What is appropriate behaviour for a Witch?

[Zsa Zsa]

"An Ye Harm None, Do What Ye Will"

The 8 Wiccan Virtues
mirth, reverence, honour, humility, strength, beauty, power and compassion.
Doreen Valiente's Charge of the Goddess

Variation

The 13 Wiccan Virtues
Tolerance, Charity, Humility, Devotion, Patience, Kindliness, Forbearance, Sincerity, Courage, Precision, Efficiency, Discrimination and Wisdom.



EDIT: This thread is also been debating the topics of:

Honesty vs Secrecy
Difference between Secrecy and Privacy
Out of the Broom Closet vs Being in the Broom Closet
Weather Magick: Good or Bad?
Child rearing: In Wicca or not







Original post:

My best friend and I have independently come around to the Wiccan faith and lifestyle, and about a year ago we professed this to each other. It has been nice, in a way, that it is a separate path, we don’t depend on each other, but we can talk about it when we want to. We discuss and consult each other sometimes.

But I question her behaviour sometimes. What I have come to understand is that a witch should never brag about his or her accomplishments, should refrain from practicing magick that interferes with the weather, and never to prostelyze. Yet she seems to do all these things.

She will talk loudly on the bus about the recent spells she has done, and how well they worked, etc.

She constantly asks the Gods to clear up the weather for her, just because she doesn’t want to walk in the rain. And she doesn’t mean it as a joke, because should the weather actually clears up, she takes credit for it. And she talks about her faith unsolicitated constantly with her co-workers and strangers.

I find this inappropriate behaviour, unbecoming to a witch, and, guiltily, I become embarrassed to be associated with her, because I do not wish to be associated with her form of Wicca. Now I know we are taught to be accepting, and that the faith is in many many ways, a path of our own creation, however, I think to ask the Gods to make the weather sunny for frivolous reasons wrong. And against nature, no less. From my understanding, it should only be attempted on a small scale, as in, breaking the storm around your house to protect your home/neighbourhood/family. What if Nature, or a God, or the All needed it to rain? We don’t know what the bigger picture is. Who are we to mess in the affairs of ancient cycles? Frankly, she is too much of a novice to have any real power, but she has too much faith in her limited skills, she naively and overconfidently takes on magick that is well beyond her.

As a general rule, I never talk about my faith in public. It’s my personal business that I don’t wish to share with eavesdroppers. Besides, you never know who is listening, and there is a lot of intolerance in the world. Although my friend may be lulled in a sense of security because of our country and liberal city, open mindedness and general acceptance are the exception and not the rule.

Once I asked her to do a banishing spell for me, because I know it is something I cannot do.
And then a few weeks later she was telling me this story that involved her telling someone else about the spell she did for me. Excuse me? You did what? Is nothing sacred with her? I don’t get it; I don’t understand her lack of boundaries. This is a woman months away from a doctorate in psychology; you’d think she’d know better.

I just don’t know what to do about her. I find some of the things she does downright offensive. My approach to Wicca, and general new age philosophy was been slow and careful. She jumps without looking, which I find dangerous. Because I am not yet practicing witchcraft, and can merely call myself Wiccan and not a Witch, in my own mind. She believes herself to be so much more qualified than I am because of this. She also buys all her tools. Although I don’t have a big problem with that, I prefer to make my own. But that takes time; it needs to feel just right. To her, it appears that I am either A) Not as interested as she is, because I do not have all the tools or B) Not as advanced. She has been trying to take on the role as ‘my mentor’ for some time now. . She attempts to ‘teach’ me things... things I already know, and I am beginning to find her condescension annoying.

I would hate to see the thing that finally breaks us up is the thing that should, by all rights, bring us closer together. I’m not sure how to handle this situation.

So other than a little advice, I am curious as to what all of you think is appropriate behaviour for a witch.

How do you conduct yourselves?

If you have children, and are raising them in the Craft, or some other New Age belief system... what sensibilities would you like to infuse into them. What guildlines? What rules?

