|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 8:59 am
DM_Melkhar Something fictional DOES have an existence. That existence is a fictional one. It's an existence regardless, even if it's only fictional. Yes! Exactly! A fictional existence. As in not a real existence. Everything else is noise. Berz.
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:41 am
Berzerker_prime DM_Melkhar Something fictional DOES have an existence. That existence is a fictional one. It's an existence regardless, even if it's only fictional. Yes! Exactly! A fictional existence. As in not a real existence. Everything else is noise. Berz.
The "what ifs" of this world obviously cannot be proven in this sense, but I choose to believe that fiction may not just be what we know it to be like so many other things we don't know about. I said "I choose to believe", k? *nudge nudge*
No arguments about that now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 3:28 pm
DM_Melkhar Berzerker_prime DM_Melkhar Something fictional DOES have an existence. That existence is a fictional one. It's an existence regardless, even if it's only fictional. Yes! Exactly! A fictional existence. As in not a real existence. Everything else is noise. Berz. No. It's words on a page or constructed images on a screen that convey the fictional existence. It is still not a real existence. It's still completely fictional and therefor not real. Berz.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 11:52 am
I find that looking at it that way just dulls the whole image of fantasy. For me there IS nothing to the genre whatsoever if one chooses to look at it as nothing but figments of the imagination. When I look at it from that perspective, the "magic" of it is completely lost and it becomes a dry husk because it's just fiction (I'm only talking about fantasy here as that's the guild's focus but it goes for all fiction regardless). If I can't in my mind see that something I am reading/watching as being real in some way, then the mirror shatters for me I'm afraid.
*Attempt in avoiding going in-depth again after what she said two posts ago.*
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 4:05 pm
He-he, no wonder Mel said something to me about this. It seems that we're not going to come to an agreement anytime soon here so maybe we should agree that we all have different points of view when it comes to the "terms of existence". I sometimes wish I could say that I see eye to eye to both Berz & Mel but, that's impossible. You either agree with one, or with the other so I think I am more inclined to see things as Mel does. Just cuz sometimes, I rather think there are such things that could exist in our world.
I don't suppose anyone's seen the movie "Harry & the Hendersons"? That's a very cool movie about Sasquatch and how it could exist. mrgreen
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:02 pm
Imagination is its own magic. If you ask me, it's the mark of a truly strong one that it can completely stand on its own and doesn't have to lean on the real world. The imagination needing the real world is like your or I needing a crutch.
There really isn't any way I can convince you that something either exists or it doesn't, is there? It's really a very basic tenant of logic that should be so simple as to not really need explanation. So fine, I give up trying. I've honestly had it with this and have long-since stopped caring.
Now can we please let this damn thread die?
Berz.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 10:53 am
Berzerker_prime Imagination is its own magic. If you ask me, it's the mark of a truly strong one that it can completely stand on its own and doesn't have to lean on the real world. The imagination needing the real world is like your or I needing a crutch. There really isn't any way I can convince you that something either exists or it doesn't, is there? It's really a very basic tenant of logic that should be so simple as to not really need explanation. So fine, I give up trying. I've honestly had it with this and have long-since stopped caring. Now can we please let this damn thread die? Berz.
2.) You've repeatedly insulted me on this thread in the same manner as this...Berzerker prime It's really a very basic tenant of logic that should be so simple as to not really need explanation.
3.) I will return the behaviour now. My point is also very simple to understand. I seem to have a broader view on the possibilities out there, but I don't seem to be able to get you to realise that.
4.) Believing in things that may or may not be real is not a "crutch". It's a belief. You and I both believe in God, and most people would say that we can neither prove nor disprove His existence, yet we both still choose to believe in Him. Would you call believing in Him and having faith in Him a crutch? Put both concepts on the same level.
5.) This argument is no different to the one that exists between christianity and atheism. One believes something may be out there, and the other is convinced that there isn't and can't be. Maybe we should forget it, because a christian is unlikely to convince and atheist and an atheist isn't going to convince a christian of what they believe in. Instead it's the topic of fantasy and whether anything within it can exist or not.
***
Lastly, if this was your guild, you could kill the topic. I intend to leave it so others can have their say.
You wanted to post, therefore you were prepared for the answers I was going to give just as I was preprared for yours. That was your choice to make.
I find you to be a valuable member of the guild, Berz, but if you continue to indirectly insult me by saying the same or similar things as above (like "tenant of logic being so simple" and "using the imagination as a crutch") when I asked you to take up quarrels with me over PMs, I'll have to do something. I have endeavoured to be polite, but all you've done is tried to slap me down concerning this topic.
Continue to post elsewhere in the guild, but don't post in this thread again, ok? Why post in a topic that's annoying you anyway? The main reasons why I don't want you posting in this topic again are: a.) you don't want it to continue, and b.) I want to give others the chance of posting their thoughts without them having to go through this.
TO OTHER GUILD MEMBERS: Don't refrain from posting now. This argument is over.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 9:45 am
Well that was a bit much for something such as existence. I thought by now both of you would have realized that everyone has their own points of view and it's not like you can prove one to be better than the other. Last I checked the guild was supposed to be about putting ideas and views out there for others to think about, not disprove.
In my opnion neither of you is right or wrong. Everything you have said is right for yourselves and wrong for another because that is the way of an opinon everyone has their own.
Anyway you can completely ignore this if you want to, I just like to have my say. So say I shall that I think existence relies on imagination and we can make anything exist. Like a concept, who made the concept of say happiness? humans of course, we were the ones who gave the feeling a name and labled that word for a feeling with another word: good. So I think humans have the power to create many things and even define what existence is.
Using religion as a theory and thus not saying I am right and you are wrong,as an athiest my veiw is that gods were in fact created by humans because they needed an explination that both seemed logical and provided hope for all. When I hear of miracles of healing and other things, I think they happened not because a god made them happen but because somone had enough hope and belief in their heart that they would heal that their willpower told their immune system that there was nothing wrong with them.
Those who are religious would beleive that their god had healed them and that They really exist. So because of opnions, you can see how for me gods would not exist as they would for a religious person.
-rambling now finished, hope it made sense-
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 4:41 pm
Very good Drizzt! That's sort of how I think too. I don't mind rambling if it's gonna be that good all the time, he-he. 3nodding
I was also dabbling about this the other day and I began to think about not only existence but, about the next life and alike. If we all have such different beliefs, why not have different afterlives for each of us? I mean, my afterlife could involve only things that I believe in. Maybe even have such things that I truly believe existed while I was alive (like a heaven for animals so I can see my beloved pets there). Maybe Mel will have an after life in which all sorts of creatures she thought were plausible to exist, could actually exist! Wouldn't that be neat!?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:19 am
Existence in an afterlife is something that I wonder about. Though it's most often tied in with religion and I don't particularly feel like getting to that so all I'll say is that's a topic that is interesting to me.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:21 pm
Good for you dude!
I'll wait and see if someone else has anything to add to this...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Reply
