One Of My Students Plagiarized Hitler.

[Ranchenator]

the reverend silver

Zephyr_infinity

no, just a flat no, I would not hold using a speech made by Hitler against anyone when it comes down to it Hitler was a powerful public speaker and his speeches brought an entire nation together. Regardless of what he did with that power which was undoubtedly evil his speeches and public speaking is something to be admired. Punish the boy for plagiarism yes but I so no moral issue with looking admirably at someone like Hitler purely for his powerful public speaking.

It's not plagiarism if he changed the words, now is it?

Yeah, it is. Even if you paraphrase without giving credit, it is still plagiarism.

[ArmasTermin]

I think that's pretty funny, but also asks the question: is something worth more or less depending on the source?

For example, a lot of people dislike the author Orson Scott Card for some kind of anti-gay feelings he's spoken about (allegedly, I've never actually read or heard any of them) but his novels, namely Ender's Game is well respected (for good reason). Some people debate if the product novel is worse for Card's personal beliefs, even if those beliefs don't show themselves anywhere in the product.

Is it right to judge some of the basic things Hitler said because he was an evil sociopathic a*****e? Or are we forced to admit that even if he and his motives were ******** up, some of the things he said are completely reasonable out of context?

If the all the kids borrow heavily from historical figures, the kid's in the clear. And if goes around that everybody was clapping for Hitler, it's just going to make everyone uncomfortable. I think you're stuck.

[I AM R U]

Well, plagiarism is usually a pretty big issue, but aside from that, I don't really see what else he has done :/

[toasega]

I Am The Architect

So a few weeks ago one of my Special Education students successfully lobbied the school administration to let him try and reintegrate into regular classes, and he's been put into an English class. Now that he's in a regular class he can join regular clubs too, and he decided to join a club for public speaking. Basically they practice for a month, and then once each month deliver a speech on current political or social issues in the morning for an assembly before class.

The problem? Just before the Thanksgiving Holiday they were doing the speeches and his was almost word for word Hitler. He changed certain words around so it made sense, but it was ******** Hitler. He mimicked the hand gestures, the volume, the tone. The audience even gave him applause.

In private he even told me he copied Hitler, and laughed really hard about it.

It isn't a project that gives a grade, and other students borrow heavily from historical figures, but it just urks me. I figured I'd wait till after the Holiday to see if I should punish him or not. I'm still not sure.

ED:

How would you feel if you saw a lot of people applauding a speech that was almost entirely written by Hitler?

wahmbulance Both incredibly amused and slightly annoyed at their idiocy, not because they fell for it, but because they would probably get mad at the guy who pointed it out, NOT the guy who gave the speech in the first place.

Do you think it is right to copy historical figures in speeches?

wahmbulance People always model themselves after the people who came before them in some way, whether they blatantly plagiarize it or they do in "in the spirit" of that person. If the person is serious about giving a speech but copies it word for word, it annoys me. If he doesn't give a crap and copies it, then I don't give a crap either.

Do you think it is ok to play practical jokes like that?

wahmbulance Absolutely. I love it when people prove that despite everyone's hatred for dictators, they will still gravitate towards them like high school kids towards the strong, popular jocks that they are. Dictators, while their goals may not be the best, get s**t done. They don't argue ceaselessly with tons of other people about what they should or shouldn't do, they just do it, and you'd be wise to stay out of the way. Deep down, people respect that, although few, if any, would ever admit it. I think that's part of why people are always saying Putin is a badass, because he's kind of a dictator in his own right. He does as he pleases and has a take-no-prisoners approach to the way he lives his life and conducts his business.

Example of some of Hitlers Speeches:

wahmbulance There are no examples here.........

