Video Games, Hyper Masculinity, and the Military

[73Zombie]

It's not a coincidence that the gaming market is made up of men targeting men and boys of all ages and backgrounds. Video games, particularly in american culture, is a part of the male socialization process of turning boys into macho competitors and help facilitate gender roles and expectations. The absence of women and girls from these games and marketing strategies is also highly reflective of this socialization scheme, and calls into question the real purpose of video games. From madden to call of duty,and tons of other games that employ sports/military combat/warfare, violence is always a given, and is then normalized as boys just being boys.

I'm curious about other people's thoughts on the connection between video games and the role/functions of the military in sustaining and facilitating hyper masculinity.

(this is not for a project, I swear. I was a sociology student for too long is all )

[K i n g X u m o t - XVI]

There are also a lot of video games that portray women as strong leaders and even in the video games that are focused on a male protagonist a female character is always there to support him.

This is a big speculation- saying that video games resort to violence for there has been no actual evidence but rather just correlations.
While you state war games and first person shooters there are plenty of fantasy games that have strong female characters where the males support them and show them their weaknesses.

I do not believe video games cause violence nor have any impact on the patriarchal view.

[73Zombie]

K i n g X u m o t - XVI

There are also a lot of video games that portray women as strong leaders and even in the video games that are focused on a male protagonist a female character is always there to support him.

This is a big speculation- saying that video games resort to violence for there has been no actual evidence but rather just correlations.
While you state war games and first person shooters there are plenty of fantasy games that have strong female characters where the males support them and show them their weaknesses.

I do not believe video games cause violence nor have any impact on the patriarchal view.

Yes this is true, but in these fantasy games women are also overly objectified and made for the male consumption. Fantasy games are imbued with the narrative of saving something or someone, which happens to be a woman/princess. Even the plot of saving the kingdom/nation is heavily linked to this trope of defending the nation/saving the land, which is also a gendered concept. The majority of video games, even the ones that I can think of at the top of my head, are mostly male protagonist and while there may be a female character who also take up important roles, she is mostly regulated as the subordinated hero. Can we name at least 10 titles that feature mainly positive female protagonist that is geared toward male and female consumers? This doesn't reflect full autonomy, and if one were to observe the society that we live in and the institutions (media, government, hospitals, family, etc.), there are undeniable reproductions of social hierarchies that can't just be brushed off as speculations or correlations.

Violence in this society is highly evident. Violence against women in particular, from domestic violence to rape/ sexual assault on college campus, to sexual harassment on the streets, to rape an sexual abuse in the military. One cannot help but to think that when boys and men are on these consoles playing video games, how the heightened violence and aggression facilitates these attitudes that mark woman as targets, in the same ways that violence and aggression is needed to mark the enemy in warfare. The new grand theft auto game comes to mind, as the main character (male) has the option of sleeping with sex workers and killing them afterwards to get his money back. There have been studies around masculinity and militarism where generals would show their soldiers porn to increase aggression.

This reveals that violence against women is intrinsically tied to male aggression (ie. hyper masculinity) and is a condition that goes hand in hand with being the citizen soldier who must defend the nation. Violence is a valid tool that is encouraged and men and boys are the perfect vessels that the state (government, military, police force) employs to fight their wars, and in return offer privileges that result in the sexual conquest and exploitation of women domestically and internationally.

[K i n g X u m o t - XVI]

73Zombie

Yes this is true, but in these fantasy games women are also overly objectified and made for the male consumption.

That's like saying a woman who dresses provocatively deserves rape.
If you view a woman as a sexual object then that is your subjective view, not the game's fault.

73Zombie

Can we name at least 10 titles that feature mainly positive female protagonist that is geared toward male and female consumers?

As I said, it depends on those that view the said material and how they perceive it.
All I can say is think of the Final Fantasy series (especially FF XIII)

73Zombie

Violence in this society is highly evident. Violence against women in particular, from domestic violence to rape/ sexual assault on college campus, to sexual harassment on the streets, to rape an sexual abuse in the military. One cannot help but to think that when boys and men are on these consoles playing video games, how the heightened violence and aggression facilitates these attitudes that mark woman as targets, in the same ways that violence and aggression is needed to mark the enemy in warfare.

Violence against woman has always existed, even back in the day where the victors of war took the losing town's citizens as slaves, including the woman. This was a lot more resourceful than just killing them, which is what they used to do (and this was before video games so can't blame that).