The ending of the Wiccan Rede is an excellent way to live your life "If it harms none, do what you will" and a quick saying to reflect on before you do anything... it's like the 10 Commandments and the Golden rule and better rolled into one... but what about more specific ideas and behaviours? I mean, if we were all taught "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you" then let them lose on the world, you would still have malformed children, they need more guidance than just that.  

[dark_angel_32189]

Quote:

This is a woman months away from a doctorate in psychology; you’d think she’d know better.

Up until you said that, I had thought that you were talking about some teenage girl in high school... you know the ones who go around bragging out their 'powers' and telling everyone that they're Wiccan or a Witch just to look cool or to get people to fear them.

Anyway, have you tried talking to her about all of this? Communication is the key to success in just about anything, especially friendships/relationships/whatever.

Quote:

So other than a little advice, I am curious as to what all of you think is appropriate behaviour for a witch.

I must say that I agree with what you described as being the appropriate behavior for a Witch. Actually, I believe that it should be the same behavior for anyone.

Quote:

How do you conduct yourselves?

As far as discussing my faith in public... I only do so when I feel comfortable with it. For instance, I was at work one night and one of my co-workers asked me what my religion was. I told him that if he really wanted to know to ask me outside of work. He sat there and bugged me for half an hour, but I, of course, wouldn't tell him. The people that worked there gossiped too much and a lot of them were really ignorant. Well, one of my friends (who knows I'm Pagan) thought that I wouldn't tell him because I was ashamed of it. rolleyes And that was coming from the girl who hid her conversion to the Muslim traditions from her Christian family until she graduated.

I also expect the people that I do tell to keep it to themselves. I told one of my friends once and he told one of our other friends (I don't remember why). He didn't even ask me if I was okay with him telling other people. And then he couldn't understand why I got so mad about it.

Quote:

If you have children, and are raising them in the Craft, or some other New Age belief system... what sensibilities would you like to infuse into them. What guildlines? What rules?

I honestly wouldn't raise my children in any religion. However, whenever they start asking about religion (I was about 5 when I started asking, so probably somewhere around there) is when I'll start telling about the different religions, what they believe in, etc and buy them lots of books (once they're old enough to read and comprehend them). And then let them choose their religion when they're ready. I just don't think it's right to raise a child in a religion when they have no say in it or don't even understand the concept of it. When I was younger (and Christian) I remember going to church. And I thought it was just time to play with my friends. I didn't think anything else of it. It was just like playtime.

And I would use the basic guidelines and the basic rules that any child should have, but probably only until they're about 16, or whenever they start expressing the need for independance and more freedom. But that's just me...  

[PathlessPlot]

I agree wyou in finding this behavior inappropriate. I am also not a practicing Witch yet, because I want to learn all I can before jumping into the something before I know all the reprecussions of my actions. I will mention the fact of my faith if it comes up and I feel that I must express myself, or if a friend of mine is curious, but I try not to be bold and pushy with it. So as not to offend anyone who might be a zealot. I don't need that kind of trouble you know what I mean? Anyway, I do have a 7 month old son, and I have decided to not hide it from him, but not to push him into it. I came into this path on my own after spending years feeling like a hypocrite in church. So I will let him decide for himself. If he wants to follow this path I will be more than glad to help him on his way, but he is going to decide for himself whether I want him to or not. This is my opinion.  

[Funa Spectrum]

If you can't explain your reasons and concerns to her, then wait. Most go through the phase of "I'm majik and special!" I went through it (though I assume, as you mention co-workers and doctorates, this case is a little later than the usual teenage fluff stage). Perhaps subtly put intelligent books or websites her way. Be hopeful. Ignore anything she says that insults you. razz

Conduct for a witch is just conduct for a human. I do intend to have a child, and I intend to raise her with respect - for humanity, for nature. If everything goes to plan and she's being raised by three witches, then she'll inevitably be exposed to the craft. Though it may be a little odd when her classmates are talking about Jesus and Sunday school and she's talking about circles, the moon and herbs...

...

I admit I'm guilty of playing with the weather, but is the wording "Please can the rain wait if it's possible?" that bad?  

