The v****a Monologues Question

[Prince Aegon Targaryen VI]

So quite recently I was reading about how The v****a Monologues, which I admit, I am not super familiar with, involes some story called ""The Little Coochie Snorcher that Could"

The Impression I am given is that it involved the date-rape of a teenage girl who later concludes that "If it was rape, it was good rape."

So if there is anyone out their familiar with the play, can I ask... Is there... Some context I'm missing? The impression I've always had of the v****a Monologues is a relatively good one... I mean, a lot of my really intelligent feminist associates are big on it...

Is there something I'm missing that makes the statement "If it was rape, it was good rape." any less horrible?

[GSK Lives]

It only proves how ******** idiotic current wave feminists are.

[lambs and lions]

In the original version the girl is 13, I think they have since increased her age. Basically it is okay for a woman to get a minor drunk and have sex with them as this is "good rape." "Bad rape" is rape that involves a man. These are the double standards feminist live off of.

[Jrock_Chlck]

It sounds like a work of satire.

[Chahklet]

That sounds sickening. I don't understand why people are so easily influenced just cause someone wrote some words down.

[Jrock_Chlck]

This thread sparked my curiosity, so I looked up the script. They removed the famous "if it was rape, it was a good rape".
This is just... I understand that being comfortable in your body and understanding that sexual organs are nothing to be ashamed of, but anyway you look at it, this is a minor being taken advantage of by an adult, even if said minor is willing.

[SylverStar]

It's been a while since I read and seen the play. However my understanding were these were how the individual women felt and thought. That saying makes me think more about someone who has been abused/raped that they are justifying and minimizing that particular experience.

Trying to make sense of an experience and make it less painful is something that happens to people who have experienced trauma.

[The20]

Chahklet

That sounds sickening. I don't understand why people are so easily influenced just cause someone wrote some words down.

If i had to guess i'd say they're unable to think for themselves and look for a person that they can use as some sort of authority figure.

[Chahklet]

SylverStar

It's been a while since I read and seen the play. However my understanding were these were how the individual women felt and thought. That saying makes me think more about someone who has been abused/raped that they are justifying and minimizing that particular experience.

Trying to make sense of an experience and make it less painful is something that happens to people who have experienced trauma.

Like Stockholm?

[Chahklet]

The20

Chahklet

That sounds sickening. I don't understand why people are so easily influenced just cause someone wrote some words down.

If i had to guess i'd say they're unable to think for themselves and look for a person that they can use as some sort of authority figure.

That's depressing. I like debating because I learn both sides of an issue and can shape my views according to myself. I think trying to shape yourself to someone else's views is a very bad idea.

[Riviera de la Mancha]

Lambs and Lions

In the original version the girl is 13, I think they have since increased her age. Basically it is okay for a woman to get a minor drunk and have sex with them as this is "good rape." "Bad rape" is rape that involves a man. These are the double standards feminist live off of.

You clearly didn't watch the play then.

The full context of the story is that the character is relaying her first sexual experience with another woman and that she found herself enjoying it. This becomes a defining moment for her because she discovers her sexuality. This part is also controversial because, at another level, it has a Lolita-esque feel to it with the woman introducing her to sex being a much older woman who had also given her alcohol. It is intended to present several issues to the viewer that, when considered over the full span of her life, challenge certain mainstream views of sex, sexual development, and its role in someone's larger sense of self.

While people can criticize it for its statutory rape overtones or the presentation of a character who, despite being raped, makes a life for herself she is proud of, but it certainly does not convey the message that "bad rape" only involves a man.

[Riviera de la Mancha]

Chahklet

That sounds sickening. I don't understand why people are so easily influenced just cause someone wrote some words down.

The play, and the part that the OP is referencing, is supposed to be controversial and its not really suited for everyone.

[SylverStar]

Chahklet

SylverStar

It's been a while since I read and seen the play. However my understanding were these were how the individual women felt and thought. That saying makes me think more about someone who has been abused/raped that they are justifying and minimizing that particular experience.

Trying to make sense of an experience and make it less painful is something that happens to people who have experienced trauma.

Like Stockholm?

No. More like denial and guilt in stages of grief

[Prince Aegon Targaryen VI]

Riviera de la Mancha

The full context of the story is that the character is relaying her first sexual experience with another woman and that she found herself enjoying it. This becomes a defining moment for her because she discovers her sexuality.

Yeah. See, that's pretty ******** up right there.

It's like the really demented (And as I understand it, unpopular with the more serious elements of the community) rapey, abuse-glorifying-y BDSM literature. Where the sub is clearly in an abusive relationship, but on some level they like it. So that makes abuse-apologist literature A-Okay!

Quote:

This part is also controversial because, at another level, it has a Lolita-esque feel to it with the woman introducing her to sex being a much older woman

Oh I wouldn't call it "Lolita-esque."

It was a 13 16 year old girl.