73Zombie

The new grand theft auto game comes to mind, as the main character (male) has the option of sleeping with sex workers and killing them afterwards to get his money back. There have been studies around masculinity and militarism where generals would show their soldiers porn to increase aggression.

I think this has more to do with your family's culture and where you were raised and not video games.
If you live in a household where you have siblings in gangs and your parents are uneducated or work in the field there is little to no authoritative figure.
No rewards, no punishment.

73Zombie

This reveals that violence against women is intrinsically tied to male aggression (ie. hyper masculinity) and is a condition that goes hand in hand with being the citizen soldier who must defend the nation. Violence is a valid tool that is encouraged and men and boys are the perfect vessels that the state

It's been proven that males are far more aggressive than females and have been but this doesn't have any proof regarding video games leading to males abusing woman.
If anything, it's culture that leaves the options available, instead of the options making the culture.

[very charming mule]

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73Zombie

The absence of women and girls from these games and marketing strategies [...]



First of all, clarification needed: I'm with you partially so far as "marketing strategies" are concerned (in that there are games which actively use the male gaze as a marketing target), but are you talking about the absence of women from the games themselves, from the development side, or from the community built around the game (i.e. players/fans/etc)?

Because the majority of women we see in the games themselves are strategically configured to suit the (stereotypical) male gaze, there are women in gaming development (the most recent Halo entry was helmed by a woman), and there are women in the gaming community -- the lattermost are just sick and tired of the immediate and ridiculous accusations that they're "fake geek girls" or that their skill is not their own, the outcry for sandwiches, the rape and death threats over microphones (yes, really; yes, I've experienced this) and the assumption that if you are any good you must not be desirable and that should be all that they care about, and they don't broadcast their presence to avoid it. The hypermasculine environment that's been built around gaming has allowed for all of these things to become an accepted norm, and the women are sick of it. We just want to enjoy ourselves, not steel ourselves to run a gauntlet of profane, shaming bullshit every time we go to take part in a hobby that we love.

Also, I'm not sure how you quantify marketing directed to women. Should there be a pink Lancer on every Gears of War cover, according to you?



K i n g X u m o t - XVI

That's like saying a woman who dresses provocatively deserves rape.



No it isn't. It's like saying "if you continue to tell men that this is the way women should be represented, they'll start to believe that's normal." It's called conditioning. It's a real thing.



K i n g X u m o t - XVI

If you view a woman as a sexual object then that is your subjective view, not the game's fault.




Wrong. You are conditioned to that response by something, and consumption of media which dictates that female figures are to satisfy the (again, stereotypical) male gaze is one of those things. Try again, and this time don't make unsavory comparisons which have to do with rape or assault of a real person, please.

[Jessi Danger]

K i n g X u m o t - XVI

There are also a lot of video games that portray women as strong leaders and even in the video games that are focused on a male protagonist a female character is always there to support him.

This is a big speculation- saying that video games resort to violence for there has been no actual evidence but rather just correlations.
While you state war games and first person shooters there are plenty of fantasy games that have strong female characters where the males support them and show them their weaknesses.

I do not believe video games cause violence nor have any impact on the patriarchal view.

In the new Zelda, A link between worlds this is true to spectacular effect. Princess Hilda turns out to have clever machinations all her own.

[K i n g X u m o t - XVI]

yankee soul

No it isn't. It's like saying "if you continue to tell men that this is the way women should be represented, they'll start to believe that's normal." It's called conditioning. It's a real thing.

In order to be conditioned one has to have a "blank" slate- so to speak.
You think men that are already into this type of game don't have this type of behaviour?

[very charming mule]

»»»


K i n g X u m o t - XVI

You think men that are already into this type of game don't have this type of behaviour?




You think that men who are into that kind of female representation in games didn't start out as boys and teenagers who were exposed to that kind of representation as the status quo? You think that men who are into that kind of female representation in games didn't normalize that type of representation because no other men said it was misogynistic and wrong?

[K i n g X u m o t - XVI]

yankee soul

Nothing wrong with thought it's only wrong when you act upon it and you can't say all do.

[very charming mule]

»»»


K i n g X u m o t - XVI

Nothing wrong with thought it's only wrong when you act upon it and you can't say all do.



