Welcome to Gaia! ::

Hi, Matt! How's it going? xp

*Attacks the over abundant foamy thread.*

The thread is foaming from the mouth!!! gonk

Owle: Why do you have to go to Lumina and follow the dark spirit leader thing? Go to Marie's city and follow Nyx. They're good and Dark elemental.

[boredom thoughts and attempt to apply the concepts of holy and evil to spirits without making one exclusively holy or evil.] These things are usually disjointed and confusing, cause my brain understands things on levels I don't, but:

Hmm.... TFO, and my spirit Nyx. Two dark spirits, one evil, one good... I always though of the elements being the elements. The spirits that were made of their power, as well as the people who were blessed with the ability to use it could decide for themselves whether they were good(holy) or evil.(or in the case of what Josh wrote, on the side of creation or destruction.) Those two sides would be like opposing charges for the magic or whatever.

It'd kinda be like Air +, Air -, Dark +, Dark -, etc. A good and bad force. All magic, spirit, and people would be subject to siding with one of these forces in their actions and magic. (>_> I guess free magic would be the neutral one) Though, this would make each cancel out, instead of one overriding the other. (holy protecting from and destroying evil) Though... the free magic thinger could be on the side of good and make it be more powerful than evil...

or I could just drop the Christian relatedness of good being unstoppably powerful, since it doesn't apply to this at all, and it could just be that holy(creation, good) destroys evil(destruction, bad.) but it is also negated, (turning to free magic or something) and they would just cancel each other out...

OH! Hmm... yeah! Magic that comes from free magic as a base would just be magic. (Technically, it would have an element too, but I'd like to think that you could do other things with free magic besides make elements) anyway, this neutral spell could also be given a charge if it didn't have one.

[Let me define something. Creation would represent good, holy, and such by human standards, and I'll refer to it as positive(+) energy too, Destruction is bad, evil, and will be called negative. Free magic is free of a charge, as well as just being whatever other types of free it was before.]

Basically, you could make things + or - charged (holy or evil.) This charge would repel the opposite charge and overpower it if the charge was stronger. (an item charged with the force of creation would repel destruction things unless the destruction thing was more powerful.) Aslo, this would be why undead(destrction charged dark magic creatures) would be hurt by creation charged spells.(especially light since it is opposed.)

This applies to objects, entities, and spells. In people, spirits, etc., they could choose their alignment. Items could have their charge changed(purified or corrupted). Spells would keep their charge for their duration, but the opposite charge would be able to cancel it.




finally, applying it to the creation thing. Joshs version basically implies this, but doesn't associate them.

Free magic: Neutral magical energy that exists. It is used to, well, perform acts of magic or whatever.

Destruction: Uses free magic for it's own purposes. Regarded as an evil force, and it's use of free magic is regarded as negative magic.

Creation: Uses free magic for its own purposes. Regarded as a good force, and it's use of free magic is considered positive magic.

Light, Fire, and Air: Elements born of creation. They use free magic directly, and can also use bits of positive and negative magic. Each spirit of this can choose for itself whether it will just use free magic, or side with one of the original spirits, making any of these capable of good or evil.
Dark, Water, Earth: Were created by Destruction to oppose Light, Fire, and Air. As they were made of opposing forces, they naturally counter each other, though they don't necessarily side with a force.

The 6 elemental spirits: Most powerful of the spirits. They were born directly from the destroyed Creation and Destruction, originally having been the cores of the powers used by them to combat each other. They govern the elements of the world. Though half the powers naturally counter the other half, they all have their own freedom and intentions. They use Free magic for their own purposes.

Other elemental spirits: The torn peices of creation and darkness followed the elementals, becoming elemental spirits. Though each peice could choose its own element, they still retained their properties of creation and darkness. They became negatively and positively aligned, (meaning that their are good and bad spirits of pretty much any element, though they can change(good or evilness) if they are properly convinced.), and fought among each other because of alignment, as well as element. As the 6 elementals fought, the peices of them that were torn off and fragmented became neutrally aligned spirits.

The items: Fearing that the same thing that created them could possibly happen to them(the destruction of each other), they created the elemental items, which would keep the elements in balance even if the spirits themselves did tear one another to peices. The elemental items carry no alignment but for that of their element, and as the 6 elementals are the single most powerful forces, they cannot be given another alignment of any type.