[Zsa Zsa]

I don't see a problem in asking for good weather sometimes! LOL! But to practically command Apollo to bring out the sun? I'm trying to just change my attitude towards the weather rather than change the weather itself. I now find just as much beauty in a downpour as a sunny beach day. The one thing I have to work on it snow... that is a long ingrained and seemingly mutual hatred. xd

I feel as though I should tell her some things. However I know this would be a mistake. She already sees herself as more advanced, merely because she is vocal about it, where as I am not. If I attempted to tell her something.... it just wouldn’t work out well

I just find it odd how we approached the same subject so differently. I want my spirituality to be the everyday sort, always in the back of my mind as I conduct myself in the mundane world. However, I also want to have the awe, the overwhelming epiphany-like that can only happen with humility, reverence, and a gentle self-controlled approach. Some things need to remain separate most of the time, so it is sacred when you enter it. I mean this on both a small and grand scale. I want my beginners approach to my new religion to be a change in myself. To approach it differently than how I approached other things in my life in the past. But my friend doesn’t have the same idea, and she is doing this the same way she approaches a new relationship, a new job, and new school course, a new car, a new dress she bought. I mean enthusiasm is a good thing, but... I hate to say it; I doubt her actual dedication and genuine reverence.

I find her new found connection with nature wonderful... but when she starts to lord it over me as if I don’t yet have the same connection.... I grew up on a farm. I also grew up with my Norwegian grandmother with all her various superstitious and ritualistic ‘giving back to nature’ things. I’m not saying I’m better, I’m just saying that isn’t it obvious where I stand?

I don’t know what to do with her. The only thing I think I can do is made a parchment gift for her BoS about the Wiccan virtues, and even more subtle put, work them into something, like a poem, or something. But I’m not good at that sort of thing. Does anyone have any good psalm-like writings about Witchy behaviour? Then maybe I can work my unpleasant feelings into something more positive. I guess I could always share some links to things, or lend her a book, with certain pages bookmarked.

I don’t know what I would do if I had children myself. I can’t just say “I won’t raise them as____ and let them pick their own path when they are older” Kids want to do what their parents do when they are young, they want that connection. And since Wicca becomes such a huge part of your life, how can one say they wouldn’t raise their children with those values? It can be hard to separate the ritual, the ideology, and the values. I’d totally raise them as New Agers if not definitely Wiccan. I want them to have the cyclical understanding of the world, because wrapping your mind around that when you are practically brain washed with the linear thinking is hard. Also, with an unbiased understanding that New Age offers, they can approach any religion with an open mind and heart. But I want to give my children the festivals, the holidays, the security of a God and Goddess who watch over them, so I think I would raise them as in the Wiccan religion with the option to become Wiccan when they are old enough to understand dedication. Sort of like confirmation in Christianity, but they would be older than 8 years old. Like Dark Angel said, 16 is a good general age.

 

[PathlessPlot]

Well to teach my son the basics yes, such as to respect all that is around him and not to harm others, golden rule, yada yada yada. But I will not force him to do rituals with me if he doesn't want to. He would learn about all religions so that he can make an informed decision about how he wants to conduct himself and what he wants to believe in. If he were to go off the right general path into the wrong ways of life (and I am not talking about religion, I mean generally) I will help to steer him back the right way. but I detest forcing anyone to believe in something that they just don't believe in.  

[Zsa Zsa]

Well you can't force someone one to believe in something they can't believe in, that's why we all ended up here. Besides our children are not ours, they are just on loan to us for a while. I would want my children to know their options, but at the youngest of ages, they don't really understand, so it would just be a general thing that they would be 'mini-wiccans' as it were. whee  

[Leavaros]

I'll never have children. Ever. But I think it's only fair and just to teach children human decency, compassion, and respect, not only for each other, but also for the greater world at large.

Umm.... On the subject of weather, I must admit meddling. Of course, I'm not commanding gods or men, just...inclining the weather my way. It doesn't always work, but it's a good four out of five bit. I don't agree at all with the thought that "who are we to...." and "grand plans...." etcetera, etcetera. What if I was meant to die when I had complications before birth? Who were the doctors to perform a Caesarian on my mother? We can only do as best we can. So what if I call the rain? Tampa's in a drought. Of course, frivolous reasons for anything aren't good reasons, and often cause more ill than intended harm does.

