don't even know if we are good or evil. Thus, what all is part of the soul is not always apparent to us for each individual. But in general, what at the core motivates how one practices his/her free will, i would say is a major aspect of what remains in his/her soul. But specific preferences such as silver over gold are not because such can possibly change (with new knowledge can come new preferences), and the soul is constant. So unless preferences are always, under all real (not hypothetical) circumstances, constant or Truths, then they are not part of the soul, but are of the physical.  

[Bane Ad Vitam]

divineseraph

All well and good... But science can say that a lot of things are physical. Happiness, love, sadness, all emotion has scientific evidence of being chemical reaction. So, what I am now- How much is my soul? Do I still think that ninjas would kick pirate a**? Do I still respect muslims and think they should be allowed entrance into heaven? Am I still a trascendentalist? Do I still prefer silver to gold?

God might decide to change the one about the pirates though.
xd
Lol, I'm just kidding. Just kidding.

 

[missymisa]

Ok, even retarded people can make the dicision to follow christ or not, At least I think so, It's not like they are completely stupid or something, they can still think for themselves, it's just that they cant do it as well as other people, "normal" people, And in heaven we will all have perfect bodies, so technically the disorder will be "erased" So if they accepted Jesus in their hearts then yes, they will go to heaven, and if they didn't then not, it's just the same for everyone. It's not like they get some kind of special treatment cuz God decided to make them retared in this life here on earth  

[Nekkid Glomper]

We need to remember that all earthly things will one day perish, and no longer exist...those who live 'earthly lives' will have nothing left when in Heaven...so, those who, while on Earth, that live Heavenly lives, will have something left when they enter Heaven...all their sins/disease/etc...will be gone forever...

So, as for how much of ourselves we'll be when in Heaven, I believe it depends what kind of a life we live while on Earth...if you've lived you entire life in sin and then repented before you died and made it to Heaven, most of who you were won't exist in Heaven. But, if you live a long Heavenly life, why would any of you need to be changed? It wouldn't make sense to change something that is doing what it's supposed to. (you find a computer that does everything you need it to do to. It wouldn't make sense to buy a different computer...)  

[lordstar]

Dcaff

lordstar

perhaps we have more than one chance at life

reincarnation anyone.

Not Biblical. There is no mention of reincarnation in Scripture nor in anything that discribes the doctrine of Christianity. Also, if reincarnation were true, a few other things would come into question:

1. Heaven and Hell. If a spirit is constantly jumping from shell to shell, why does Scripture mention heaven and hell? It seems that eternity wouldn't be mentioned in the way it is described if reincarnation were part of the picture.

2. The purpose of Jesus. The concept of reincarnation revolves around the idea that a person has more work to do before they can move on, which would cancel the need for Jesus if there was some way we could just keep going in essence til we "get it right".

3. Our own uniqueness and the fact that we are told each one of us is made special and different.

so its not posible to return from heaven to do gods work
im not talking about resurrection but rather making a reference to Tibetan beliefs

"There is no mention of reincarnation in Scripture nor in anything that discribes the doctrine of Christianity."
there is in Tibet

i have no idea where you got #3 from reincarnation
Reincarnation would not ever make anyone not made special or different
we are not talking about clones here (different subject and since peole are diffined as specaly oriented makeing a clone is technicaly imposible ie they cannot take up the same space and be made of the exact same atoms)

ans #1
what if we are living in hell and we stay untill we get it right

ans #2
what if Jesus is the bridge that allows reincarnation as opposed to nothingness
reincarnation kinda sounds like pergatory

try to look outside your bible for answers too
not only will it lend to your credibility but it will open doors to new thought

im not saying im right or that your wrong
i just keep looking for answers is all  

[Nekkid Glomper]

In testimonies, like the ones in my sig, they tell of people who Jesus has shown hell, so that they may testify of its existance...

There are people who have been there for years...so some long they don't even know how long...if a person/soul lives on in hell for so long, there's no way reincarnation can be true...

While we don't have an indefinite amount of time to 'get it right,' we do have many opportunities while alive on Earth...we can repent, go to church, spread His Word...and we can do all those things multiple times throughout our lives...

We may have multiple chances while alive to 'get it right,' but we only get one chance at life...  

[Dcaff]

lordstar

Dcaff

lordstar

perhaps we have more than one chance at life

reincarnation anyone.

Not Biblical. There is no mention of reincarnation in Scripture nor in anything that discribes the doctrine of Christianity. Also, if reincarnation were true, a few other things would come into question:

1. Heaven and Hell. If a spirit is constantly jumping from shell to shell, why does Scripture mention heaven and hell? It seems that eternity wouldn't be mentioned in the way it is described if reincarnation were part of the picture.