Human based magic: Using the power of an elemental or elemental spirit by reciving power from them, or by using the power in themselves(like free magic, but contained in people) to manipulate spirits into making their spells. (or however Jello said magic was used. Basically calling on the power of an Elemental, or elemental spirit)

Alignment: There are the 6 elementals and the forces of Creation and Destruction. Aligining with an elemental is the most common. In addition, you can also be positively(creation) or negatively(destruction) aligned, which generally means that you either follow a lesser spirit of that alignment, or you manipulate the spirits in that way. Basically, you can be aligned with the light, Dark, Air, Earth, Water, or Fire elementals, or an elemental spirit (a "deity") with an + or - alignment(I.E. Fire + ) and an the name of the spirit you follow. (Light + is not a real alignment as all light positive ones follow the light elemental)

Generally, the spirits follow the elementals they are aligned with, though they may have opposing charges and fight amongst themselves (meaning that it is the user who decides whether they're going to use neutral or charged spirits to cast spells, though they generally frown on magic being used for destructive purposes all the time.), though in the case of the elementals, Light and Dark, they are the closest to their creators, and as such Light heavily favors the creation alignment and Dark tends to favor the Destruction(Meaning that spirits of light and darkness generally have positive and negative alignments, respectively, though its not impossible for them to have the opposite. You may fall out of favor of the elementals if you use the opposite alignment too much.)

The elementals are the most powerful, and making enemies of them is not good. As it has been said, even with good or bad alignments, all elemental spirits are aligned with an elemental. "Deities" that are not the elemental spirits usually follow them to an extent still, as those who are openly opposed to an elemental are usually dealt with before they can pose much of a threat.



Notes: Everytime I said "neutral, I meant aligned only with an elemental, and not with a force"
Charged means having a Creation(holy) or Destruction(evil) alignment.
Using evil or good powers is diferent from following a spirit or using powers for your own evil intentions.
This is essentially what Josh said, but with my concept of holy and such explained. Marie follows a Dark + spirit(Nyx) and has positive dark abilities. (and is good.) This is pretty much the line of thought I had when I created Marie, applied to what has been said.

The way Josh says it, it still seems like all the elemetal forces on one side are still predetermined to be bad. This way, the elements oppose each other, but none is particularly bad or good. The spirits and humans can fight on that level too.(good and evil, as well as elemental supremacy.)

My problem was as much with Dark being evil as light being automatically holy and capable of cleansing things. They retain their stereotypes to a point, but the users aren't held to them at all. As such, any element can have a holy force and an evil force. (Light can keep its super healing abilities, though holiness shouldn't apply to it alone)

[/disjointed boredom thoughts]

Yeah, I follow. I was just saying that it sounded like you saying the 6 countries, er elementals, were sided with either Destruction or Creation, as opposed to fighting each other because of their own goals.

That's the basic thing I mean, too, and also forgot to mention in part. like you said, each side has what they consider patriotic, pure, and holy, and corruption is the same all over.
Holy based things of any element would be able to oppose corrupt things (this is all about undead and such. Light can hurt undead because they have a dark element, but there's associations to dark being evil and light being holy.) and generally fight against unholy things. (such as evil spirits), but because of patriotism, the holiness would affect the opposing element in a similar manner. (Earth purified holy water would harm Air things)

This isn't really necessary if it's just that each element has its own things, and just opposes each other to various amount, but at the same time it's necessary to explain a underlying force of good and evil, so that something can be marked evil but not have to be dark associated. (Say a fire mage summoned a "hellhound" and it was fire based. Now, it would clearly be as evil as an undead zombie, but would light be able to hurt it the same? Not unless you defined it as holy. Though, without the associations... there is no real good and evil, and zombies cease to be evil too... they might not be morally right, but they're not particularly evil either.)

Hmm though in my idea, the major spirits act like yours, but the minor spirits will sometimes be good or bad, actually, I should stop saying that. They will do certain types of spells. Some will help to create some to destroy. Basically, some heal and protect, and some are meant to hurt, though if they're just hurting those that hurt, then they're still condsidered creation. It's when you have things that raze cities, make zombies, and have people slowly be tourtured to death that it becomes bad. Bad being things that want to just spread destruction and knock the elements out of balance, or do things that really should not be done.

But, when it comes down to it, it really is a personal thing. Ultimately, yeah, the person decides whether they do good or bad things. Most spirits just follow the elementals in this case. The bad ones are just bits of corruption. Holy is basically whatever the governing elemental decides is right. Though it still has a force which hurts that which is opposed to it. (I like the idea of corrupting/purifing things, but not a whole side being corrupted.)

Anyway, yeah, I understand, and that's basically what I meant too. Though with more fighting on the little spirit level. Rouge spirits and all, starting fires and possessing people. Also provides for "gods/goddeses."

<_< >_> I have no idea what I'm talking about anymore.

