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 Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:35 am
This pickled vegetable...
So, I was on another message board browsing the threads there when I came across this little gem:
Paganspace: Pagans Follow False Gods
Its OP is about a radio interview of a bias Christian writer who basically says that all pagan religions are wrong because they worship creation and not the Creator.
That's not what I'm posting about.
What I noticed in the thread was that everyone suddenly started jumping on and condemning, not only Christianity, but all the Abramatic religions. Here are just a few quotes:
Quote: Christianity is the false religion. So is Judaism and Islam. They all came after paganism.
Quote: The Abrahamic Religions are inherently intolerant and therefore should not be tolerated. In a pluralistic society they are poison.
I, myself, have a bias against Christianity, but on this thread I found myself crusading in favor of Christianity along with all the other Abramatic faiths. I'm mostly just posting this thread here because they pissed me off over there and I need to blow off some steam.
"I'm butt-hurt, hear me Bawww!"
What do you think of this thread?
Have you ever been faced with this kind of bigotry either IRL or online?
What do you do when you come up against discrimination like this?... could kick your a** !!
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Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 12:19 pm
Well, usually, when you follow a monotheist religion and you truly believe in this deity and totally stick to the concept of monotheism, all other gods and religions are false.
This combined with butthurt emanates drama.
And yes, I have come across this s**t IRL. I usually state my beliefs and share with them my reasons as to why I am a heretic. Showing strong convictions this leads them to butthurt (specially if their faith is fragile).
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Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 1:53 pm
This would happen a lot of i told the paternal side of my family (they are all very heavily Christians). However, I just don't stoke the fire. I believe what I believe and they can believe whatever they want to believe. In regards to other people, I won't offend them, and I appreciate when they don't offend me. Trying to get a rise out of people is usually in my experience anyway, how these people end up "butt hurt". There will always be people who will try to discount other religions and paths. Most religions are actually fairly tolerant but the interpretations by their followers can lead to hatred or discrimination.
In my experience, it's better to just ignore them, stand firm in your beliefs and keep practicing without provoking any sort of confrontation. There has to be a level of respect on both sides and even one one fails to actually be respectful, the other should stand firm enough to not cross the line too. As for me? Intolerant people in my world are free to express their hatred but I will never retaliate and sink to the same level they have. I know what I believe in.
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Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 7:01 pm
I have run across this sort of bigotry irl. Mostly with those who are insecure in their own faith, they want to make all others out to be the villan. In the case of those who have recently converted to another religion they tend to villify their former faith. When I run across it in people I know I try to be patient and allow them time to become more secure and see if their irrationality ebbs. If they still cling to it I may try to nudge them into realizing what they are doing. If I run across it with a stanger I tend to voice opposition, to be the voice of reason. Though the original speaker is likely not to be open and listening, others listening in or taking part in the conversation, who prehaps are open, aren't railroaded into agreeing with idiot #1. They have another line of thought to work with, they have a voice of dissent. Sometimes that is all that is needed to help the timid or shy speak their mind.
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Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 10:42 am
Mika Lockheart This would happen a lot of i told the paternal side of my family (they are all very heavily Christians). I think you misunderstood my post. There was not a single Christian on that thread condemning anyone. Everyone in in the thread I linked you to was some version of pagan and every one of them was condemning Christianity (and all the Abramatic faiths) as if they were the worse than Hitler.
I was trying to point out the hypocrisy of it. You cannot cry out "persecution!" and then turn around and do some persecuting of your own. You cannot fight intolerance with intolerance. ... could kick your a** !!
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Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 5:27 pm
No, actually, I did not misunderstand you. I was simply drawing a comparison to my own situation so people could better understand my point of view.
There is always going to be intolerance. And historically speaking Pagans did throw Christians into arenas (before Christianity was a prominent religion) and those people became victims of persecution too so that street goes both ways. I'm not saying it was right but it did happen so...that's that.Those who want to cry persecution should rightfully not condemn other beliefs.
However, often that isn't the case and my point was I chose to simply be tolerant regardless of close-mindedness on either side. It doesn't really matter which religion or what denomination of that religion (for lack of a better word) is doing the accusing or bashing when the solution to end it all is pretty much the same. Compassion, Understanding, Tolerance.
[edited]
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Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 6:24 am
Mika, you have some good points. We do not need to fight fire with fire, peace is the better solution. So who cares if we are different? What does it matter if our beliefs contradict each other? We are not trying to worship in the same group, but we can at least try and worship on the same planet and not offend anyone. Tolerance is the key, in all aspects of life. It does not only pertain to religion, race, sex, sexual orientation, age, class, and the like, but it applies to opinions, personalities, and actions as well. We should hope that we can work together and live together without calling out the hate card every five seconds.
I feel that threads focus was misdirected. A better way that the author could have started the thread was call it Spiritual Absolutism verses Spiritual Relativism. That appears to be the real issue. Absolutists believe that their religion is the only true religion, and Relativists believe that all religion is somehow connected. In the first quote, if the writer realized that Christianity is not false because it came after paganism, they could have focused on their similarity. Christianity shares many pagan holidays and concepts; that is how they are alike, and how they can understand to tolerate each other.
Guys, we should not be focusing on the intolerance. I think we all know that both sides can be intolerant, that is not a surprise, but is this helping at all? Many individuals of many different religions are tolerant of other paths. Lets focus on that. Learn the ways of understanding and learn to be mature about differences in other people. It is really a maturity thing knowing that just because you do not agree with something doesn't mean that you have to attack it.
I personally believe that any religion is good religion. Having spirituality is fulfilling and helps mold people into better citizens. Who cares if you are Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Pagan, or whatever you are, at least you are spiritual in your own way. Lets focus on our own community even. Who cares if you practice Solitary Wicca, Eclectic Paganism, Gerald Gardner Wicca, Neo Paganism, and so on. We need to be able to accept members of our own community, the pagan community, before we can try and accept members of vastly different paths.
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Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 6:44 am
Look you guys, Zab and Mika have a strong point here. Tolerance is what everyone needs in comparison to intolerance. If you fight fire with fire you burn the whole world down, and an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. Let's look at history for just a second. The crusades, the holy wars, where all the intolerant monotheistic religions have battled it out for a plot of land they believe sacred and for the "holy grail". And look at today, Israel is under countless war between intolerant groups of people for that same land.
Do we really need another crusades; do we really need another "Holy War"? Tolerance, my friends, is what we need. To be more accepting and understanding of other people's beliefs and traits as well as their appearance and choices. Pointing fingers will not solve anything here, but instead cause more fires than we already have and no one needs that.
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Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 3:26 pm
Smells like irony in here.
SNIIFFFFF, ah...
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