2. The purpose of Jesus. The concept of reincarnation revolves around the idea that a person has more work to do before they can move on, which would cancel the need for Jesus if there was some way we could just keep going in essence til we "get it right".

3. Our own uniqueness and the fact that we are told each one of us is made special and different.

so its not posible to return from heaven to do gods work
im not talking about resurrection but rather making a reference to Tibetan beliefs

"There is no mention of reincarnation in Scripture nor in anything that discribes the doctrine of Christianity."
there is in Tibet

i have no idea where you got #3 from reincarnation
Reincarnation would not ever make anyone not made special or different
we are not talking about clones here (different subject and since peole are diffined as specaly oriented makeing a clone is technicaly imposible ie they cannot take up the same space and be made of the exact same atoms)

ans #1
what if we are living in hell and we stay untill we get it right

ans #2
what if Jesus is the bridge that allows reincarnation as opposed to nothingness
reincarnation kinda sounds like pergatory

try to look outside your bible for answers too
not only will it lend to your credibility but it will open doors to new thought

im not saying im right or that your wrong
i just keep looking for answers is all

I appreciate your thoughts and reply!

I am a Christian so I believe in the authority of Scripture and therefore I do quote it and I do model my life after its doctrines and teachings, which is to say the doctrines and teachings of Jesus. That is, afterall, what a christian is. So, to quote Scripture and rest firmly on it is not at all unnatural. To say that it is the only thing I read would be false. To say I give anything as much weight as Scripture, however, is. To say that makes my thinking inferior is for the individual to judge for themself and yet not my concern. I live to serve Jesus and please him. I love him a lot!

I do believe that it is important to never stop learning and especially never to stop trying to understand each other more. A personal hobby of mine is in fact, learning about other religeons and philosophies. Currently I am studying Mormonism and Jehova's Witnesses. Next I plan on studying Bhuddism. I also enjoy studying history, archaeology, psycology etc. I'm not saying that to sound smart. In getting back to the subject of the beginning of this thread, the level of a person's intelligence doesn't matter because the message of Jesus is simple...so simple in fact, that it irritates the majority of humanity, but nevertheless it is what it is.

Mankind is always trying to overcomplicate things, isn't it? It is easily seen in history, in the way we continue to branch out and create a seemingly infinite number of philosophies, governments and social structures. For all that thinking and learning, I'm not so sure we've brought ourselves any closer to world peace. If I'm not mistaken, dominant Tibetan belief rests primarily in Bhuddism (please correct me if I'm wrong by the way) and part of Bhuddism revolves around the concept of simplicity, of in essence, cutting out the chatter, of ultimately attaining Nirvana. That isn't an entirely bad idea is it! I guess one of the things you're probably trying to point out to me is that we need to take things with a grain of salt. I agree with much of that statement!  

[Son of Beren]

My reading of the bible leads me to believe that menatl challenged people would be treated much like children, most mental impairments prevent the mind from maturing. Of course, it's hard to say what level of faith they may have achieved while alive, but when we are all int the city of god after the end of this world, we will be remade new, old bodies and relationships will be removed and we will bask in the glory of God.  

[NathanRahal]

divineseraph

So, say some guy was a jackhole to us in life. He stole our bike or whatever, but or some reason you're both in heaven. Do you still think he's a d**k? Or is your mind altered to not care? And isn't this a destruction of who you are?

The Bible says that we sould forgive them every time!
So when they get to heaven there will be no anger, no regrets, no pain, and no sickness. All of these things are unholy and only holy and rightous things exsiste in heaven.


I belive that the "retarted person can be healed here on earth, as we can do all things through Christ who gave us strength".
I think this answers your Q  

[White Dog Poo]

They understand things on their own level and May not be able to put out what they know properly. But ask your self this

Do they know that God Loves them for who they are?

Do they know what God did for them?

It comes down to what they them selves know. most times they just cant put it out what they know or make order of it.

also i use to have a friend he just mumbled and seemed like he did not know anything. But if you asked him in sign language what he knew about God. He would say that Jesus died for Him.

and when you die in away i believe your illness and that of this world is Gone.

Hope this helps  

[nightshade213126]

If you read Revelations it says clearly that those who go to heaven are with God in their "Glorified Bodies". These are the bodies and minds that are waiting on us when we get there. As far as meeting the people who may have hurt you here on earth none of that will matter anymore because everything has been reconciled and the only important thing is that we are finally home with our Savior and Father.
Christ said that he was going to prepare a place for us in Heaven. When we get there that's it! Our service on this earth is done. Our reward is final. And personally I can't wait until the day I am reunited with my Savior and Father in Heaven.