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o sunflower king

PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2005 11:56 pm


I believe in reincarnation of humans.

I do believe animals and plants have souls, but humans, being the morons we are, really need second chances.

I believe in something like nirvana.... except you go to heaven and beome and angel, havinf infinite humanly wisdom gothered from all your lives.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 8:25 pm


Childhood Dreams
My belief is that when I die that I will be made into something else the world needs. Whether that be a rock, organism, animal or plant, I cannot decide. And I also believe that there's a chance that I could be reincarnated as another woman's child as well. <3 Does that help at all?
sure it does, i just wanted to know people's views.

Kalorn
Crew


chaoticpuppet
Crew

PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 9:13 pm


Kalorn
do people that believe in reincarnation believe that we are reincarnated as animals? my religion teaches that this is so. how about plants? fungi? or uni-cellular organisms? or virii? prions (infectious protiens)? how about rocks? i believe my religion states that we are only reincarnated into animals. but personally i think plants and fungi and uni-cellular organisms, but not virii, prions, or rocks. but other times i feel a soul is the manifestation of the will to exist, which would mean all matter and energy has a soul.

I most certainly believe that humans are reincarnated as animals, after all, a human is a type of animal xd

Seriously though, I do find that I believe it to be possible for a human to be reincarnated into an animal. As far as plants, unicellular organisms and the like, I would say that it is very probable, and most certainly holds in the Geaeistic (Gaiaistic) and Animistic theories. As such, I see that being reincarnated into such an existence is entirely possible, further, this possibility stems largely from one of my own personal philosophies of relativism (though I must admit I am in no way a proponent of the philosophy of simple relativism for that philosophy is, in itself, a paradox).
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:55 am


chaoticpuppet
Kalorn
do people that believe in reincarnation believe that we are reincarnated as animals? my religion teaches that this is so. how about plants? fungi? or uni-cellular organisms? or virii? prions (infectious protiens)? how about rocks? i believe my religion states that we are only reincarnated into animals. but personally i think plants and fungi and uni-cellular organisms, but not virii, prions, or rocks. but other times i feel a soul is the manifestation of the will to exist, which would mean all matter and energy has a soul.

I most certainly believe that humans are reincarnated as animals, after all, a human is a type of animal xd

Seriously though, I do find that I believe it to be possible for a human to be reincarnated into an animal. As far as plants, unicellular organisms and the like, I would say that it is very probable, and most certainly holds in the Geaeistic (Gaiaistic) and Animistic theories. As such, I see that being reincarnated into such an existence is entirely possible, further, this possibility stems largely from one of my own personal philosophies of relativism (though I must admit I am in no way a proponent of the philosophy of simple relativism for that philosophy is, in itself, a paradox).
would you be willing to explain, or point me in the direction of something that explains relativism? i thought it was just belief that everyone experiences their own reality.

Kalorn
Crew


chaoticpuppet
Crew

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 10:37 am


Kalorn
would you be willing to explain, or point me in the direction of something that explains relativism? i thought it was just belief that everyone experiences their own reality.

The philosophy of simple relativism essentially states that truth is that which is subjective, such that if one believes something to be true then that thing is true. Therein lies the contradiction of this philosophy. If all truth is subjective, then that allows such an objective statement to be false, thus making the philosophy false, for a true philosophy cannot be built off of false premises. In other words, the statement, everything is relative, is an objective statement about the philosophy making it such that if it is true, it automatically becomes false, for one thing becomes objective and is thus no longer subjective. Further, once it becomes false, there is then an objective truth. In both cases, there is an objective truth which makes the philosophy false.

So, in a sense, the simple relativist holds that all truth is subjective.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:53 pm


Why on earth would someone want to believe in reincarnation?! eek I'd rather die and nothing happen, just to not be anymore, than be reincarnated. An entire other life on earth? Even if I don't remember it, I'd suck.
People really don't deserve second chances though. You grow up, you mature, you think, you make decisions. 50 to 80 years is plenty of time to do all you really want to do. Especially if you believe you're going to heaven or something.

