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Does anyone believe what Dan Brown thinks?

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jake_e_isMINE

PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 11:42 am


I saw a documentary on the DaVinci Code theories (i've never read the books) and I strongly believe in them. Am I the only one?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:25 pm


Erm...what do you mean? His views on Jesus' lineage, or what?
(I've read all except one of his books, he's a very good writer 3nodding )

Ryoko~Shoujo


Psychedelic Midnight

PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 6:07 pm


I don't believe it at all.
I also find it funny how Dan Brown's books were fictional, yet they seem to be quoted so much more than any serious books holding similar theories.
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 7:25 pm


Can someone explain the theories briefly to me? I heard about them and want to know.

Son of Axeman
Crew


Einherjar O D I N

PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 10:59 pm


O_O Where does one begin. I'm halfway through the book and theres already more than a handful....

Well... umm... go read the book??? sweatdrop Mayeb one day when i finish the book, i'll post the conspiricies in here for ya.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 2:40 am


I haven't read any of his books yet, so I really can't voice my opinion, though I feel I must say, there is truth to every fiction, and fiction to every truth.

A Murder of Angels
Captain


jake_e_isMINE

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:04 am


Here are some of his thoughts:

1) Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene (hope that's how it's spelled)
2) Jesus had a child with her.

Wait... it's been a while since the documentary aired.... if anyone else knows the resto of them, can you please help me out and post them?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 12:17 pm


jake_e_isMINE
Here are some of his thoughts:

1) Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene (hope that's how it's spelled)
2) Jesus had a child with her.

Wait... it's been a while since the documentary aired.... if anyone else knows the resto of them, can you please help me out and post them?


I watched some kind of documentary that said that same thing. I'm not sure if it was about Dan Brown or not.

Some more things it said:

- Mary Magdalene was a thirteenth apostle and was closer to Juses than any other apostle, and thus recieved some of his most secret teachings.

- After the resurrection, Mary and her child escaped across the sea and ended up in France.

- The Merovingian family, the ruling dynasty in the kingdom of France from 450 to 751 CE supposedly has a direct link to Christ through blood.

That is all I know. I'm not even sure if those theories are the same as Dan Brown's theories. Correct me if I'm wrong. And I still won't give my opinion of it, as I haven't read the books or otherwise seen enough evidence of any of this to make up my mind.

A Murder of Angels
Captain


Eteponge

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 1:04 pm


A Murder of Angels
jake_e_isMINE
Here are some of his thoughts:

1) Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene (hope that's how it's spelled)

- Mary Magdalene was a thirteenth apostle and was closer to Juses than any other apostle, and thus recieved some of his most secret teachings.

I know about these. They are from Early Gnostic Christian Tradition.

The Gospel of Mary is profound and augments the synoptics. Mary was special. I mean that. And her Gospel shows how the Lord taught her certain hidden truths.

Interestingly, in the Gospel of Mary Magdalene, the Lord teaches Mary (from whom Jesus had cast out seven devils - Luke 8:2) that one must overcome Darkness (Belial), Desire (Yaldabaoth), and Ignorance (Sabaoth) to enter the Kingdom of Light.

So then, is Mary the only one who actually was IN the Kingdom of God along with Jesus? The Gospel of Philip 48 states "'Why do I not love you like her? If a blind person and one with sight are both in the darkness, they are not different from one another. When the light comes, then the person with sight will see the light, and the blind person will remain in the darkness.'"

The Valentinian Gnostic Christian perspective on Mary Magdalene:

In the Gospel of Philip, Mary Magdalene is regarded as a full-fledged apostle. She was seen as having had a special relationship with Jesus and is said to be the apostle he loved more that the others (Gospel of Philip 64:1-2 cf. Gospel of Mary 18:14-15). She is sometimes interpreted as a symbol of Wisdom (Sophia). As such she is described as Jesus' consort and it is implied that they are married (Gospel of Philip 63:32-33, 56:6-10 cf. Gospel of Mary 10:2-3). His brother James also plays an important role in some Valentinian sources such as the First Apocalypse of James.

Here is some interesting information on Mary Magdalene in Christian Gnosticism:

http://www.magdalene.org/gnostic.htm

[Begin Quotes]

The Gnostic View of Mary Magdalene

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mary Magdalene is the subject of much reverence in Gnostic tradition. It is probably inaccurate to say "THE" Gnostic view, since there are so many different brands of Gnosticism. However, at the root of the Gnostic faith, there is some consistency in how Magdalene is presented. I will try to go over some of the many references to her in Gnostic scripture, though there are too many references to her in Gnostic literature overall to present immediately. This will be somewhat of an ongoing project.

