|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:07 pm
So I've started doing research into Wicca, and the more and more I learn the more I love it.
Anyway before I rant about that I attempted some practice spells recently to see how it felt. I didn't have time to gather all the materials and basically made an impromptu circle. Actually, it wasn't so much a command as a request, so I'm not sure if it would really count as a 'spell'
But never the less I asked the Lord and Lady several things and requested that the help me with several issues in my life and in the life of others. For example, my mother has been extremely emotionally, physically, and mentally unstable for the past year or so and its only gotten worse as time has passed. She's a drama teacher and they're in tech week, and last year tech week resulted in her suffering a minor stroke. I asked the Goddess to help relieve her stress and renew her, and made similar requests to help heal the souls of other people around me as well as myself. I was very careful not to ask for punishment even to people I usually would have complained about. For example, there's a very angry boy in my school who bullies everyone around him and who I really hate, but instead of asking for some kind of punishment I asked that they help him to accept and deal with his anger and hopefully help him to find some peace of mind.
I probably botched most of the actual ritual, but I was worried that my mother's health (who was my primary concern) would really be in jeopardy if something wasn't done soon. I explained that I was still learning and that if they saw fit I would take responsibility for any negative consequences that might befall me as a result of my impromptu blunderings.
I told my friend about this and it really seemed to bother her, not only because I didn't follow proper ritual (I figured the intention was more important than the actual formal ritual, which I felt was more of a focus. These are all my own thoughts so far, I really know next to nothing about this and probably should have waited before attempting a prayer or casting) and also because I cast a spell on someone else without permission. Apparently, no matter the intention, you aren't allowed to do that. Is that an important universal rule, like the Rede? Or just something some witches follow?
Both the boy who I was having trouble with and my mother have seemed oddly uplifted and less tense lately, so it seems like it worked, at least for now. Do you think though that this might have angered the God and Goddess because I wasn't showing proper respect and following established ritual?
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:16 pm
The way i talk to the God and Goddess is mostly like prayer, almost. I just talk to them. If i want to make it "special" for a big request? Then i light some candles and sit or stand before my altar, or before the candles/incense.
I almost never preform a formal ritual for anything, unless it's REALLY big and i have time for it. (i have to be careful with my spells and rituals because i'm in a christian home.) - So personally i don't think it matters if you preform a big ritual with casting a circle, calling the elements, all that jazz... As long as your heart is in the right place, the Lord and Lady will see it.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:10 pm
Thats how I was looking at it, and I was very careful to think of it in the right way so it followed the Rede and ensured a positive consequence for everyone involved. But apparently you aren't allowed to cast a spell for someone if you don't ask their permission first, or so says my ex-Wiccan friend. I wanted to know if that was just a rule some people chose to follow or if it was universal like the Rede. Thats what I was really worried about.
In any case I think they forgave me for any transgression, but I want to make sure I do the right thing next time I come to them.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:36 am
This may be somewhat of an aside to what you asked, but I'd be careful about rushing into anything. If you're just starting out, give yourself time to absorb things and start with some of the basics first. You don't absolutely have to, but when you have a firmer foundation the more complicated stuff - like a full out spell you attempted - will probably work better and hold more meaning. Know why you're doing what you're doing first. A basic background in energy work, meditation, and knowledge of magical/divine systems (for correspondences and building relationships to the divine) is an important foundation. Also keep in mind that spellcraft is secondary in Wicca to the relationship with the Divine. Less religious forms of Witchcraft do focus more pointedly on spellcraft, though.
As for the idea that you can't cast on someone without permission I'm not sure where that ethical standard arose from. Likely it stemmed from the same strain of thought that believes one shouldn't cast spells that interfere with the 'free will' of another. If you aren't asking that person for permission, that can be seen as a violation of their 'free will.' This rule, then, is only relevant if you decide to believe in 'free will.' Personally, I find that even if one does happen to believe in free will it is naive to think that by doing nothing, you're not having an influence. Doing nothing is still a chosen type of influence that will have an effect. I find that counsels like the Rede are a much better guideline in terms of when to act than this notion of violating 'free will.'
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:23 pm
I'm pretty big on not doing any spells that interfere with a person's free will, however this primarily refers to bindings and other things that would have a more negative impact on a person. As far as healings and general well-being spells, I am rarely in a position to ask someone for their permission and for the most part am well know for sending people healing energy if I think they need it. I know that it will go where it is needed most and if it really isn't appropriate then the energy will simply dissipate or the Goddess will direct it to something more important.
I do have to agree that when you are just starting out that you should take your time and not feel like you need to rush into anything. I will also say that I too am known for informal circles and wouldn't worry too much about it...intent definitely goes a long way.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 3:07 pm
I believe intention is tremendously more important than the actual ritual. For me the ritual helps to focus my energies and therefore my intention, but I don't believe it is always necessary.