And on how a witch should conduct oneself, you need look no farther than Miss Manners. Arrogance and condescension (often my own flaws) are always unbecoming. To a witch or not. I'm fairly certain Apollo would agree.

Love and Vale,
-LD  

[Zsa Zsa]

Leavaros

I don't agree at all with the thought that "who are we to...." and "grand plans...." etcetera, etcetera. What if I was meant to die when I had complications before birth? Who were the doctors to perform a Caesarian on my mother? We can only do as best we can. So what if I call the rain? Tampa's in a drought. Of course, frivolous reasons for anything aren't good reasons, and often cause more ill than intended harm does.

But that is exactly what I mean when I talk about the grander scheme. I'm not saying that we shouldn't interfere whatsoever with life, we are the ones in control of our fate ultimately... If you are having a terrible snow storm, is it really so bad to join together and with your collective energy deflect the destruction of the storm? No. Just like rain dances, it can be a good thing. At the same time isn't demanding nice weather all the time just because you don't want to get wet similar to polluting? They both ruin weather patterns. Sometimes nature has a plan, and sometimes it is arrogant for humans to get involved. I, for example, live in a rain forest. To constantly pray, ask, demand for sunny weather would be detrimental to the ecosystem of the BC rainforest. And for what? Dry hair? To spend your energy trying to change the weather, when it's going to do bad things rather than good, is in violation of what the Wiccan Rede tells us.  

[Will 2 Power]

My advice is small and quiet, you should ask her why she doesn't feel special. She should, she's a living breathing human being: That's more then most things in reality will ever be.  

[dark_angel_32189]

Helios Apollos

she's a living breathing human being: That's more then most things in reality will ever be.

I'm failing to see how "that's more then most things in reality will ever be". There's billions of living breathing human beings... I'm pretty sure that would fall under the "most things in reality" category. Unless of course you don't think they really exist in reality and that we just imagine them in our heads.  

[Zsa Zsa]

Helios is probably right, though, I think it is a matter of self esteem. She overcompensates sometimes, I believe. She can be a difficult person to get along with, which is unfortunate, because she is really a lot of fun. She drives a lot of people away because of her obnoxious side, but I've stuck by her for 20 years, I've sort of just grown immunity to her abrasive side. I think the reason this stuff bothers me so much this time is because now it is personal, it's actually something we have in common.

I think I'm just going to leave her alone, and lead by example, because I can't change her, she has to want to change herself. I guess the only thing I can do is discuss responsible witchy behaviour in a non accusatory way, just as a general thing. Maybe something will rub off.

I think the only thing I will directly talk to her about is the telling other people about things we do for each other. Since we are "priestesses" in our own right, we should have the same responsiblities that are entrusted to clergymen of other religions. If someone tells you something within the circle it should go no further.  

[Leavaros]

Well, I'm not sure about that. I don't think any boon should be kept secret. Not boasted, certainly, but not kept secret. Though I'm glad we're settled on the weather issue. I...get riled up about the whole, "greater scheme" stuff.

Gosh, who knew talking about the weather could be so intense?
-LD  

[Zsa Zsa]

Leavaros

Well, I'm not sure about that. I don't think any boon should be kept secret. Not boasted, certainly, but not kept secret.
-LD

I don't agree. That was between me and her. I asked her to do something that was private, and then she blabs it, not only boastfully, but to people I don't even know. That wasn't fair to me, and she didn't even seem to think there was something wrong with that. Like I said, she is on the cusp of becoming a psychologist, she should learn to keep her trap shut. She is being entrusted with the private affairs of other people, it is not her right to share information without first asking permission.  

[Leavaros]

I guess I can see where you are coming from. But...are you ashamed of it? I mean...if you are, don't you think it was unwise to ask that of her in the first place? And for that matter, it sounds like you've known this woman for quite a while. Did you consider that she might not be the best choice for "quiet help"?
-LD