[PureCocainePureCocaine]

Big Fuzzy Jaguar

the reverend silver

Zephyr_infinity

no, just a flat no, I would not hold using a speech made by Hitler against anyone when it comes down to it Hitler was a powerful public speaker and his speeches brought an entire nation together. Regardless of what he did with that power which was undoubtedly evil his speeches and public speaking is something to be admired. Punish the boy for plagiarism yes but I so no moral issue with looking admirably at someone like Hitler purely for his powerful public speaking.

It's not plagiarism if he changed the words, now is it?

Yeah, it is. Even if you paraphrase without giving credit, it is still plagiarism.

Bogus, dude. How much of it do you have to change before it's not?


And does intellectual honesty really matter if you're not trying to claim scholar's cred for the s**t? I mean, who's going to get offended that a high school kid copied you, they copy everyone about everything.

[PureCocainePureCocaine]

ArmasTermin

I think that's pretty funny, but also asks the question: is something worth more or less depending on the source?

That's a personal decision, but in the case of Orson Scott Card, [******** no, resoundingly and forever.

[Ranchenator]

PureCocainePureCocaine

Big Fuzzy Jaguar

the reverend silver

Zephyr_infinity

no, just a flat no, I would not hold using a speech made by Hitler against anyone when it comes down to it Hitler was a powerful public speaker and his speeches brought an entire nation together. Regardless of what he did with that power which was undoubtedly evil his speeches and public speaking is something to be admired. Punish the boy for plagiarism yes but I so no moral issue with looking admirably at someone like Hitler purely for his powerful public speaking.

It's not plagiarism if he changed the words, now is it?

Yeah, it is. Even if you paraphrase without giving credit, it is still plagiarism.

Bogus, dude. How much of it do you have to change before it's not?


And does intellectual honesty really matter if you're not trying to claim scholar's cred for the s**t? I mean, who's going to get offended that a high school kid copied you, they copy everyone about everything.

Well, if one of those high school kids goes off to college, it is pretty important for them to figure this stuff out now. Even still, people need to give credit where credit is due. He can say what he wants as long as he says where he got the info.

[My Dog Mr. Kitty]

While I completely despise anyone who cheats, I don't think it's right at all to completely dismiss a concept, words, scientific research, etc. simply because the person who produced it was a bad person. The Nazi's performed experiments on people that any person with proper morals would never do, but the findings have helped countless people live when they otherwise may not have

[PureCocainePureCocaine]

Big Fuzzy Jaguar

PureCocainePureCocaine

Big Fuzzy Jaguar

the reverend silver

Zephyr_infinity

no, just a flat no, I would not hold using a speech made by Hitler against anyone when it comes down to it Hitler was a powerful public speaker and his speeches brought an entire nation together. Regardless of what he did with that power which was undoubtedly evil his speeches and public speaking is something to be admired. Punish the boy for plagiarism yes but I so no moral issue with looking admirably at someone like Hitler purely for his powerful public speaking.

It's not plagiarism if he changed the words, now is it?

Yeah, it is. Even if you paraphrase without giving credit, it is still plagiarism.

Bogus, dude. How much of it do you have to change before it's not?


And does intellectual honesty really matter if you're not trying to claim scholar's cred for the s**t? I mean, who's going to get offended that a high school kid copied you, they copy everyone about everything.

Well, if one of those high school kids goes off to college, it is pretty important for them to figure this stuff out now. Even still, people need to give credit where credit is due. He can say what he wants as long as he says where he got the info.

Yeah, but, well, you know this is one of those special cases where it's better not to do so, right?
I mean you can't exactly cite Hitler.

[Ranchenator]

PureCocainePureCocaine

Big Fuzzy Jaguar

PureCocainePureCocaine

Big Fuzzy Jaguar

the reverend silver

Zephyr_infinity

no, just a flat no, I would not hold using a speech made by Hitler against anyone when it comes down to it Hitler was a powerful public speaker and his speeches brought an entire nation together. Regardless of what he did with that power which was undoubtedly evil his speeches and public speaking is something to be admired. Punish the boy for plagiarism yes but I so no moral issue with looking admirably at someone like Hitler purely for his powerful public speaking.