As to performing spells on or on the behalf of others, I think it depends on the spell. A healing spell does not interfere with free will in my personal opinion, whereas a love spell would. I think something that does not interfere with free will and has positive intention behind it (along with a piece of the spell dedicated to letting no harm be done) is perfectly ok.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 7:58 pm
Yeah, I guess I got too eager and was really worried about the wellbeing of my mom. I'm definately going to wait longer till I attempt anything else, I still have plenty to learn before I can confidently approach that. For now I'll focus on the spiritual aspect. Thanks for the advice guys, it really helps to get more than one or two opinions.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:08 pm
Kyou Nitsune So I've started doing research into Wicca, and the more and more I learn the more I love it. Anyway before I rant about that I attempted some practice spells recently to see how it felt. I didn't have time to gather all the materials and basically made an impromptu circle. Actually, it wasn't so much a command as a request, so I'm not sure if it would really count as a 'spell' But never the less I asked the Lord and Lady several things and requested that the help me with several issues in my life and in the life of others. For example, my mother has been extremely emotionally, physically, and mentally unstable for the past year or so and its only gotten worse as time has passed. She's a drama teacher and they're in tech week, and last year tech week resulted in her suffering a minor stroke. I asked the Goddess to help relieve her stress and renew her, and made similar requests to help heal the souls of other people around me as well as myself. I was very careful not to ask for punishment even to people I usually would have complained about. For example, there's a very angry boy in my school who bullies everyone around him and who I really hate, but instead of asking for some kind of punishment I asked that they help him to accept and deal with his anger and hopefully help him to find some peace of mind. I probably botched most of the actual ritual, but I was worried that my mother's health (who was my primary concern) would really be in jeopardy if something wasn't done soon. I explained that I was still learning and that if they saw fit I would take responsibility for any negative consequences that might befall me as a result of my impromptu blunderings. I told my friend about this and it really seemed to bother her, not only because I didn't follow proper ritual (I figured the intention was more important than the actual formal ritual, which I felt was more of a focus. These are all my own thoughts so far, I really know next to nothing about this and probably should have waited before attempting a prayer or casting) and also because I cast a spell on someone else without permission. Apparently, no matter the intention, you aren't allowed to do that. Is that an important universal rule, like the Rede? Or just something some witches follow? Both the boy who I was having trouble with and my mother have seemed oddly uplifted and less tense lately, so it seems like it worked, at least for now. Do you think though that this might have angered the God and Goddess because I wasn't showing proper respect and following established ritual? so i'm a bit late.. but i do have something to say. I think that if a case like that with your mother it is extremely alright to ask the goddess and god to help your mother in whatever way you see fit to do so. It's not EXTREMELY important to do a 'ritual' or 'spellworking' in times like this but if you feel the need to do so I don't think it's UTTERLY important to make it just right. I agree with Crystal that intention is Way more important than the actualy ritual. the god and goddess know what's in your heart. And just to let you know if you ever need healing energies or any kind for that matter, you can always ask in the guild and im sure people would send some your way or your mothers way. I hope everything goes well.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:40 pm
lightprincess03 so i'm a bit late.. but i do have something to say. I think that if a case like that with your mother it is extremely alright to ask the goddess and god to help your mother in whatever way you see fit to do so. It's not EXTREMELY important to do a 'ritual' or 'spellworking' in times like this but if you feel the need to do so I don't think it's UTTERLY important to make it just right. I agree with Crystal that intention is Way more important than the actualy ritual. the god and goddess know what's in your heart. And just to let you know if you ever need healing energies or any kind for that matter, you can always ask in the guild and im sure people would send some your way or your mothers way. I hope everything goes well. I'll remember that if I find myself in a similar situation, I could definitely use the surplus energy. Luckily though, I don't think I'll have to worry about my mother for a while. The past couple of days she's been glowing, it almost brings me to tears. She has been so unstable for almost over a year now and had completely changed from being my best friend to being my worst enemy. She became so incredibly bitter, and her terrible health coupled with that only made things worse. She was a large source of a lot of anger and loneliness that was building up in me that made me realize I needed spiritual direction to help abate that anger and hopefully help others. To see such a dramatic change in her over the course of just a few days is absolutely breath-taking and one of the most faith-affirming experiences I could have possibly imagined. She's back to her old self again after so much strife. I don't think I can properly express the feelings I'm going through right now. Its the most wonderful feeling in the world, I feel like I've been reborn. I used to scoff when other people would talk about their experiences with religion feeling a very personal relationship with god, feeling as if god were speaking to them, feeling renewed and whole. I feel guilty now for all those times I doubted and mocked other people for what they found in Christianity or Buddhism that I'm finding now in Wicca. Its so difficult to communicate, because I'm afraid other people might perceive it as over-dramatic and fake, when for me its something very very real. Sorry for going on a rant XD Thanks again for you advice
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:02 am
My personal belief is as long as it won't hurt anyone, and it won't affect anyone's free will, then to ask for help from the goddess is not 'taboo' in the least. Do christians ask others before they pray for them? The only thing I can say against doing something without asking is if it's black magick or if you know they're violently opposed to your religion and would not like assistance from it because of this. smile
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 12:05 pm
JVCA My personal belief is as long as it won't hurt anyone, and it won't affect anyone's free will, then to ask for help from the goddess is not 'taboo' in the least. Do christians ask others before they pray for them? The only thing I can say against doing something without asking is if it's black magick or if you know they're violently opposed to your religion and would not like assistance from it because of this. smile Thanks =] I'm a little confused though at how you determine what interferes with free will and what doesn't. My friend seemed to think that any time you cast a spell its imposing you will onto something, so you're violating its free will unless you've already asked permission. Its difficult to really see where you draw the line and say "this is messing with free will and this is not." If you look at it in the right light you could say that nothing violates free will or that everything does. I guess thats something you have to figure out for yourself.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:22 pm
I think it is all in the way that you phrase your spells, and of course what kind of spells you are doing. When you are casting spells you are imposing your will to make change..."as I will...so mote it be". Not everyone likes/wants change, so even when we think we are doing things that would be helpful to others, we have to remember that it is our vision of what we think they need - not necessarily what they want/need. So if you can it's always best to ask, especially if you are doing something major that could have a profound impact on someone's life. In general though any spell that has an effect on a person's ability to freely do any action that they would normally want to do, is not a good thing. Unless they want you to or you are protecting yourself.