XXXDELETEDXXXGONEXXX


Kalorn
Crew

PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 6:06 pm


Mercution
Why on earth would someone want to believe in reincarnation?! eek I'd rather die and nothing happen, just to not be anymore, than be reincarnated. An entire other life on earth? Even if I don't remember it, I'd suck.
People really don't deserve second chances though. You grow up, you mature, you think, you make decisions. 50 to 80 years is plenty of time to do all you really want to do. Especially if you believe you're going to heaven or something.
faith matters aside, i think you mentioned it: so that we can have a second chance. if i'm going to become one with God, i'd want to be the best i could be. i personally think it's harsh to spend an eternity being tortured for something that i did in one short lifetime. and i feel that it is not that you do not remember it entirely, but you do not have verbalizible memory, in other words, instinct. i think i yields to a greater feeling of compasion toward living creatures if you think they have souls, just like you, and thus should have the rights of humane treatment like yourself. i think there a better explanation for "why bad things happen to good people" when it's coupled with the idea of Karma, and it gives me a strong sense of universal justice if someone can't get away with being a horrible to someone and simply escape repercussions with death.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2006 6:55 pm


Mercution
Why on earth would someone want to believe in reincarnation?! eek I'd rather die and nothing happen, just to not be anymore, than be reincarnated. An entire other life on earth? Even if I don't remember it, I'd suck.
People really don't deserve second chances though. You grow up, you mature, you think, you make decisions. 50 to 80 years is plenty of time to do all you really want to do. Especially if you believe you're going to heaven or something.

I don't think people generally choose what they believe in, so its not really a matter of whether they want to believe in it or not.

SyphaBelnades


chaoticpuppet
Crew

PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2006 11:35 pm


Mercution
Why on earth would someone want to believe in reincarnation?! eek I'd rather die and nothing happen, just to not be anymore, than be reincarnated. An entire other life on earth? Even if I don't remember it, I'd suck.

Personally, I like it here, I cannot see why anyone would not want to come back to earth. However, this may be due to my inability (which I am damn near positive is the same inability everyone else has) to imagine a world or a realm that is not quite like the one I currently reside in. Furthermore, and somewhat surprisinly (as I tend to have a severe abhorrance of most philosophy considered Nietzsche-esque), I am in complete agreement with the following from Nietzsche: "One should want nothing more when they die than to live there life over again." I feel that if, when you die and you don't want to live your life over again, then you have done something wrong with your life. You have not enjoyed what you have had the chance to enjoy by whatever the hell it is that gave us this chance to enjoy this thing we call life.


Quote:
People really don't deserve second chances though. You grow up, you mature, you think, you make decisions. 50 to 80 years is plenty of time to do all you really want to do. Especially if you believe you're going to heaven or something.

It may be true that we don't deserve second chances; but that's not the real issue here. The real issue is that you think that 50-80 yrs of life is some sort of significant time. Really, in respect t o infinity, it is infintisimally small; it is not much more than a mere mathematical point (or for a better analogy a collection of 50-80 of them) on a line. Keep in mind there are an infinite amount of points on a line.

Further, 50-80 yrs is absolutely nothing compared to a geological timeframe, much of which is devoted to millenia and the like. For a rough estimate, considering the whole of the earths existence (I think the current estimate is around a couple hundred million to a couple billion) 50-80 yrs is no more than a mere 5-15 seconds: In terms of psychology and memory, that is about the limit of your sensory memory (far less than the five-25 minutes awarded to short-term memory and even less than the 25 minutes to decades awarded to you long-term memory). So, to complete both analogies. In the geological timeframe, we exist for the equivalent of a mere, at best, 15 seconds. Couple this geological timeframe with a psychological memory analogy, we are known by whatever it is that exists, for what could be seen for (when compared to the geological timeframe) 15 seconds; that is enough to merely enter your sensory memory. Meaning, essentially, we are simply percieved as existing, then we stop existing.

So, when our life-span is taken into consideration with respect to the geological timeframe, we are in existence for such a short amount of time.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:26 am


SyphaBelnades
Mercution
Why on earth would someone want to believe in reincarnation?! eek I'd rather die and nothing happen, just to not be anymore, than be reincarnated. An entire other life on earth? Even if I don't remember it, I'd suck.
People really don't deserve second chances though. You grow up, you mature, you think, you make decisions. 50 to 80 years is plenty of time to do all you really want to do. Especially if you believe you're going to heaven or something.

I don't think people generally choose what they believe in, so its not really a matter of whether they want to believe in it or not.
well i think people are born into their religions, but after someone is a human adult, it's my opinion that they have free will and can choose to believe in what they want. if they never question any of their beliefs, that's their choice still and therefore they do choose to believe what they believe.

