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| Will you ask a question? |
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22% |
[ 5 ] |
| No. |
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[ 3 ] |
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| Total Votes : 22 |
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 Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 1:12 am
dvn -camilla price- You guys can keep talking, but I do have a question. *hesitant to ask*
Why? Why do you believe all that? I know I'll probably get a million word answer, but I would still like to know. Christianity makes sence to me, and alot of other stuff about other religions doesn't make sence, to it only seems appropriet for me to be Christian. But there has to be a reason behind you wanting to be an athiest, doesn't there? If so, what reason? Or was it how you were raised? Or what? Priestley nailed it. I don't really see all the things you see in Christianity, so I don't see any reason to become a Christian. I've spent years now studying religions across the world, and even if I was going to believe in a God the Christian one is not the first one that comes to mind. I made the decision on my own, after doing my own research. My parents didn't pressure me at all, so it may be true that I didn't have a huge religious influence in my household. Still, I did consider it and it's not like my parents are against religion.
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Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 1:14 am
Priestley Lethkhar zz1000zz Lethkhar Sakura_Chan133 I have a question! -Raises Hand-
Ummm... well, this is kind of awkward, and I know I'm gonna get some super-long response or something... sweatdrop
Do you believe in an afterlife? If not, how can you live with like... no hope of a future after? Just, you die, that's it. If so, what kind of afterlife?
Sorry if I make no sense... sweatdrop When you die you die. Life is a whim of several trillion cells to all work together. When it eventually and inevitably breaks down, your "being" disappears. Your concious and subconcious mind cease to exist. I think it's hard to understand my perspective on death if you don't understand my perspective on life, first. But I'll try. You see, I don't think of the universe in terms of "me". The universe is one big thing, and "I" am literally a very small piece of it. When "I" die, the universe will still be here. This is the great measure of faith taken by most atheists that always astounds me. How so? I don't really see how believing that a body decomposes is taking a great measure of faith. Since "our universe" is a result of our senses, when our senses shut down, "our universe" shuts down as well. The only assumption I'm making is that my senses are correct, which I make in every belief I have.
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Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:23 pm
Lethkhar Priestley Lethkhar zz1000zz Lethkhar Sakura_Chan133 I have a question! -Raises Hand-
Ummm... well, this is kind of awkward, and I know I'm gonna get some super-long response or something... sweatdrop
Do you believe in an afterlife? If not, how can you live with like... no hope of a future after? Just, you die, that's it. If so, what kind of afterlife?
Sorry if I make no sense... sweatdrop When you die you die. Life is a whim of several trillion cells to all work together. When it eventually and inevitably breaks down, your "being" disappears. Your concious and subconcious mind cease to exist. I think it's hard to understand my perspective on death if you don't understand my perspective on life, first. But I'll try. You see, I don't think of the universe in terms of "me". The universe is one big thing, and "I" am literally a very small piece of it. When "I" die, the universe will still be here. This is the great measure of faith taken by most atheists that always astounds me. How so? I don't really see how believing that a body decomposes is taking a great measure of faith. Since "our universe" is a result of our senses, when our senses shut down, "our universe" shuts down as well. The only assumption I'm making is that my senses are correct, which I make in every belief I have.
My point was that, unless you die and come back to report your findings (assuming that you have sufficient awareness and ability to record them), you can't say for certain that's what happens. You may very well be correct, but the only way to prove it to at least ourselves is to die.
The most we can say for certain given the evidence we have is that the universe carries on while our experience of it comes to an end.
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Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 3:39 pm
I suppose that was a bad time for me to take a break. It seems there was a bit of confusion about my post. My comment about a "leap of faith" is in regards to the belief the universe continues after one's own death.
There is no basis for this belief, aside from faith. You can dismiss this as a form of solipsism if you wish, but it is remarkable how many "strong" atheists make this leap without realizing it.
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Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 5:58 pm
zz1000zz I suppose that was a bad time for me to take a break. It seems there was a bit of confusion about my post. My comment about a "leap of faith" is in regards to the belief the universe continues after one's own death. There is no basis for this belief, aside from faith. You can dismiss this as a form of solipsism if you wish, but it is remarkable how many "strong" atheists make this leap without realizing it.
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Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:20 pm
Priestley zz1000zz I suppose that was a bad time for me to take a break. It seems there was a bit of confusion about my post. My comment about a "leap of faith" is in regards to the belief the universe continues after one's own death. There is no basis for this belief, aside from faith. You can dismiss this as a form of solipsism if you wish, but it is remarkable how many "strong" atheists make this leap without realizing it. Whether something is "unreasonable" is a matter of opinion. I will not claim it is unreasonable to believe such, but it certainly requires faith. Of course, it is largely a matter of faith that even lets you consider those other "individuals" as equitable in this context.
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Posted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:02 pm
zz1000zz Priestley zz1000zz I suppose that was a bad time for me to take a break. It seems there was a bit of confusion about my post. My comment about a "leap of faith" is in regards to the belief the universe continues after one's own death. There is no basis for this belief, aside from faith. You can dismiss this as a form of solipsism if you wish, but it is remarkable how many "strong" atheists make this leap without realizing it. Whether something is "unreasonable" is a matter of opinion. I will not claim it is unreasonable to believe such, but it certainly requires faith. Of course, it is largely a matter of faith that even lets you consider those other "individuals" as equitable in this context.
Whether we cease to exist after death is another matter entirely.