Finally got those done... Now, to fade into obscurity. ninja






It's basically what I said. :shrug: What else is there to really explain? I'm on strike or something like that.

Who went behind your back on what? Specifically, who did what to get you so upset? I went looking around here trying to figure out what could have upset you so much, and I didn't see anything. Maybe I didn't look hard enough. Maybe it's none of my business. I'd just like to know what happened to make you want to do this when all you've been saying for the past week or so is how much you've been looking forward to WoG starting up again. It's probably none of my business at all, but if I don't know what happened I'm pretty sure I don't even have a chance of helping the situation. I also want to know if I had anything to do with it, so that I can apologize or explain any actions of mine that might have been misunderstood.

You know... I told myself that if you guessed right, I wouldn't make a stink and write out the angry rant that's been going through my head for the past 18 hours...

...too bad for you, right? Too bad your self-centered arrogance and indifference to the feelings of the people around you kicked in right now, isn't it? Just... too bad. stare



Like I said before I wrote it... it's a thought, an idea, a suggestion... How could it possibly have been taken otherwise? Honestly? How could it have been? It's not like I'm ever consulted on things anymore, and it's certainly not like she ever tells me what she does have planned. Obviously you knew exactly what she was going to have, though all I get to see is what's posted in the thread. All I can do is assume what goes into the holes and make suggestions about how to fill them in in case she doesn't already have something planned out.


Argument? eek

Where was this argument? Why was I not notified that I was involved in an argument? It really would have helped my case if I could have said at least one word before I was judged guilty and sent up the river, you know? That would have been really nice...




Honestly, if you want to know the real reason I'm upset, it's because I'm sick and tired of babysitting. I'm tired of doing things because I feel that I have to, and I'm tired of doing things out of the goodness of my heart.

It would have been nice if she'd have told me she was going to take me off the mods list... hell, it would have been nice if she'd have told me afterwards that she did take me off the mods list. Though what I would have really liked is if she'd have had the common decency to tell me that she wasn't happy with the way things were... though I guess I can't expect that much out of her, since 9 times out of 10 she doesn't. stare

It's the most wonderful feeling in the world to know that someone trusts you enough to talk to you about something, isn't it? And I don't think I can even find a way to describe how it feels when someone claims that they trust you like that, then lies to you whenever you ask them something, even the smallest things.

I'm sick of everything that's going on, and most of all I'm sick of the way I'm treated. If I wanted mindless responsiblity with no thanks whatsoever I'd... you know what... honestly, I can't think of anything right now that I could do for someone else that wouldn't get me at least a thanks in responce... Except this.

What I'm sick of is the fact that I can't trust a single thing that you say to me, Miss Sey... Not one. You tell me one thing, yet mean another, you say something, but don't mean it at all, and then there are all those things which you don't say, even when I ask specifically, and the ones which by all rights I SHOULD be told about, yet seem to be simply 'overlooked' or something. stare

Oh, and my personal favorite... the outright deceptions... I think the one that popped into my head a few minutes ago would be back in January or so when you were saying how much you loved me... And you said something along the lines of: "Oh, don't tell anybody how it is between us, because it's better for business if they think I'm available."

You... stressed ...you've been telling me that you want to be my friend and that you don't want to stop talking to me... Well, that's just fine and dandy to say, isn't it? Though you certainly don't seem to be going out of your way to speak to me about anything at all, do you? Not that it's much of a change, now is it? You've been ignoring me since February... Why should I expect something different out of you when you're just as flat and two-dimensional as you advertise yourself as?

You know, there's so much more that I'd like to say, and there's so much more that I could say... but I don't feel like it. I'm tired of holding back what I say to protect your feelings, and I'm tired of putting up with your bullshit because I hope you have good intentions behind it.

And now, for the first time EVER since I met you, I'm going to say something mean and actually have the feelings to back it up, rather than it simply be said jokingly:

"You can take that self-rightousness, that superiority, that feigned concern for other people, and that holier-than-thou attitude of yours, ball it up real tight, and build yourself a new friend out of it... because I'm done. You're a horrible person, Mia Maceren, and I don't want anything more to do with you until you can learn to be human."

Learn that there are two words before 'take' in the concept of 'give and take'. You need to show at least a little concern for other people in order to have them give you anything back other than the basic regard for human life that you've failed to show me for the past five months.

As you've so often put: "Sey is Mia and Mia is Sey", well, if you really are so hopelessly out of touch with the world around you and really do happen to be so horribly immature, I can only say to you now what I've said IC so many times...

I'll treat you like an adult when you prove to me you can act like one.

Goodbye, Sey... Think real hard about the next thing you decide to say to me, because you might not have another chance at it...





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