Kalorn
Crew


ReverbRaven

PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 11:09 am


Caelestis28
Aww poor confuzed Doomy....


ok here is how I see it, yes everything has an energy about it, no rocks do not have souls, but all living beings do, and I also do not believe that we reincarnate into other beings or items, I'm not a believer in the reincarnation to upgrade theory...I believe our time spent on earth is like the souls version of going to school and if we learn our lessons while we are here we dont need to come back or we can come back to help a fellow souls to learn there lessons. We choose to reincarnate to learn, study, develop, and grow and at some point we may decide that we are done for whatever reason and then we spend our time as spirit guides to those who choose to reincarnate and with the other souls of people and animals who have touched out lives on earth biggrin


wow that was a mouthful razz


But who (or what) gets to decide what has a soul and what doesn't? How can one even define a soul? And how can one tell that one even has a soul?

Sorry, just random philisophical questions...
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:53 pm


Kalorn
SyphaBelnades
Mercution
Why on earth would someone want to believe in reincarnation?! eek I'd rather die and nothing happen, just to not be anymore, than be reincarnated. An entire other life on earth? Even if I don't remember it, I'd suck.
People really don't deserve second chances though. You grow up, you mature, you think, you make decisions. 50 to 80 years is plenty of time to do all you really want to do. Especially if you believe you're going to heaven or something.

I don't think people generally choose what they believe in, so its not really a matter of whether they want to believe in it or not.
well i think people are born into their religions, but after someone is a human adult, it's my opinion that they have free will and can choose to believe in what they want. if they never question any of their beliefs, that's their choice still and therefore they do choose to believe what they believe.

I'm not saying that people don't have a free will. But no matter how much I study or try to follow a given religion, I can't simply decide that it is true.

SyphaBelnades


chaoticpuppet
Crew

PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 4:57 pm


NiveditaVidula
But who (or what) gets to decide what has a soul and what doesn't?

Easy, the creator. Since the creator created everything, the creator gets to decide. Now, if one is to believe that abiogenesis is the cause of life, then it is, in my mind, much harder to hold the idea of a soul.

Quote:
How can one even define a soul?

Easily, they can use words in a way such that the term soul is shorthand for the words they are using. For example, if I want a soul to be a special area in the brain, I could say that if one has a special area in their brain, they have a soul; and from then on, I could just say 'soul' instead of 'special area in the brain'.

Granted, that was more of a smartass answer, the problem is, you only made it so that the question could be inferred as 'How can one objectively define soul,' as well as ' How can one simply define soul, either objectively or not objectively.' I gave the smartass answer using the latter inferrence, if only to prove the point that your question, while still a good one, should be more explicit.

Quote:
And how can one tell that one even has a soul?

For that matter, how can one tell they actually have a body? What stops an idea like George Berkeley's "I am nothing more than a mind, and all that is, is my perception," other than personal aesthetics?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 8:59 am


chaoticpuppet
Quote:
And how can one tell that one even has a soul?

For that matter, how can one tell they actually have a body? What stops an idea like George Berkeley's "I am nothing more than a mind, and all that is, is my perception," other than personal aesthetics?


Since we're jumping into philosophy...

There was a concept I once encountered, that went something like this:

Everyone seeks the truth. There are two ways of doing this. Either one can believe everything until it is proven false, or one can disbelieve everything until it is proven true. (This was an argument on the existence of G*d, BTW.) Now, suppose that we are given a vitally important idea (in this case, that the human body exists). We have no proof in either direction (there's our senses, but if we're just brains in jars, those could be tricked) and no way of getting more evidence in either direction (our only evidence is our senses, and no matter how much sensory evidence we get, it could still be artificially generated). We need to make a decision -- we can't just wander around in circles agonizing about whether or not we're a brain in a jar. In that case, either position is equally valid. That is, while one could say "in the absense of evidence, I probably don't really have a body," which in the existence-of-G*d argument was the approach the philosopher was arguing against, it is just as accurate and correct to say "in the absense of evidence, I'm going to believe I have a body."

Not, to be sure, an argument that ends all arguments, but one originally intended to stop some of the harassment religious scientists were facing for believing in God. I think it applies equally well here.

Syzygis

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Religious Tolerance

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