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 Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 2:19 am
I see... I'll just give Pete a ring and tell him to get rid of the AC list then. I'm sure he'll understand.
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Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 6:32 am
Jerhien Lt_Brookman See, the Imperial Guard has great tanks and in the current downsized list, the AC is still considered a cheesy thing. I'd love to plug in some anecdotes from fellow Guard commanders who used their AC's in tournaments, where the list is perfectly legal. And they don't get complaints about being called dirty, filthy or gay. Besides, as mentioned by Reddemon, tournament armies are designed to take all on. AC lists can go down just like any other army, they told us that alright. Tournament armies are designed to be balanced, and should be able to handle a moderate amount of enemy armor, heavy and normal infantry. Building a list that is SOLELY armor spits in the face of balance. You have to have a specifically built army to fight AC...if you don't bring a LOT of heavy weapons (which will ******** your composition rating) you can't compete...which plays right into what the powergamers want. That's the issue with it. I say agian. Deal with it. Dont wine and b***h about it. Figure out the hole in his plan. Instead of taking alot of Heavy weapons why dont you take some anti-tank/anti-marine weapons? The odd meltagun(or your armys version) can work wonders for a squad before you charge into battle. I know in my Iron Warriors army that Im gonna have one Havoc squad with missle launchers. Cant a gaurdsmen squad take atleast 3 of em? There is always one way to build a army that it can take on alota guys
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Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:38 pm
Lt_Brookman I see... I'll just give Pete a ring and tell him to get rid of the AC list then. I'm sure he'll understand. Actually you'd have to call GW HQ and ask why people who play the list are routinely penalized for army composition in RTT's. The lists are fine for casual, fun play. Hell genestealer cult is fine for casual play...but does it have a place on the tournament scene where lists that overspecialize are heavily biased against?
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Posted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:41 pm
Reddemon Jerhien Lt_Brookman See, the Imperial Guard has great tanks and in the current downsized list, the AC is still considered a cheesy thing. I'd love to plug in some anecdotes from fellow Guard commanders who used their AC's in tournaments, where the list is perfectly legal. And they don't get complaints about being called dirty, filthy or gay. Besides, as mentioned by Reddemon, tournament armies are designed to take all on. AC lists can go down just like any other army, they told us that alright. Tournament armies are designed to be balanced, and should be able to handle a moderate amount of enemy armor, heavy and normal infantry. Building a list that is SOLELY armor spits in the face of balance. You have to have a specifically built army to fight AC...if you don't bring a LOT of heavy weapons (which will ******** your composition rating) you can't compete...which plays right into what the powergamers want. That's the issue with it. I say agian. Deal with it. Dont wine and b***h about it. Figure out the hole in his plan. Instead of taking alot of Heavy weapons why dont you take some anti-tank/anti-marine weapons? The odd meltagun(or your armys version) can work wonders for a squad before you charge into battle. I know in my Iron Warriors army that Im gonna have one Havoc squad with missle launchers. Cant a gaurdsmen squad take atleast 3 of em? There is always one way to build a army that it can take on alota guys And I say again, the only way to defeat an overspecialized list is to overspecialize...as that's the case, the list is unbalanced for tournament play. If you make an "balanced" space marine list (which is what you are supposed to do in competitive play) and you fight against an AC you're ********. I'm not saying it's an unbeatable list...far from it. I worked for GW for years, and I've judged at tourny's. What I am saying is that lists like that are in direct opposition with what GW wants for tournament style play.
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Posted: Sun Jan 01, 2006 5:54 am
Just because IG tanks have good armour does not make them invulnerable. They still need to move in order to win.
Look, let's just drop this before more people stick their peepee into this so-called beehive of controversial banter.
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 4:52 pm
Ok so now my AC is ready for 1000 pt game play with my Infantry Co not far behind it but theyre using a good amount of Allied units right now
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 6:27 pm
Mat Ok so now my AC is ready for 1000 pt game play with my Infantry Co not far behind it but theyre using a good amount of Allied units right now dont you like only need 4 tanks for a 1000 point list?
