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This thread is dedicated to discussion about our 2008 Presidential nominee, Bob Barr. While there are many different opinions, I'd appreciate it if debate was kept civil. Then again, I'd appreciate it is the LP won the Presidency and a majority in both houses of Congress this time around too. Anyway, please discuss in the most civil manner possible.

my personal take... we all know he's not gonna win. its important to vote for the LP, though, because that shows there is interest in the party. what I do know is this: by the burned hand theory, there is NO CHANCE IN HELL McCain is gonna get elected. And frankly, I hope he dies in the next 4 years.

George W(ashington) was right. the political party system has failed us. the main 2 parties have changed direction so many times and kept the same name. its not even funny, its sad that there's people that still vote based on party affiliation. The electoral college also needs to be abolished in favor of direct majority. we didn't have the technology in the 18th and 19th, and most of the 20th century to count direct majority. now we do. It didn't make sense then, but makes PERFECT sense now.

Honesly, I LOVE BOB BARR! ^__^ So much more than Obama or Mccain! He knows the system, worked in different areas of government, is very smart and sharp... and he is pro getting big brother government out of our lives, which is VERY much needed at this point.

While I'm not entierly thrilled with Barr, I have to say he is doing some good. His lawsuits in various states may well win us later deadlines, and if he garners enough votes, he will get the LP automatic ballot access in some states where we don't have it now. That would save us time and money on petitioning, which could be used for campighning instead. Barr himself isn't so great, but his campaighn will probably do us a lot of good. Thats my current take on the issue. We'll see if it holds come November.

i will say barr imo is a better choice than obama and mccain. tho i really do have a hard time trusting the guy due to his voting record with the republican party. i know he has said he has seen the error of his ways, but i would have preferred him to stay in congress and fix what he screwed up instead of leaving and then going to another party promising change. it makes it hard for me to really believe what he says and trust in him. perhaps if he would have stayed in congress and fought to change what he had done, and changed party while still working, i would have an easier time believing him. i really want to believe him, but when i go to vote this year, i doubt it will be for him. but it definately wont be mccain or obama i will say that much. i may write in, or vote for someone like chuck baldwin of the constitution party. either way november is still a good ways off so we all still have plenty of time to think about it.

bob barr lost to a fellow republican due to the redistricting process in 2002. the libertarian party only helped by airing adds that criticized barr more than the other republican candidate. so in reality it was more the republican base wanting the other candidate that his district merged with than the libertarian party going after him(tho i am not saying it didnt help in his defeat.) so please dont make it sound like the libertarians got one of our own elected in his place.

even if the man has changed, i still have a hard time trusting him. he was one of the most staunch supporters of the drug war on the republican side for years. he voted for the patriot act. he himself has been involved in scandals and hypocrisy during the clinton impeachment process. although i have been contemplating giving him my vote, that does not mean i dont go thru his record with a fine comb to see if he is deserving of it.

just because he supported the 2004 presidential nominee of the libertarian party, just because he no longer supports the iraq war(of which he voted FOR the iraq resolution,) just because he says he has changed his ways, just because he wears a L beside his name instead of an R now does not mean we should just hand him our vote. i would have loved it if mccain and obama would have accepted the open debate with him but they wont because they want less competition. imo, barr was a mistake to make the presidential candidate for the libertarian party. he hasnt proved himself as a libertarian. all i have seen him do is make us promises after he caused great amounts of damage to our rights while he was in congress. any candidate can make those same promises. the man was a complete tool for the bush administration. the libertarian party should have made him prove himself by running in congress again. yes i know he has a known name among congress and the political scene, but we are taking a risk with him.

maybe the man did have an epiphany after he lost his seat and realized how wrong he was. maybe he didnt. maybe he sees himself how much support the libertarian party and smaller parties are getting and wants to get some of that support for himself. then again, maybe im wrong. i have a hard time believing he just changed his ideas after he lost his position after seeing his voting record with the republican party. he did not vote in a libertarian way while in congress, and he didnt vote in a conservative way either imo while he was with the republican party which itself is conservative. he voted more of the style of the new republicans who have taken over the system not to make it smaller as they say they are about, but used it to their advantage and made it and themselves more powerful with it.

i have no problem if you cast your vote for the man. i have no place to tell you how to vote. i can however state my opinion and why i dont feel safe casting my vote for him. so i ask you not to discipline me when we are simply here to voice our opinions on a subject. i also dont vote on a "take what you can get" basis because that is the problem with the republican and democratic parties. they take what they get and follow their chosen leader blindly no matter how wrong they really are.

tell me, did you cast the vote against him in georgia? did you help in the campaign adds that said barr was a poor choice to re-elect to congress in 2002? cuz if you didnt, it was not a "WE" that got him kicked out. it was the libertarians that put their time, money, effort, and vote into removing him. if you didnt participate in that, then you are not part of the "WE." if you were part of it tho, i congratulate you in all your efforts because you accomplished your goal. if not only to get another republican put in his place.

im not trying to be a jerk, it just bothers me when people try to say they are part of a movement when they got their after it happened.