In The Gospel of Philip, it is said:

"There were three who always walked with the Lord: Mary, his mother, and her sister, and Magdalene, the one who was called his companion. His sister and his mother and his companion were each a Mary."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The word "companion" has often been interpreted to mean "consort," which implies a very different sort of relationship between Mary Magdalene and Jesus. This is further supported in The Gospel of Philip:

"As for the Wisdom who is called "the barren," she is the mother of the angels. And the companion of the [...] Mary Magdalene. [...] loved her more than all the disciples, and used to kiss her often on her mouth. The rest of the disciples [...]. They said to him "Why do you love her more than all of us?" The Savior answered and said to them,"Why do I not love you like her? When a blind man and one who sees are both together in darkness, they are no different from one another. When the light comes, then he who sees will see the light, and he who is blind will remain in darkness."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

One of the most fascinating passages for me comes from the Pistis Sophia (my emphasis added):

"...command of the First Mystery, I looked down again upon the world of mankind, I found Mary, forward and give their interpretation." Mary, the mother of Jesus, came forward. She But Jesus answered and said : "Thou also, Mary, thou hast received form which is in forward and give their interpretation." Mary, the mother of Jesus, came forward. She But Jesus answered and said : "Thou also, Mary, thou hast received form which is in Virgin of the Light according to the light, thou and the other Mary[Magdalene], the blessed one."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The traditional biblical view of Magdalene is also echoed in The Gospel of Peter. Here we find a reference to Magdalene in her role as a "myrrh-bearer:"

"Now early on the Lord's day Mary Magdalene, a disciple (fem.) of the Lord-which, being afraid because of the Jews, for they were inflamed with anger, had not performed at the sepulchre of the Lord those things which women are accustomed to do unto them that die..."

The Gospel of Marcion also echoes the biblical reference to Magdalene being relieved of sevon demons:

"And it came to pass afterward, that he made his way through city and village, preaching and announcing as good tidings the kingdom of God : and the twelve were with him. And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, from whom seven demons had gone out..."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It is suspected that "Mariam," "Maria" and "the other Mary" in Pistis Sophia also refer to Mary Magdalene. There are an overwhelming number of references to her in this way in Pistis Sophia; the entire first book at least is an ongoing conversation between Jesus and his disciples, including Mary Magdalene and Mary, his mother.

In this passage, Jesus shows favor for Mary, by saying that her heart is more directed toward the Kingdom of Heaven than those of her brothers (the other disciples). There is also one of the many enigmatic statements about her being "the blessed one."

"Now it happened when Mariam heard these words as the Saviour was saying them, she stared for one hour into the air and said : "My Lord, command me that I speak openly".

Jesus, the compassionate, answered and said to Mariam : "Mariam, thou blessed one, whom I will complete in all the mysteries of the height, speak openly, thou art she whose heart is more directed to the Kingdom of Heaven than all thy brothers".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Again below, we see Mary as not only "the blessed one," but "blessed beyond all women upon earth." Traditionally, Mary, mother of Jesus has been considered the woman blessed beyond all others. This passage (among others) casts a bit of mystery on the situation.

"Now it happened when Maria finished saying these words, he said : "Excellent, Maria. Thou art blessed beyond all women upon earth, because thou shalt be the pleroma of all Pleromas and the completion of all completions." But when Maria heard the Saviour saying these words, she rejoiced greatly and she came before Jesus, she prostrated herself in his presence, she worshipped at his feet, she said to him : "My Lord, hear me that I question thee on this word before thou speakest with us of the places to which thou hast gone".

Jesus answered and said to Mariam : "Speak openly and do not fear. I will reveal all things which thou seekest".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As above, we see Jesus again commenting on Magdalene's blessed state. Here though, he also makes reference to her *as* the Pleroma, or the "fullness."

"Now it happened when Mariam finished saying these words to Jesus in the midst of the disciples, she said to him ; "My Lord, this is the interpretation of the mystery of the repentance of the Pistis Sophia".

It happened now when Jesus heard Mariam saying these words, he said to her : "Excellent, Mariam, thou blessed one, thou Pleroma or thou all-blessed Pleroma, who will be blessed among all generations".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Again, Jesus praises Mary's questions, and promises her great things:

"Now it happened when Jesus heard these words, he said: "Excellent, Mariam, thou blessed one who wilt inherit the whole Kingdom of the Light."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In this passage, we find Magdalene (again referred to as "the blessed one") humbling herself before Jesus because she feels her many questions could be trying his patience. Jesus answers "compassionately" and tells her that he will answer her question.

"It happened now when Jesus finished speaking these words to his disciples, Maria, the beautiful in her speech, came forward. The blessed one prostrated herself at the feet of Jesus and said : "My Lord, suffer me that I speak in thy presence, and be not angry with me because I trouble thee many times, questioning thee". The Saviour answered compassionately, he said to Maria: "Speak the discourse which thou dost wish, and I will reveal it to thee openly"" Maria answered and said to Jesus : "'My Lord, in what manner would the souls be delayed outside or in what form will they be quickly purified?".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Below, we again see Jesus praising her question, and her wholehearted seeking. "With certainty" seems to imply that she seeks with honesty and confidence, and this is also the spirit in which he reveals his answers.

"However Jesus answered and said to Maria : "Excellent, Maria. Thou dost ask well with an excellent question and thou dost seek everything with certainty and with accuracy. Now indeed I will not conceal anything from you from this hour, but I will reveal everything to you with certainty and openly. Hear now, Maria, and give ear, all you disciples."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are certainly more references in the Pistis Sophia which I haven't included above.

