Bots on the Marketplace? A Rampant Problem Still Neglected. | Page 3 | Forum

Whip

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Post: 91368139_32 created on Mon, 07 Apr 2014 08:08:11 +0000
Posted: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 08:08:11 +0000

Gash Thrashum

Aye, I was thinking every 20-50 buys? That'd catch out a bot without doing too much damage.

I am sure there are always workarounds to that too, which is why it isn't ideal, so I am certainly in favour of a way to report that places it in a specific queue for that, rather than a message in a mod's inbox.

(Also, your avatar is amazing, as always.)

Prism Rose

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Post: 91368139_34 created on Mon, 07 Apr 2014 08:41:32 +0000
Posted: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 08:41:32 +0000

VVhip

Prism Rose

If anyone felt it necessary to report someone for botting they can just report a post, their profile, they could use the Abuse and Harassment report... The options are already there as long as you are clear about what you are reporting. Having a report on the MP to report "bots" would get most vendors that snipe stuff reported.

(I bold for emphasis, not for yelling ^_^)

Reporting a marketplace bot, and labeling it abuse or harassment isn't a great way to go about it though. It's neither abuse nor harassment, and may get lost in the system being mislabeled. Which is what people like the OP are saying is happening already. If we can have report systems for other things we could have what the OP asks for. We could report it under the "other" option, but it'd be better if it flagged for what they actually are being reported for instead of a generic catch-all, yes?

Perhaps having warnings and punishment for purposely false reports would be appropriate? It would need to be founded in fact and finding ways to do that would be tricky. You raise a good point about report abuse. Many quick buyers would be reported erroneously, but that's what happens already with all report systems, and it's no reason not to implement a new, specific one. People are only punished if proven guilty here, and investigation would prove their innocence.

I do believe our report system does account for and does not punish those who report in good faith if they believe a person to be breaking the rules and it is found that they are not. You raise another good point, it would be a lot harder for the average user to tell the difference between a bot and someone who is quick at buying.

Education of the community would be necessary, and it would rely on everyone understanding the difference before reporting. But false reporting and accidental mis-reporting is unavoidable and is no reason not to implement a report feature.

If there is anything that should have been learned from previous events- you can't call someone a bot just because they are quick. A straight-up botting report would be a bit over the top and would garner more useless reports on snipers than what it would for stuff that actually matters. That's also not a false report. They just need to go somewhere different to have their issue resolved, but it wouldn't include said reported person being a bot, so... Yeah. Useless.

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Post: 91368139_36 created on Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:42:17 +0000
Posted: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:42:17 +0000

Prism Rose

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Myrielle

I hope that report generates some sort of activity transcript like how reporting in virtual worlds generates a chat transcript so moderators can review the words that were exchanged. But, would the mods know what they will be looking at? I was think developers would know like how swarf or Uncle Kenny caught a zOMG bot by noting their continuous activity for more than 36 hours. I am not sure of the extent of the moderator's tools if they can do the same.

It would be similar to the hacking/scamming reports where you can provide as much evidence as you have, like screenshots.
I think it would speed the process up, and the mods just have to look at the users store log and how long they have been online.

I am sure they can also check exactly how many refreshes a user has made, based on the incident that happened with Rainy. 3nodding

It sounds like the only reason why people are upset is because he is a little faster than a few other vendors. People fighting over "deals" or something like that when it's exploiting the system "legally" by nature.

Yeah, sounds familiar. This thing with "Rainy" is why they probably may not care to bother.

If anyone felt it necessary to report someone for botting they can just report a post, their profile, they could use the Abuse and Harassment report... The options are already there as long as you are clear about what you are reporting. Having a report on the MP to report "bots" would get most vendors that snipe stuff reported.

@ emboldened: This is my thinking. If the Staff were to look into it and saw that they bought the generator and got gold and see that he was using said gold to buy up stuff...
There are a few people doing that right now and have been and is more likely why the Staff has not done anything. Because a person can do it legitimately. Fast computer and fast internet helps a lot (as long as you dont have interference on your line or from provider)
There was the same argument on the other site I frequent daily at one time. A lot of it for months. No one got banned there either.
But AI-ing is against the rules. But then, I think that is why Gaia is re-releasing items in the first place. To make it harder.
Actually, if gaia stops selling the gold generators and people were made to go back to earning their gold as before...

Prism Rose

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Post: 91368139_38 created on Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:54:20 +0000
Posted: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:54:20 +0000

lost in the rhythm

Prism Rose

VVhip

Prism Rose

If anyone felt it necessary to report someone for botting they can just report a post, their profile, they could use the Abuse and Harassment report... The options are already there as long as you are clear about what you are reporting. Having a report on the MP to report "bots" would get most vendors that snipe stuff reported.

(I bold for emphasis, not for yelling ^_^)

Reporting a marketplace bot, and labeling it abuse or harassment isn't a great way to go about it though. It's neither abuse nor harassment, and may get lost in the system being mislabeled. Which is what people like the OP are saying is happening already. If we can have report systems for other things we could have what the OP asks for. We could report it under the "other" option, but it'd be better if it flagged for what they actually are being reported for instead of a generic catch-all, yes?