Wrong. The second you say it's okay for someone to, say, have lascivious and offensive thoughts about my 14-year-old sister just because he's not actually committing those acts, you lose any horse in this race in my eyes.

You need to take a good hard look at your logic, there, buddy.

[Triratna]

It kills our time, definitely.

[Skyburn]

73Zombie

It's not a coincidence that the gaming market is made up of men targeting men and boys of all ages and backgrounds. Video games, particularly in american culture, is a part of the male socialization process of turning boys into macho competitors and help facilitate gender roles and expectations. The absence of women and girls from these games and marketing strategies is also highly reflective of this socialization scheme, and calls into question the real purpose of video games. From madden to call of duty,and tons of other games that employ sports/military combat/warfare, violence is always a given, and is then normalized as boys just being boys.

I'm curious about other people's thoughts on the connection between video games and the role/functions of the military in sustaining and facilitating hyper masculinity.

(this is not for a project, I swear. I was a sociology student for too long is all )

This post appears to presume that men and women, should they be exposed to precisely the same outside stimulation would fall into precisely the same categories. This isn't so. As I'm sure you're aware, men and women are "wired" differently, through and through. Men are more prone to feats of violence - or, rather, hunting. Men build muscle more easily through the same workouts, lose weight more easily through the same diet plans, and stereotypically prefer more violent entertainment far more than women do.

The biggest reason why you don't see more women in the military is because many simply aren't cut out for it. It seems silly and perhaps even sexist, until you actually look at the facts. Out of many women in the military as it is, many struggled in the beginning to even do a single push-up, whereas even many of the weakest male applicants could at least do what is considered bare minimum for women, and most could at least do the bare minimum for men. Women already have lower physical fitness standards, and of those jobs which are more technical in the military, many require an understanding of physics, which is the only area of education where men and women differ so significantly there is no argument to who excels more in the field - men, (whereas women differ noticeably in most other fields of education, but not as significantly as men do in physics.)

Simply put, Call of Duty and video games aren't some government conspiracy. They're there because they sell. Capitalism v. Communism. One sells a product because it will be bought. The other sells a product to influence someone. The "Video Game Race" going on right now with first person shooters and other violent games is entirely based around what the consumer wants - what sells better.
Women aren't in the games as much because women simply don't fit into the typical First-Person-Shooter demographic. If there were a sudden surge of women buying Call of Duty, you'd be certain to see more female characters in the following series.

Nevertheless, some series do include female characters; while many are not first-person shooters, many are still violence or action-based; Resident Evil, Metroid, Halo, etc. This is actually on the rise, which may simply be because video games themselves are.

yankee soul

Wrong. You are conditioned to that response by something, and consumption of media which dictates that female figures are to satisfy the (again, stereotypical) male gaze is one of those things. Try again, and this time don't make unsavory comparisons which have to do with rape or assault of a real person, please.

And men have to satisfy the stereotypical female gaze. Just as women have body figure "requirements" set forth by society, so do men. Usually involving the entirely impractical six-pack abs.

As well, the human brain, powerful as it is, is perfectly capable of self-conditioning. All it requires is a bit of critical thought.

[Triratna]

if you want to see the greatest game made exclusively for girls. it‘s every series created by big fish games.

You won‘t find sense of hyper masculinity in their game and still enjoyable.

[Adonais is Dead]

Skyburn

73Zombie

It's not a coincidence that the gaming market is made up of men targeting men and boys of all ages and backgrounds. Video games, particularly in american culture, is a part of the male socialization process of turning boys into macho competitors and help facilitate gender roles and expectations. The absence of women and girls from these games and marketing strategies is also highly reflective of this socialization scheme, and calls into question the real purpose of video games. From madden to call of duty,and tons of other games that employ sports/military combat/warfare, violence is always a given, and is then normalized as boys just being boys.

I'm curious about other people's thoughts on the connection between video games and the role/functions of the military in sustaining and facilitating hyper masculinity.

(this is not for a project, I swear. I was a sociology student for too long is all )

This post appears to presume that men and women, should they be exposed to precisely the same outside stimulation would fall into precisely the same categories. This isn't so. As I'm sure you're aware, men and women are "wired" differently, through and through. Men are more prone to feats of violence - or, rather, hunting. Men build muscle more easily through the same workouts, lose weight more easily through the same diet plans, and stereotypically prefer more violent entertainment far more than women do.

