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 Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 7:09 pm
edit:
oh wait
now i remember why i forswore arguing on gaia. never mind!
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Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 9:27 pm
Maybe we could just pimp out our own art. The art that we did years ago and look at it now and ask why we even bothered. XDDD I have plenty. I kept many doodles and put it all in a drawer. I picked about 20 of em' i was meaning to improve upon. Seeing this post gives me incentive to do so now.
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 3:12 am
Plonky the Wondercat no. art theft is art theft is art theft. period. there is no contesting this point without looking like an a*****e. period. Urh. In the specific case mentioned, where artists were pimping up pictures which were (to be honest) pretty damn crappy from a technical point of view, I'd dispute that that's art theft. The original artist was credited, and while the "pimped" work drew inspiration and design details from the original work, it was clearly produced by the pimping artist's own hand. While the subject matter certainly belonged to the original artist, the pimped pictures were generally creative works in their own right. This might spin off into a whole other discussion on the nature of art theft, but personally I tend to think of art theft as cases where one artist has either attempted to pass off another artist's work as their own, or has traced or eyeballed another artist's work to produce something which is identical or extremely similar to the original piece. None of the Eatpoo artists attempted to pass off another person's work as their own (credit for the original piece was always given), and aside from a couple of instances where the pimp artist had used the original picture as the base for a paintover, most of the pimped works were noticeably different from the original works. Plonky the Wondercat basically the whole philosophy is flawed, by the way. if you just say "This is no good" and leave it at that, it is destructive criticism. that is what destructive criticism is. if you say "This is no good because of this and this, and here are some ways to remedy the problem" that is constructive criticism. i think you are giving yourself far too much credit as a misanthrope. I'm inclined to say that "this is no good" is valid as far as it goes, but it's not hugely useful. It lets the artist know that the viewer is unimpressed, but gives no real information that can be used to improve the artist's skills. It's feedback, but it's useless feedback just as much as "I like this" is useless feedback.
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 4:53 am
I've already tried a pimp my own art. It was good fun.  I'd actually like to do a third in this series now though because it's now nearly 2 years since the pimp.
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 7:49 am
Fascinating thread, that Pimp My Elfwood is, as well as controversial. (Aren't all great things, though?) Regardless of the spectacular talent and hilarity that the eatpoo thread contains, I have issues with it. The pimpers should have gotten explicit permission from the elfwood artists, if they had done that, this whole hulabaloo wouldn't have happened. The people offering their art would have gotten the joke and learned what they could from the pimping without getting all bent out of shape. Hindsight is 20/20, and if we do pimping in the art fags forum we should either do our own art or get explicit permission from the other artists.
Well, there's my two cents.
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 7:50 am
Dr. Valentine I don't think it's theivery in the same way because nobody is claiming credit for the work. It's understood that these are copies and/or mockeries. Overall, as with any difficulty in life, you can roll with it and try to learn what you can from it or you can take it in the face and whine while you collect your teeth. I'm not really here to argue, I just wrote my thoughts about this. But in that case you don't mind if I re-make your artwork, post it in my homepage and write that I felt like drawing your artwork better than you and to make you see how good you can come, if you just try? Maybe it isn't insulting to you, but to some people it is. Why are you the one to decide if they're allowed to be insulted about it or not? In case you don't care about their thoughts, then don't pretend that you do. Just say "I don't care" and make that thread. The idea wasn't bad, how they made the thread was bad. As JapaneseVinyl said - pimpin your own art or the art you have the permission to, isn't bad.
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Dr. Valentine Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:57 pm
[(-Onis-)] Dr. Valentine I don't think it's theivery in the same way because nobody is claiming credit for the work. It's understood that these are copies and/or mockeries. Overall, as with any difficulty in life, you can roll with it and try to learn what you can from it or you can take it in the face and whine while you collect your teeth. I'm not really here to argue, I just wrote my thoughts about this. But in that case you don't mind if I re-make your artwork, post it in my homepage and write that I felt like drawing your artwork better than you and to make you see how good you can come, if you just try? Maybe it isn't insulting to you, but to some people it is. Why are you the one to decide if they're allowed to be insulted about it or not? In case you don't care about their thoughts, then don't pretend that you do. Just say "I don't care" and make that thread. The idea wasn't bad, how they made the thread was bad. As JapaneseVinyl said - pimpin your own art or the art you have the permission to, isn't bad.
I just wish people in general were less defensive. Things like this could be fun if everyone was able to just have a laugh and move on, but some people can't take a bruise to the ego gracefully and have to moan about it.
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:26 pm
the thing that kinda bothers me about this is how people think that everyone will be thinking along the same lines as them. i know that not everyone draws for the same reason, so to me a thread like that it's energy wasted towards something that's like a dead end. and something along those lines in where they don't ask for permission is kinda like stepping on someones toes, regardless if they 'need' it or not.
i don't like the idea that everyone has to critique and strive to want to be the best and force that on others. reminds me of over-religious zealots. it'd be annoying if someone did that with the things i consider to be hobbies...like knitting or something. having them come up to me and say 'you can do better' and take it right out of my hands and 'fix' it for me.
that idea CAN be fun if there are boundaries that people follow. i agree with getsumoon, if permission was asked then it woulda been fun and problems wouldn't have arisen. it's a good idea but the execution is someting to be desired.
there was a thread similar to something that like that over at mess studio, before the forums went down. juji posted a thread asking if anyone wanted her to do paintovers on their work. and it was something that everyone over at mess learned from. and i for one think it's a much better route to take because then at least you're expending your energy towards someone who WANTS it rather than doing it because YOU want to for the sake of entertainment.
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Dr. Valentine Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:36 pm
crazy spork i am the thing that kinda bothers me about this is how people think that everyone will be thinking along the same lines as them. i know that not everyone draws for the same reason, so to me a thread like that it's energy wasted towards something that's like a dead end. and something along those lines in where they don't ask for permission is kinda like stepping on someones toes, regardless if they 'need' it or not. i don't like the idea that everyone has to critique and strive to want to be the best and force that on others. reminds me of over-religious zealots. it'd be annoying if someone did that with the things i consider to be hobbies...like knitting or something. having them come up to me and say 'you can do better' and take it right out of my hands and 'fix' it for me. that idea CAN be fun if there are boundaries that people follow. i agree with getsumoon, if permission was asked then it woulda been fun and problems wouldn't have arisen. it's a good idea but the execution is someting to be desired. there was a thread similar to something that like that over at mess studio, before the forums went down. juji posted a thread asking if anyone wanted her to do paintovers on their work. and it was something that everyone over at mess learned from. and i for one think it's a much better route to take because then at least you're expending your energy towards someone who WANTS it rather than doing it because YOU want to for the sake of entertainment.
I'll bet that if we posted a thread about it in the picture post we'd get mad response.
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Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 5:09 am
Good words, crazy spork i am. pretty much how I felt, expect I could have never written it that well. 3nodding
And I don't have a problem with people re-doing my art, I have a problem when they do it without my permission or against my will. *Is stubborn.*
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