Perhaps having warnings and punishment for purposely false reports would be appropriate? It would need to be founded in fact and finding ways to do that would be tricky. You raise a good point about report abuse. Many quick buyers would be reported erroneously, but that's what happens already with all report systems, and it's no reason not to implement a new, specific one. People are only punished if proven guilty here, and investigation would prove their innocence.

I do believe our report system does account for and does not punish those who report in good faith if they believe a person to be breaking the rules and it is found that they are not. You raise another good point, it would be a lot harder for the average user to tell the difference between a bot and someone who is quick at buying.

Education of the community would be necessary, and it would rely on everyone understanding the difference before reporting. But false reporting and accidental mis-reporting is unavoidable and is no reason not to implement a report feature.

If there is anything that should have been learned from previous events- you can't call someone a bot just because they are quick. A straight-up botting report would be a bit over the top and would garner more useless reports on snipers than what it would for stuff that actually matters. That's also not a false report. They just need to go somewhere different to have their issue resolved, but it wouldn't include said reported person being a bot, so... Yeah. Useless.

Yes, because it's completely normal to be logged in for 6 days in a row to buy only mispriced items in the marketplace. rolleyes

If you click "Remember Me" it doesn't change your log-in date... sweatdrop

lost in the rhythm

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Post: 91368139_40 created on Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:55:38 +0000
Posted: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:55:38 +0000

Prism Rose

lost in the rhythm

Prism Rose

VVhip

Prism Rose

If anyone felt it necessary to report someone for botting they can just report a post, their profile, they could use the Abuse and Harassment report... The options are already there as long as you are clear about what you are reporting. Having a report on the MP to report "bots" would get most vendors that snipe stuff reported.

(I bold for emphasis, not for yelling ^_^)

Reporting a marketplace bot, and labeling it abuse or harassment isn't a great way to go about it though. It's neither abuse nor harassment, and may get lost in the system being mislabeled. Which is what people like the OP are saying is happening already. If we can have report systems for other things we could have what the OP asks for. We could report it under the "other" option, but it'd be better if it flagged for what they actually are being reported for instead of a generic catch-all, yes?

Perhaps having warnings and punishment for purposely false reports would be appropriate? It would need to be founded in fact and finding ways to do that would be tricky. You raise a good point about report abuse. Many quick buyers would be reported erroneously, but that's what happens already with all report systems, and it's no reason not to implement a new, specific one. People are only punished if proven guilty here, and investigation would prove their innocence.

I do believe our report system does account for and does not punish those who report in good faith if they believe a person to be breaking the rules and it is found that they are not. You raise another good point, it would be a lot harder for the average user to tell the difference between a bot and someone who is quick at buying.

Education of the community would be necessary, and it would rely on everyone understanding the difference before reporting. But false reporting and accidental mis-reporting is unavoidable and is no reason not to implement a report feature.

If there is anything that should have been learned from previous events- you can't call someone a bot just because they are quick. A straight-up botting report would be a bit over the top and would garner more useless reports on snipers than what it would for stuff that actually matters. That's also not a false report. They just need to go somewhere different to have their issue resolved, but it wouldn't include said reported person being a bot, so... Yeah. Useless.

Yes, because it's completely normal to be logged in for 6 days in a row to buy only mispriced items in the marketplace. rolleyes

If you click "Remember Me" it doesn't change your log-in date... sweatdrop

That's odd because I have always used the "Remember Me" option and my log-in date always changes. confused

Gash Thrashum

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Post: 91368139_43 created on Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:59:34 +0000
Posted: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 09:59:34 +0000

VVhip

Gash Thrashum

Aye, I was thinking every 20-50 buys? That'd catch out a bot without doing too much damage.

I am sure there are always workarounds to that too, which is why it isn't ideal, so I am certainly in favour of a way to report that places it in a specific queue for that, rather than a message in a mod's inbox.

(Also, your avatar is amazing, as always.)

Then that's 20-50 botted misprices before a captcha. gonk
I'm starting to think simply having it moderated and taken care of more quickly would be the best option. The captcha idea might work if it's after a low enough number of vends, but if the user is still active on Gaia while running the bot, they simply have to input the captcha manually every once in a while to bypass it and get the next 'x' amount of botted vends before doing it again.

And thank you, I appreciate it. :]

Xx Alenia xX

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Post: 91368139_45 created on Mon, 07 Apr 2014 10:03:43 +0000
Posted: Mon, 07 Apr 2014 10:03:43 +0000

I do hope this issue gets resolved soon as alot of vendors and questors are losing out on gaining the specific item/s that this bot is buying up, I do agree that if we have specific forms to use when reporting someone then having one specifically for bots and/or AIers is a good idea!
Nearly all Admins and Mods are always inundated with private messages and some may go unread and be lost in their inboxes so this little form will help alot to get attention to the issue!

Welcome to Gaia! ::

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