The biggest reason why you don't see more women in the military is because many simply aren't cut out for it. It seems silly and perhaps even sexist, until you actually look at the facts. Out of many women in the military as it is, many struggled in the beginning to even do a single push-up, whereas even many of the weakest male applicants could at least do what is considered bare minimum for women, and most could at least do the bare minimum for men. Women already have lower physical fitness standards, and of those jobs which are more technical in the military, many require an understanding of physics, which is the only area of education where men and women differ so significantly there is no argument to who excels more in the field - men, (whereas women differ noticeably in most other fields of education, but not as significantly as men do in physics.)

Simply put, Call of Duty and video games aren't some government conspiracy. They're there because they sell. Capitalism v. Communism. One sells a product because it will be bought. The other sells a product to influence someone. The "Video Game Race" going on right now with first person shooters and other violent games is entirely based around what the consumer wants - what sells better.
Women aren't in the games as much because women simply don't fit into the typical First-Person-Shooter demographic. If there were a sudden surge of women buying Call of Duty, you'd be certain to see more female characters in the following series.

Nevertheless, some series do include female characters; while many are not first-person shooters, many are still violence or action-based; Resident Evil, Metroid, Halo, etc. This is actually on the rise, which may simply be because video games themselves are.

yankee soul

Wrong. You are conditioned to that response by something, and consumption of media which dictates that female figures are to satisfy the (again, stereotypical) male gaze is one of those things. Try again, and this time don't make unsavory comparisons which have to do with rape or assault of a real person, please.

And men have to satisfy the stereotypical female gaze. Just as women have body figure "requirements" set forth by society, so do men. Usually involving the entirely impractical six-pack abs.

As well, the human brain, powerful as it is, is perfectly capable of self-conditioning. All it requires is a bit of critical thought.

While I commend your back to the basics attitude, you're undermining how seriously socialization factors into gender identity. It's cliché, but we are really social beings; I would throw out a guess that if it were more acceptable for women to enjoy violence, and if more young girls were indoctrinated into glorifying battle valor as you and I may have been, I would not doubt that there would be a rise in those Military women you mentioned. That said, it goes without saying that they are some very real differences between men and women, both biological and social, that are playing their roles. I am only arguing that these are more in flux than we imagine.

I'll introduce also that I'm a happy and very real female who loves first person shooters, warfare, and especially sword-fighting, and I don't consider myself especially masculine or special in any way. I think that many more unexceptional women could hone in on this part of themselves if there were the social space available for them just as it was for me.

That said, the marketing part of your address was spot on, and I have also noticed an increase in female-friendly games as more women are joining the consumer body.

[Skyburn]

Adonais is Dead

While I commend your back to the basics attitude, you're undermining how seriously socialization factors into gender identity. It's cliché, but we are really social beings; I would throw out a guess that if it were more acceptable for women to enjoy violence, and if more young girls were indoctrinated into glorifying battle valor as you and I may have been, I would not doubt that there would be a rise in those Military women you mentioned. That said, it goes without saying that they are some very real differences between men and women, both biological and social, that are playing their roles. I am only arguing that these are more in flux than we imagine.

I'll introduce also that I'm a happy and very real female who loves first person shooters, warfare, and especially sword-fighting, and I don't consider myself especially masculine or special in any way. I think that many more unexceptional women could hone in on this part of themselves if there were the social space available for them just as it was for me.

That said, the marketing part of your address was spot on, and I have also noticed an increase in female-friendly games as more women are joining the consumer body.

Which came first, the chicken or the egg?
In this case, I'm going for both. General male testosterone means that men are going to be more prone to feats of competition, hunting, et cetera. We like violence and whatnot.
Not all are going to like video games. Some of the guys I serve with (in the military, no less), would rather spend quality time with their family to the point most would consider it excessive - even for the military - and haven't touched a video game in over a decade, whereas I've loved violent video games since I could hold the controller (one of my earliest memories is of Duck Hunt at the age of 3 or 4) often in spite of my parent's disapproval (more wanting me to get outside and whatnot).

It's really hard to pin down when kids are "indoctrinated," vice just being exposed to things they've already shown interest in. Not saying all kids don't have it pushed on them, but a lot done and still turn out that way. I'd hardly say I was indoctrinated for violent video games; rather, I'd say my parents more pushed me to being creative and constructive, which I took to rather well and still very much enjoy to this day.