It's not plagiarism if he changed the words, now is it?

Yeah, it is. Even if you paraphrase without giving credit, it is still plagiarism.

Bogus, dude. How much of it do you have to change before it's not?


And does intellectual honesty really matter if you're not trying to claim scholar's cred for the s**t? I mean, who's going to get offended that a high school kid copied you, they copy everyone about everything.

Well, if one of those high school kids goes off to college, it is pretty important for them to figure this stuff out now. Even still, people need to give credit where credit is due. He can say what he wants as long as he says where he got the info.

Yeah, but, well, you know this is one of those special cases where it's better not to do so, right?
I mean you can't exactly cite Hitler.

Of course you can. He wrote Mein Kumph and he had lots of his speeches recorded. You can cite those. Just because he was a bad guy there isn't any reason that he can't be quoted correctly.

[Reidmarr von Brugge]

If it were Caesar, Napoleon, Czar Nicholas II, or Emperor Hirohito, would you think any differently?

[Autopsy by Anonymous]

if it's a good speech, then by all means, reprimand the poor b*****d for plagiarizing.
he gave it some effort at least.

and quoting Hitler isn't all that bad of a thing. he was very intelligent.

[edwardthefmaxxx]

I Am The Architect

So a few weeks ago one of my Special Education students successfully lobbied the school administration to let him try and reintegrate into regular classes, and he's been put into an English class. Now that he's in a regular class he can join regular clubs too, and he decided to join a club for public speaking. Basically they practice for a month, and then once each month deliver a speech on current political or social issues in the morning for an assembly before class.

The problem? Just before the Thanksgiving Holiday they were doing the speeches and his was almost word for word Hitler. He changed certain words around so it made sense, but it was ******** Hitler. He mimicked the hand gestures, the volume, the tone. The audience even gave him applause.

In private he even told me he copied Hitler, and laughed really hard about it.

It isn't a project that gives a grade, and other students borrow heavily from historical figures, but it just urks me. I figured I'd wait till after the Holiday to see if I should punish him or not. I'm still not sure.

ED:

How would you feel if you saw a lot of people applauding a speech that was almost entirely written by Hitler?

Do you think it is right to copy historical figures in speeches?

Do you think it is ok to play practical jokes like that?

Example of some of Hitlers Speeches:

do your duty as his teaher and teach him what plagiarism is and why its wrong I'm willing to bet he doesn't know this is because he was never required to do book reports or speeking of any kind in ld classes they teach are minimum and no more they think ld kids are dumb and incapable of higher learning I am ashmed at the system you work for if he wasn't iocolated he would of had the chance to learn what the rest of his class was learning and he would of learnd what plagiarism is.

[IronySandwich]

PureCocainePureCocaine

[Bogus, dude. How much of it do you have to change before it's not?


And does intellectual honesty really matter if you're not trying to claim scholar's cred for the s**t? I mean, who's going to get offended that a high school kid copied you, they copy everyone about everything.

Plagiarism isn't about how much you change, it's about giving a proper source for ideas. If a novel idea you put on a paper comes from a source other than you, you need to cite that source no matter how loosely it's paraphrased.

As to why it's important. It's important because it's part of his education. Sure, no one is really harmed if some high-school student plagiarizes a few lines, but it gets MUCH more important later, and the consequences much more severe. It's best he learn not to do it now than when it could get him kicked out of school or fired.

[DarkSohisohi]

There is little doubt that the above story is fake, but I will answer the questions anyway.

I Am The Architect

How would you feel if you saw a lot of people applauding a speech that was almost entirely written by Hitler?

Who made a speech is of little concern to me, all I care about is the content of it.

I Am The Architect

Do you think it is right to copy historical figures in speeches?

WTF are you talking about? Are you retarded?

I Am The Architect

Do you think it is ok to play practical jokes like that?

Yes, if it was real, such a 'joke' would be funny.