Having said that though, with close friends and family it is a little different. I think that there is implied permission (unless like JVCA said - they have issues with witchcraft). It is expected that family would help each other out in times of need. So I don't think that you have to worry as much in those situations.
An example where having the best of intentions and helping someone can backfire: My father-in-law is currently in critical condition, he had a stroke about 2 weeks ago. Between my husband, my son and I (not to mention the many wonderful friends I have here on Gaia) we have sent quite a bit of healing energy his way and so far he is still hanging in there. So now you are thinking..."how is this a bad thing"? The simple truth is that he was ready to go, and I am pretty sure if we had not intervened he would have passed peacefully that first week. Now he is in constant pain, and even if he gets out of the hospital, he will have a very long road ahead of him in trying to recover. It will be very difficult for him and for that I am sorry.
Would I do it again... Yes, because that is the way that I am. I can't change that part of me, not sure that I would if I could. But it just goes to show that you should always think things through carefully whenever doing spell work. Be as aware as you can of the various ways that your will can manifest itself, and make sure that you are ok with those possible outcomes.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:18 am
I don't know about angering the lord and lady(I don't make it my buissiness to speak for deity) but, I don't think it was right of you to perform a ritual or spell whatever you desire to call it on anyone.
It's obvious you were just trying to help but, it does kind of go against the rede. You didn't mean harm, but you also did not get permission to act upon those individuals. Some people don't like the idea of witchcraft even being in their homes(even if you explain it) so acting with it upon them can be terribly upsetting to them, and you're imposing your own will upon them.
My advice would be to simply not perform rituals or spells without the permission of others and perhaps to wait and perform them after you gain more knowledge. But, I'm new to wicca and witchcraft to so, my advice may be wrong or whatever. Plus I've never even been aloud to do anything wicca related...and I won't until my sister leaves. She won't even be in the same room as me with a book on it. She's kind of confused about her own religeous beliefs and has always feared magick. I used to before I did research(even though I knew it was a force of good).
Best of luck. Hope things turn out for the best.
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:40 am
Kyou Nitsune I'm a little confused though at how you determine what interferes with free will and what doesn't. My friend seemed to think that any time you cast a spell its imposing you will onto something, so you're violating its free will unless you've already asked permission. Its difficult to really see where you draw the line and say "this is messing with free will and this is not." If you look at it in the right light you could say that nothing violates free will or that everything does. I guess thats something you have to figure out for yourself. Deary, it sounds like your friend practices a more ceremonial, conservative form of Wicca, which is fine for them, but may or may not be for you. Free will is a tricky thing, and I have read and seen opinions ranging from "perform spells only for yourself, only when all other options are gone" to "anything positive in nature can only be good for those involved." My advice is to trust your own feelings. If your mother was having such a hard time, and it was affecting your life negatively, than it was perfectly fine to pray for her in the manner you did. If magick seems unethical, prayer never is, because the gods always do what is best for all those involved, even if said parties dont see it that way. My recommendation is to take each and every person's opinion with a grain of salt, and decide for yourself what is right and what isnt. I myself practice a rather loose form of shamanic wicca, but my teacher is a ceremonial magician who is often shocked by my spontinaity. It is all in the mind and heart of the Witch/Magician, and only they can find the path right for them. =^.^=
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 9:43 am
I think its important to make a ritual your own.
If you're in a bind etc then I see no reason why you can't adapt spells for yourself.
I made a spell I called "Insta-Circle". It's a quick way of casting circle outside of my normal ritual environment if I'm feeling stressed or stuck.
Within it I improvise spells and as Goddess for blessings etc.
Hope that helped
|
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|