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Where do guild events belong?
Community Lounge
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Rp/Game Subforum
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Total Votes : 38


aretoo
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:19 pm


Omnileech
Undakai
Omni, what you don't seem to understand is that the forums, guilds, and gaia itself is not a republic. It's not a democracy. It's quite frankly an oligarchy. The moderators make the rules for the masses to follow. You have your opinions, and they may or may not listen to you, but it is not required. If they wish to make an exception to a rule, that is their perogative, and they can continue to deny you that right, as you are not part of that ruling class.


As long as they admit they're hypocrites and don't follow their own rules then I'll be satisfied if they continue to act the way they do. If you're going to be unfair and impartial then you might as well be honest about it.


Um... you mean unfair and partial, no?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:32 pm


aretoo
Omnileech
Undakai
Omni, what you don't seem to understand is that the forums, guilds, and gaia itself is not a republic. It's not a democracy. It's quite frankly an oligarchy. The moderators make the rules for the masses to follow. You have your opinions, and they may or may not listen to you, but it is not required. If they wish to make an exception to a rule, that is their perogative, and they can continue to deny you that right, as you are not part of that ruling class.


As long as they admit they're hypocrites and don't follow their own rules then I'll be satisfied if they continue to act the way they do. If you're going to be unfair and impartial then you might as well be honest about it.


Um... you mean unfair and partial, no?


Right, my bad. Unfair and not impartial. I just can't get used to saying partial. Or unfair and biased works too.

Omnileech

Omnipresent Warlord


godoftherain

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:41 pm


I think that it was smart of the moderators to put contests up at the top in temporary stickies.
If we want guild participation, then the events need to be prominent.
I don't believe it was a contradiction of the rules to post it in the main forum, because it is an event that intends to foster community and involvement in a time where participation is low and member interaction is stagnating.

I believe that it IS different than a community member posting something, as it comes from those who are running "the show", if you will, and therefore has the aura--if nothing else--of officiality and therefore may bring more interaction from the members.

Although ultimately I question if the issue here is really about the event placement at all.
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:43 pm


It's still discrimination. All the other games and contests go in the games place where they die (I guess). So the ones the mods run are somehow much different because they're running them? They're not. Sticky the events in the games forum and make a sticky about where they are in the main page.

Omnileech

Omnipresent Warlord


godoftherain

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:46 pm


Omnileech
It's still discrimination. All the other games and contests go in the games place where they die (I guess). So the ones the mods run are somehow much different because they're running them? They're not. Sticky the events in the games forum and make a sticky about where they are in the main page.


The mods are different. They clean up the garbage in the forum and are responsible for its well being.
They are different because they have more responsibility to the guild than others.
What difference would putting a sticky linking to another sticky do? That's just beuracracy, and one more click that would probably decrease participation substantially.
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:50 pm


Omnileech
It's still discrimination. All the other games and contests go in the games place where they die (I guess). So the ones the mods run are somehow much different because they're running them? They're not. Sticky the events in the games forum and make a sticky about where they are in the main page.
That's not entirely accurate. Around December another contest managed to get through, and that one wasn't moved, either. At the time of it's creation, I was under the impression that games (which do not normally have a specific end date) whent into the subforum, and contests (having a specific end date) were allowable in the forums.

Undakai
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Alarias

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:03 am


Omnileech
I find it funny how all the mods allegedly made their decision in under 20 minutes. So what, were they all online or did you just ask one or two people, Alarias and go with the decision you made yourself?

Who exactly did you talk to and what did they say? When?

How can you possibly make a decision as big as guild policy without consulting even most of the staff? Looks like you made the decision largely on your own covering your decision to make the thread where you did.

Largely your arguments have been red herrings too.

"It's for entertainment so don't get upset!"

"This is trivial!"

"It's always been this way!"

"It's an exception! (Though largely only the staff are able to get exceptions for any of their rules)"

"If you don't like how we do things, don't complain or try to change then, just leave!"

And my other opponents made equally poor arguments.

"You must have a vendetta!"


"Omni's having a tantrum!"

"Contests are not games!"

"Gaia has event games!"

Which are in their own forum specifically designed for them and not in any of the main forums.

"Well if you're going to complain about where we put the games/contests then we shouldn't hold any at all!"

Give me a break. I'm asking for universal following of the rules no matter who makes them. Being a guild contest does not make it any different from any other contest. It's still a game to played for a prize.

I agree wholeheartedly with Saverio.

You are right, I did not talk to all of the mods.
I talked to a couple of mods.
I felt that our opinions backed with the fact that this is the way we've always run the guild events was more than enough to give you an answer.

Later, there were even more mods that agreed with me on it.
I would have waited longer for all the mods or most of them to voice their opinion but, I have other obligations right now especially and I felt a prompt response was best.

Again, I think you are making this bigger and messier than it has to be.
Yes, it was guild policy, but one already in place. I don't see any reason to wait hours for the confirmation of all mods to tell a member that that's where we put guild events.

You have a problem with that, fine. You should have just made a thread about it or PMed a mod or both. There was no need to take over that thread the way you did.

As for my arguments?
They are important in that this guild has had far too much drama in it already and I've seen numerous amounts of complaints about it.
Members are becoming agitated and this hurts guild activity.
Entertainment is an issue here Omni and you are having a very negative effect.

I've already made my points and stated my opinions on the issue of the rules and the exceptions to them and really, that's all this is going to boil down to.
I never said you couldn't complain about the guild Omni, I said that if you find so many faults with the guild and its mod's decisions that have already been made, you may feel free to leave.
Making all these threads solely for the purpose of causing problems is ridiculous, over dramatic, childish, and in my opinion should warrant banning.
If you were actually seriously concerned, you should have organized this better rather than make a bunch of threads just to exploit the current problem we are facing about the contests. You should have been polite and mature and instead of throwing around accusations against the mods, you should have tried to negotiate with them.

This is a game whether you like it or not. It's not a country. It's not your government. It does not have to abide by those rules if it doesn't want to.

We are not being hypocrites by having an exception.
And the mods are not the only ones that these exceptions are for.
The Phunkeh thread is the biggest example of that.
And really, these contests aren't for us. They are for the members.
By putting them on the main page, we are giving more members a chance to participate. Meaning, we'd have more work cut out for ourselves.

I hope this can be brought to an end shortly.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 1:18 pm


Teach me to go on hiatus. . . stare Alright. I have a very simple response which, had I been here at the beginning of this, would have answered this question when Alarias brought it up in the Crew Quarters.

When we made the RP/Games subforum it was agreed and decided between mods and members alike that since contests have an expiration date they need the exposure of being in the Community Lounge. This includes all contests whether created by the mods or any regular member. It was also decided just what constitutes a contest. There were three primary criteria.

1: It must have a set goal.
2: It must have an ending date.
3: It must have at least one prize of some value.

Guild contests have all three of these.


There is one, and only one difference between guild contests and member contests. Guild contests, since they are created by the guild and often have a much larger pool of prizes, get stickied.

Mods are members too. If we're making our own contests, we don't sticky those.

If there is an idea for a guild event around some holiday we don't just create a contest on our own and call it a guild event, we discuss it in the Crew Quarters first, even if only 3-5 of us, and those mods throw the event. Others can sign on to the event when they get online, but not every mod has to be present to make a decision.

On that note, as the guild obviously agrees with the mods, I'm locking this and we can consider the new guild agreement to simply reinforce the original one.

Games and Roleplays belong in the subforum. Contests, as defined above, belong in the Community Lounge. I will be adding this to the welcome thread in the Community Lounge.

Shadow-Savant
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