[End Quotes]

Another source I came across wrote...

[Begin Quotes]

Canonical Sources:

Pope Gregory combined several of the Marys. This is absolutely true. There are seven named Marys in the Gospels -that we know of. They include Mary Magdelene, the Virgin Mary (and I have my own opinions on that 'virgin' part), and the one mentioned in Luke. Gregory took the Marys and combined them, essentially, in to the aforementioned three. He also went on to insinuate that the sinner from Luke and Mary of Magdala were one.

Now, if you read John 20:17-18, you'd realize that Jesus sent Mary Magdelene off with the message that he was ascending. Why not give that message to one of his male disciples? If you had a message that was incredibly important, would you not entrust that message to someone who you knew the best and who was the most trustworthy? It would take a very close minded person not to see that there is at least some strong connection there.

Backtracking to John 20:16, Mary turns to address Jesus: "... and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master." If Jesus was a Rabbi, then he would have been married. Sex within marriage is not sinful, as it leads to lawful procreation. Way back in the day, so to speak, it would have been considered a mockery of God's gift of life not to have children. Therefore, Jesus would have been married, even if it was just to keep up appearances. Take a look at the Epistle to the Hebrews (4:15) where it says that Jesus is like us in all ways except sin; and as I've already said, sex within marriage is without sin. Add this to the closeness he obviously shared with Mary Magdelene and you've got yourself a lovely husband and wife picture.

Speaking of closeness, the relationship between Jesus and Mary is even commented upon by the male disciples. In fact, Peter is outright jealous and even asks Jesus why he shows her favor. In the Gospel of Mary, this is elaborated on to add that Mary was known and loved by Jesus more than the others. Jesus also bestowed her with teachings that he did not tell anyone else, but that Mary did pass on later.

And unlike the frightened male disciples, Mary and the other women stayed with Jesus through the ordeal of his crucifixion. It can be argued that the Romans generally did not consider women a threat, and thus they were safe, but it's doubtful that the Romans would consider anyone harmless when the foundations of their empire were threatened.

[End Quotes]
PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 8:54 pm


Personally, I find Jesus being married to Mary Magdalene and having a child rather far-fetched, but I'm not going to dismiss it right off the back. I suppose it's possible, but it still seems a little far-fetched.

Captain Jack Sporky
Crew


Son of Axeman
Crew

PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 7:06 am


I find it entirely believable that Jesus was married and had a child, but there are too many variables to take into account.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 4:38 pm


A Murder of Angels
jake_e_isMINE
Here are some of his thoughts:

1) Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene (hope that's how it's spelled)
2) Jesus had a child with her.

Wait... it's been a while since the documentary aired.... if anyone else knows the resto of them, can you please help me out and post them?


I watched some kind of documentary that said that same thing. I'm not sure if it was about Dan Brown or not.

Some more things it said:

- Mary Magdalene was a thirteenth apostle and was closer to Juses than any other apostle, and thus recieved some of his most secret teachings.

- After the resurrection, Mary and her child escaped across the sea and ended up in France.

- The Merovingian family, the ruling dynasty in the kingdom of France from 450 to 751 CE supposedly has a direct link to Christ through blood.

That is all I know. I'm not even sure if those theories are the same as Dan Brown's theories. Correct me if I'm wrong. And I still won't give my opinion of it, as I haven't read the books or otherwise seen enough evidence of any of this to make up my mind.

O.o Good God, the Merovingian dynasty? Isn't that Charlemagne's family?! Very interesting, worth checking out...*takes serious note of this* Yes, it makes sense...He would obviously want to keep Christianity in his kingdom...which is why he made it legal in his empire, and therefore it spread surprised *goes away to think*

Ryoko~Shoujo


TC_The_Martyr

PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 6:39 pm


Ryoko~Shoujo
A Murder of Angels
jake_e_isMINE
Here are some of his thoughts:

1) Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene (hope that's how it's spelled)
2) Jesus had a child with her.

Wait... it's been a while since the documentary aired.... if anyone else knows the resto of them, can you please help me out and post them?


I watched some kind of documentary that said that same thing. I'm not sure if it was about Dan Brown or not.

Some more things it said:

- Mary Magdalene was a thirteenth apostle and was closer to Juses than any other apostle, and thus recieved some of his most secret teachings.

- After the resurrection, Mary and her child escaped across the sea and ended up in France.

- The Merovingian family, the ruling dynasty in the kingdom of France from 450 to 751 CE supposedly has a direct link to Christ through blood.

That is all I know. I'm not even sure if those theories are the same as Dan Brown's theories. Correct me if I'm wrong. And I still won't give my opinion of it, as I haven't read the books or otherwise seen enough evidence of any of this to make up my mind.

O.o Good God, the Merovingian dynasty? Isn't that Charlemagne's family?! Very interesting, worth checking out...*takes serious note of this* Yes, it makes sense...He would obviously want to keep Christianity in his kingdom...which is why he made it legal in his empire, and therefore it spread surprised *goes away to think*


Also left out was that the Knights Templar were charged with keeping her body safe after she died.

The book is interesting, but it was a little too critical at parts.
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Religious Tolerance

 
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