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Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 11:10 pm
Question on the Honorifica Imperialis.
Ok, i know it says that when you give a model the HI its stats are replaced by the senior officer superior stats. What if you give it to a Tech Priest? does he retain his 3+ save or does he take on the senior officers 5+?
On the topic of beating a specialized army, it is absurd to say it can only be beaten by another specialized army. A balanced army is balanced because it has all areas covered to a degree allowing it to adapt to any situation, giving it alot of flexability. As for a specialized army such as an AC, it is designed to operate in a very specific way with very little flexability that once compromised, will burn. at least... thats my opinion.
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Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:00 am
The Enginseer WILL keep his 3+ armour save. Stats superior to those of the HI will not be replaced. Should be obvious really.
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Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:23 pm
Reddemon Mat Ok so now my AC is ready for 1000 pt game play with my Infantry Co not far behind it but theyre using a good amount of Allied units right now dont you like only need 4 tanks for a 1000 point list? um no for 1000 points i get 3 Leman Russ Tanks 1 HellHound 2 Sentinals 1 Demolisher 1 Basilisk im trying to work it out to get rid of the sentinals and putting in storm troopers
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Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:42 pm
On the topic of maiking a specialized list against AC, its not true. We had a rogue trader tourny about a month ago at the local store. I believe my 1000pt Tau list is pretty balanced, and i think i proved it that day. I'm not gonna post my list unless anyone asks, so all i'm gonna say about is that my anti tank weapons consisted of a hammer head with railgun and two broadsides. i went up against someone who was using an AC list, and he had 4 leman russes.(he had a 750 list at this point). It took about 5 turns of just shooting at each other, but i eventually one, helped a bit by stealth who got around behind the tanks. I lost both broadsides, so at the end, it was 1 hammerhead and a team of stealth that won the match
Point: AC isn't a deal if you have a balanced list. Just use a list for a while and fine tune it until you think its great.
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Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 4:02 pm
Lt_Brookman The Enginseer WILL keep his 3+ armour save. Stats superior to those of the HI will not be replaced. Should be obvious really. I had thought that, but had to be sure. Thanks.
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Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 6:04 pm
Chakra_Thief On the topic of maiking a specialized list against AC, its not true. We had a rogue trader tourny about a month ago at the local store. I believe my 1000pt Tau list is pretty balanced, and i think i proved it that day. I'm not gonna post my list unless anyone asks, so all i'm gonna say about is that my anti tank weapons consisted of a hammer head with railgun and two broadsides. i went up against someone who was using an AC list, and he had 4 leman russes.(he had a 750 list at this point). It took about 5 turns of just shooting at each other, but i eventually one, helped a bit by stealth who got around behind the tanks. I lost both broadsides, so at the end, it was 1 hammerhead and a team of stealth that won the match Point: AC isn't a deal if you have a balanced list. Just use a list for a while and fine tune it until you think its great. The problem is, the balance of the list depends heavily on the scenario. Good old fashioned meatgrinders have a balanced list, but that balanced list would not work in a recon mission. Your balance depends on the objectives. If its a tournament with no "retooling" allowed, then you're buggered.
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Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 7:06 am
yes i played escalation against 13th company last night and was complete masacared and i had my list balanced as best as possible but they were in close combat with the only troops i had on the ground at the start in the first turn i didnt get any of my Armour in until turn 3 which by then all my units had been wiped out.
Now i did massacre many enemy units once i got out the heavy stuff they were on them in the next turn and is was just a matter of time before the had them all
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Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 12:15 pm
Reddemon Cant a gaurdsmen squad take atleast 3 of em? No, they can't, stop thinking in DoW terms. Guardsmen squads can take --1-- Assualt Weapon per squad, and I don't even think Melta Gun is among them.
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