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 Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:13 pm
I have hit some personal roadblocks lately so I've had a hard time finishing art.
This was a commissioned piece by Stubing here on Gaia. He had me do a portrait of the real him. He loves kiwis and New Zealand, so after some sketches we decided on this layout.
Larger size here.
The environment is based on Whangarei Falls, NZ.
I am working of putting a portfolio of this style, like my Colbert painting in my sig. Rendered and graphic elements combined.
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:27 pm
The contrast of detailed and subtle versus bold and flat doesn't jive right for me.
Having so many elements rendered with different techniques and detail levels seems sort of random. Especially the bushes seem out of place, halfway between flat graphic and rendered element.
I find the clashing of styles seems to de-emphasize the subjects. The kiwi seems especially lost because he is not as far at odds with his direct surroundings as some of the other elements.
I can't escape the impression that this is a picture of a shirt and pants, followed by dude, waterfall, bushes, and kiwi last.
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Dr. Valentine Vice Captain
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:33 pm
Funny. All the feedback I've gotten from teachers and illustrators is very positive of this style.
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:16 pm
Let's none of us get all defensive, now. I think what doc is pointing out is the well-known principle employed by cheap comic book artists everywhere - s**t with bold lines stands out. Want your viewer to notice something? Bold line that ********. Just because you've painted everything else doesn't negate that effect - in fact, it strengthens it. It's not that it doesn't look cool, because I personally think it looks cool. it isn't quite ' there' in how it fits in with the rest of the image, though.
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:35 pm
I'd say to start using contrast and level of detail to emphasize your subject rather than depict things accurately.
The Colbert piece works well since the rendered portions are in front of a largely graphical backdrop, with a staggered cool-warm-cool color layout that frames the subject. With the NZ piece, not so much.
The waterfall has too much contrast and too much photo-realism.
As it stands, the waterfall is the lightest thing in the painting and the rocks the darkest, and both take up large swathes of the canvas.
Unless the painting's focal point is the waterfall, consider things such as switching the waterfall to a more graphical, less rendered depiction. Lightening the black rocks to browns around and perhaps bluing the white falls with help turn it into more of a background object, and using blue & brown you'll be switching from value contrast to color contrast which could look interesting without upstaging your characters.
Conversely, you might want to darken the rock in front of the dude's nose, to help frame his face. The location of the waterfall already provides a terrific lead in to his face, a giant graphical arrow pointing at his eyes, so don't lose that.
Now, the Kiwi just drops into the grass because his legs and beak both are the same yellow-green as the grass. Just squint at the piece and he turns into a big roasted gourd on a leash. You see that bright yellow-orange you have in the Colbert piece? Try that. That Cadmium Yellow or Yellow-Orange Azo there should bring out his beak and legs, seperating him from the grass.
Though adding such a warm, vibrant color may throw off your color composition...
I kinda like the style, though you're going to have to make some tough judgment calls on how to juggle rendered items and graphical items for the best composition. Like any art, the more you do it, the better you're gonna get.
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:45 pm
The problem is with the Stephen picture is that it has a definate colour pallette; in this one it really doesnt. It's all green with smudges of brown and muddy oranges in it, so everything flattens. As well as the background being too bright and cartoony coloured, it becomes less photorealism and more blotchy, undefined.
The thing is also that colbert piece is done in the same style. It's got the cartoony look to all of it; with this it doesn't.
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 11:03 pm
the leash looks like it's going up the kiwi's butt, I think that because of the positioning and it being so dark it would probably be better if all of it was visible
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Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 4:50 am
I'm not getting defensive, don't worry.
Thanks for the input, but on this one I have to disagree.
I am getting really positive feedback from people I highly respect.
I'll just point out some other pieces using the style like this one, and the background is working more like this one.
I just want you to see more of where I'm coming from with this one.
As for the leash, I did try it with the leash in front and it didn't look as strong as with the leash behind. It interrupted the flow of the image.
Please don't think I'm discrediting anyone's opinion. I really do appreciate input. At the same time sometimes you have trust you vision as an artist.
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Dr. Valentine Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:23 am
Hansma Funny. All the feedback I've gotten from teachers and illustrators is very positive of this style. not to say that i don't dig the style, i think what you are doing here is pretty cool i just think you have to be mindful of what it is doing to the emphasis
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Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:56 am
um if it interrupts the flow you may want to consider a different color for the leash then, because even with it behind the first thing I look at is the leash, then the guys more detailed face, and then at some later point the kiwi
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Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:39 am
Hrmmm I think mostly it would help make the "style" more consistent if you applied the same neon outlining effect to the kiwi as well as the guy if they both are the subject. It would help with consistency and I think the background being rendered so differently would not bother me as much.
Although I'm sure you'll just brush off my comment as well, figured I'd put my two cents in too. X) <3 The artist's "vision" in this case has a lot of good things going for it, but it's far from refinement IMO.
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Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 12:22 pm
I think the issue about the outline is, and is going to be a matter of taste.
Really the first thing that really stood out to me in the image wasn't the outlines, but rather the human figure. I just really don't like his legs. I've neer seen anyone stand like that..it seems sort of awkward and unnatural. There are some other slight anatomical errors happening with his shoulders and torso, but in a standing pose like this, the position of the legs always stands out more.
Maybe next time, just try standing like that and see how comfortable it is. XD
I know that I have the hardest time with standing poses, and i usually need to get a reference or look at myself in the mirror.
as for the leash..i don't have trouble seeing it pass behind the kiwi (rather than coming out it) but it does appear to have too much tension in it coming from the hand to be handing with that much slack near the kiwi's head.
With that said, i think it's okay to point out that there are lots of things i LIKE about the illustration, not just the stuff i don't like. I admire your backgrounds, and i like the way you handled the plaid of his shirt. Frankly i think the choice to leave it flat HELPS the outlines because both are there to remind us that it is in fact a drawing and not entirely out to convince us that it's real.
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Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 2:39 pm
almost unrelated-but how big is this
I have a really hard time getting digital representations of my traditional work and you seem to have a good time with it.
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