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 Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:32 pm
From the way I understand it, romeo wilco, is that the Works of Glory are not required to be made by outside people. The player themselves produce the art. Remember, however, that art isn't all fancy drawings and paintings. Food art, photos, poems, sketches, paitings, flower arranging, hedge trimming, finger painting etc etc are all 'art'. What matters is the thought put into the art - it's not a measure of wealth, RL or Gaian. ========================================================= Tally SuggestionsI've been fiddling with my numbers a bit to account for others' opinions... and this is my proposed new set. Everyone seems set on 30/80/180 but I'd like to point out it's only daunting if you don't do any combination of RPs/Solos. 10 1000-word Solos is 20 points already, regardless of their content - that's 20% of the leap between Youth and Deity already. I know some people hate solos so I agree that they should be optional... I think some flexibility in obtaining points for the Deity is key, and has been supported by others' opinions. And it comes to mind that an RP where each person has >1000 words each total. If that's the case then Glyph's 57 RPs alone put him at 114 points, including the solos makes his total 169 points. Again, using him as an example, I feel that it's too quick/easily obtained. Thus, going with a 30/80/180 break down I propose these options for Youth-to-Deity. Ways to Obtain Points for Deity Any combination of these Options could be used to achieve Deity. Option 1: RPs + unlimited; truncated=0.5points, 500-1000/person=1point, >1000/person Option 2: Solos Option 2: Solos + unlimited; <500 words=0.5points, 500-1000 words=1point, >1000 words 2 points Option 3: Works of Glory + Up to 5 pieces must be made by the PLAYER and glorify the character in some way; 5points/WoG; Max 25 points obtained this way Option 4: Honours from Others + Up to 5 pieces must be made by a person NOT the player, any quality; 1point/piece; Max 5 points obtained this way Option 5: Honours from Self + Up to 15 pieces, must be made by the PLAYER and be a sketch/painting/picture of any quality; 1point/piece; Max 15 points obtained this way Option 6: Followers + Up to 100 followers, Followers must report the plushie with a short 2-3 sentence blurb saying they are a follower of the character**; 0.1points/follower; Max 10 points obtained this way ** This would allow a mixture of written proof and the plushie system... and for their to be proof said person follows a god character. Model Explanation I feel that maybe the earlier excel spreadsheets I posted weren't understood. I've also revised them a little. 
[Revision D - 30/100/200 - Math]As you can see, with a 30/100/200 requirement, it's still easy to obtain.
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:38 pm
Skie, I bleev roma is referring to this: from the front page req list Candidates must have at least three commissions from outside artists. These can be informal, from a friend, sketches or pictures. Also I really like the works of glory can we keep those. ;^;
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 5:22 pm
Yes, that is what I was referring to--the three commissions from outside artists. I think I said four separate times that I would have no problem with me, personally, having to produce something besides solos and roleplays with others. It's where I would have to go to others in order to get those three commissions (which are stated to be "sketches or pictures", which seems to block out food art, poetry, flower arranging, hedge trimming, etc) from outside artists that I become uncomfortable.
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:10 pm
That's a totally fair point romeo and understandable, especially if you've had bad experiences in the past and have reason to doubt/be uncomfortable.
*points above* I suggested the outside art be optional but still count for something - and I weighted it less in my revised model to account for your opinions but I don't think art should be removed entirely. Kept as an option - yes - but not made a requirement.
What do you think? =D?
Anyone have any feedback on my proposals? As much as I think discussion's great there should also be direction and I'm totally willing to put my ideas on the target for people to critique/opine about. I personally favor the 30/100/200, as I've stated, but if people desire the 30/80/180 system... I can also adjust my proposed values for the flexibility options to preserve the difficulty of obtaining the Deity since it's really only 20 points difference between my preference and the currently proposed system.
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:20 pm
Not of much use but I really like the Works of Glory and think they should stay. :3
And you can always use Gaia Gold instead of RL money, for the outside commission stuff.
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 12:05 am
I think having it as an option is completely reasonable, and being able to get growth points for it makes sense because it can inspire a lot of stuff and like someone said, that could inspire people giving art in hopes of getting it, which is a cycle that everyone benefits from. I tend towards the 30/100/200 version, but I don't have an edel at this time so I should probably defer to others @ __ @
Vesale, my problem isn't with the Works of Glory requirement (which I understand to be works produced by your own self for your own god). It's with the outside commission part, and I addressed the gaia gold option also--getting gaia gold to spend is also a huge time sink. You get perhaps 100 gold at max per post (last time I looked at the little wandering gold thing your first post per day was 100 gold anyway), and not a lot of people have the time to do that. When commissions in the R/C are regularly 100k-1.5mil for a bust shot, that's also kind of unreasonable. Even if every post was 100 gold, it'd be one thousand posts before they could start affording the 100k pieces in the R/C.
An interested party could also trawl art freebies, but that's not reliable and totally dependent upon the artist's whimsy (as it should be, since it's free). They could do art trades, but what if they can't draw or don't have a skill that others would trade art for? They could depend upon the largesse of their friends, but that's not in any way certain, and dedication to a community might not result in a payoff in their outside commission requirements. Nor should that be something someone has to rely on.
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 12:21 am
Bad wording on my part. XD; the first sentence was in reply/aggrement with everyone else about it. Second sentence was a suggestion, but a poor one since you said you'd already addressed it. I should backread more thoroughly. :3
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 12:51 am
Oh, sorry! D8 I didn't mean to jump down your throat 8( sorry!
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 1:10 am
Haha it's fine! And reading what you've written I definitely agree that the commission stuff should be an optional thing. :3
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 5:20 am
If anybody wants to play around with my model, let me know!
I added a 'where do I stand' feature because I can't sleep that takes your current counts (which you have to do yourself) and translates that into 'work remaining' and what kinds of work you can do to achieve that.
I'll e-mail the excel file to anyone interested with an explanation of how to use it as well =3
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:38 pm
I have a frew questions:
Are these tally rules now in effect? If not, how long will this be batted about for discussion, most likely?
How do we deal with long-ago unfinished rps? (Tally them as is, wrap them up briefly and tally them, leave them alone and they are not counted?)
Since we tally them ourselves, how do we ask for growth, and do we need to provide proof? (Key for me, since I messed up and misunderstood the tallying previously.)
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Posted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:58 pm
I did have a possible suggestion to make, with regards to the solo count, where a solo cannot count for more than 2 points, with a minimum of 500 words, and with no maximum as far as I can tell.
It seems a bit silly to me, to write say a 2200 word solo, and have it count for just 2 solos, when you can split it up into 4 550 word solos, giving you two more points to count towards your tally.
I'm not saying that this would happen all the time, and you don't want to make points super easy to obtain, but I just thought I might make the point that perhaps the solos should be 500 for 1 point, then every 500 more is another point.
I don't know if that makes any sense. XD; Just putting it forward.
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:20 am
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:26 am
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:38 am
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