We can take of the "esque"

Quote:

who had also given her alcohol.

Yup.

Quote:

It is intended to present several issues to the viewer that, when considered over the full span of her life, challenge certain mainstream views of sex, sexual development, and its role in someone's larger sense of self.

Yeah. Yeah. See, to me, that sounds like pretty wrapping paper for an ugly present.

The fact that someone unironically wrote the words "If it was rape, it was good rape."

Oh! What's this? Another present! Oh, it was in the context of an adult woman date-raping a 13 16 (Because three years difference makes it okay) year old.

I'm sorry, but if this is even remotely acceptable, I need some one to pinch me and wake me up. At the bottom of the rabbit hole here.

Quote:

While people can criticize it for its statutory rape overtones or the presentation of a character who, despite being raped, makes a life for herself.

Yeah. See, I'd be more inclined towards criticizing it for the whole rape of a teenager thing; than I would for that teenager growing up to make a life of herself.

Oh, and I wouldn't call it "Overtones". Overtones would involve the scene stopping at the act itself.

Instead, it jumps off the stage, walks up to your seat, and kicks you in the face with the line "If it was rape, it was good rape."

Good. Rape.

Unironically written.

The hell is wrong with people?

Seriously, what is the context I am missing, here?

The fact that it was her first sexual experience with a woman?

The ******** sort of message is that!

"Well, yes, it was rape. But it made me realize my sexuality. So it's a good thing." (Insert Martha Stewart smile.)

I'm sorry, but this sounds to me more like something you'd find in morally repulsive erotic-literature.

All of this... All of this flowery language we can throw around it... All I'm hearing is the same bullshit I hear used to justify cruel, abuse-glorifying, pseudo-BDSM literature.

Pretty wrapping paper to hide an ugly present.

...

I just don't get it.

[Jeff the Kitten]

Prince Aegon Targaryen VI

Riviera de la Mancha

The full context of the story is that the character is relaying her first sexual experience with another woman and that she found herself enjoying it. This becomes a defining moment for her because she discovers her sexuality.

Yeah. See, that's pretty ******** up right there.

On both a.... Metaphorical and "How did someone sit down and write this out?" level....

It's like the really demented (And as I understand it, unpopular with the more serious elements of the community) rapey, abuse-glorifying-y BDSM literature. Where the sub is clearly in an abusive relationship, but on some level they like it. So that makes abuse-apologist literature A-Okay!

Quote:

This part is also controversial because, at another level, it has a Lolita-esque feel to it with the woman introducing her to sex being a much older woman

And the fact that the girl was thirteen.

But ya know, hardly a trifle, that.

Quote:

who had also given her alcohol.

Yup.

Quote:

It is intended to present several issues to the viewer that, when considered over the full span of her life, challenge certain mainstream views of sex, sexual development, and its role in someone's larger sense of self.

Yeah. Yeah. See, to me, that sounds like pretty wrapping paper for an ugly present.

The fact that someone unironically wrote the words "If it was rape, it was good rape."

Oh! What's this? Another present! Oh, it was in the context of an adult woman date-raping a 13 16 (Because three years difference makes it okay) year old.

I'm sorry, but if this is even remotely acceptable, I need some one to pinch me and wake me up. At the bottom of the rabbit hole here.

I mean, buddy, if there is this "When considered over the full span of her life" summarize that span to me. I need someone to explain to me in what context that isn't horrendously terrible.

Quote:

While people can criticize it for its statutory rape overtones or the presentation of a character who, despite being raped, makes a life for herself.

Yeah. See, I'd be more inclined towards criticizing it for the whole rape of a teenager thing; than I would for that teenager growing up to make a life of herself.

Oh, and I wouldn't call it "Overtones". Overtones would involve the scene stopping at the act itself.

Instead, it jumps off the stage, walks up to your seat, and kicks you in the face with the line "If it was rape, it was good rape."

Good. Rape.

Unironically written.

The hell is wrong with people?

Seriously, what is the context I am missing, here?

The fact that it was her first sexual experience with a woman?

The ******** sort of message is that!

"Well, yes, it was rape. But it made me realize my sexuality. So it's a good thing." (Insert Martha Stewart smile.)

I'm sorry, but this sounds to me more like something you'd find in morally repulsive erotic-literature.

...

Uhg... Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

This. I abhor works of literature or filmography that do, among other things, these two things:

1. Pretend like gay/lesbian people are woefully unaware of their sexual attraction to people of the same sex. It's pretty obvious that when you see a person of a specific sex and get hot and bothered, that's a sex you're attracted to. Even if you're hesitant to act on it because of moral safeguards; a stiffy is a stiffy.

2. Create this illusion of happy extreme age difference sexual couples. Specifically gay or lesbian couples, and often times skewed towards women. Feminists get their blood boiling over NAMBLA, but when you bring up some lesbian or gay statutory rape, they'll be dragged kicking and screaming before they profess that it is a bad thing.