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Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:38 am
Quote: No, it's not a matter of opinion. In this case, I mean unreasonable in the sense that it is not reasonable or rational to claim that the universe ceases to exist upon death. If it were the case, the first human death would have terminated the universe. It is proven time and time again that the death of an individual does not do this. Whether we cease to exist after death is another matter entirely. I think what zz1000zz is getting at is it takes faith to believe that other people are the same as you. Imagine life as a video game. When an NPC dies the game doesn't end, but when the player's character dies it does. That's the best analogy I can come up with. You have no way of knowing whether other people are other players or if they are just NPCs in your game. zz1000zz, am I talking crazy or do I get it?
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Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 12:19 pm
Citrus Sunrise Quote: No, it's not a matter of opinion. In this case, I mean unreasonable in the sense that it is not reasonable or rational to claim that the universe ceases to exist upon death. If it were the case, the first human death would have terminated the universe. It is proven time and time again that the death of an individual does not do this. Whether we cease to exist after death is another matter entirely. I think what zz1000zz is getting at is it takes faith to believe that other people are the same as you. Imagine life as a video game. When an NPC dies the game doesn't end, but when the player's character dies it does. That's the best analogy I can come up with. You have no way of knowing whether other people are other players or if they are just NPCs in your game. zz1000zz, am I talking crazy or do I get it?
But, the trouble is that it supports the idea that the universe was created for me and me alone, or for her and her alone, or for any particular individual and the rest of us are bit players. Is it not more plausible that the universe exists for everyone and isn't created solely for one?
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Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:28 pm
Citrus Sunrise Quote: No, it's not a matter of opinion. In this case, I mean unreasonable in the sense that it is not reasonable or rational to claim that the universe ceases to exist upon death. If it were the case, the first human death would have terminated the universe. It is proven time and time again that the death of an individual does not do this. Whether we cease to exist after death is another matter entirely. I think what zz1000zz is getting at is it takes faith to believe that other people are the same as you. Imagine life as a video game. When an NPC dies the game doesn't end, but when the player's character dies it does. That's the best analogy I can come up with. You have no way of knowing whether other people are other players or if they are just NPCs in your game. zz1000zz, am I talking crazy or do I get it? You get it. Priestly But, the trouble is that it supports the idea that the universe was created for me and me alone, or for her and her alone, or for any particular individual and the rest of us are bit players. Is it not more plausible that the universe exists for everyone and isn't created solely for one? No on both accounts. First, my "position" does not support the idea the universe was created for me alone. My "position" states there is no way to know such is not the case. Second, it is not "more plausible" the universe exists for everyone. There is no basis for saying such is true, (nor arguably is there any basis for saying it is not). There is no way of knowing the "truth" in this case, so any "knowledge" is based upon faith.
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Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:32 pm
zz1000zz Citrus Sunrise Quote: No, it's not a matter of opinion. In this case, I mean unreasonable in the sense that it is not reasonable or rational to claim that the universe ceases to exist upon death. If it were the case, the first human death would have terminated the universe. It is proven time and time again that the death of an individual does not do this. Whether we cease to exist after death is another matter entirely. I think what zz1000zz is getting at is it takes faith to believe that other people are the same as you. Imagine life as a video game. When an NPC dies the game doesn't end, but when the player's character dies it does. That's the best analogy I can come up with. You have no way of knowing whether other people are other players or if they are just NPCs in your game. zz1000zz, am I talking crazy or do I get it? You get it. Priestly But, the trouble is that it supports the idea that the universe was created for me and me alone, or for her and her alone, or for any particular individual and the rest of us are bit players. Is it not more plausible that the universe exists for everyone and isn't created solely for one? No on both accounts. First, my "position" does not support the idea the universe was created for me alone. My "position" states there is no way to know such is not the case. zz1000zz Second, it is not "more plausible" the universe exists for everyone. There is no basis for saying such is true, (nor arguably is there any basis for saying it is not). There is no way of knowing the "truth" in this case, so any "knowledge" is based upon faith.
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:27 am
Priestley zz1000zz Citrus Sunrise Quote: No, it's not a matter of opinion. In this case, I mean unreasonable in the sense that it is not reasonable or rational to claim that the universe ceases to exist upon death. If it were the case, the first human death would have terminated the universe. It is proven time and time again that the death of an individual does not do this. Whether we cease to exist after death is another matter entirely. I think what zz1000zz is getting at is it takes faith to believe that other people are the same as you. Imagine life as a video game. When an NPC dies the game doesn't end, but when the player's character dies it does. That's the best analogy I can come up with. You have no way of knowing whether other people are other players or if they are just NPCs in your game. zz1000zz, am I talking crazy or do I get it? You get it. Priestly But, the trouble is that it supports the idea that the universe was created for me and me alone, or for her and her alone, or for any particular individual and the rest of us are bit players. Is it not more plausible that the universe exists for everyone and isn't created solely for one? No on both accounts. First, my "position" does not support the idea the universe was created for me alone. My "position" states there is no way to know such is not the case. I did not quote the word, I used quotation marks to indicate unusual usage of the term. I would rather you stop telling me to not do what I am not doing. Priestly zz1000zz Second, it is not "more plausible" the universe exists for everyone. There is no basis for saying such is true, (nor arguably is there any basis for saying it is not). There is no way of knowing the "truth" in this case, so any "knowledge" is based upon faith. You cannot know we are both the same. You may assume such is the case, but that is still just an assumption, a leap of faith.
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 9:12 am
zz1000zz Priestley zz1000zz Citrus Sunrise Quote: No, it's not a matter of opinion. In this case, I mean unreasonable in the sense that it is not reasonable or rational to claim that the universe ceases to exist upon death. If it were the case, the first human death would have terminated the universe. It is proven time and time again that the death of an individual does not do this. Whether we cease to exist after death is another matter entirely. I think what zz1000zz is getting at is it takes faith to believe that other people are the same as you. Imagine life as a video game. When an NPC dies the game doesn't end, but when the player's character dies it does. That's the best analogy I can come up with. You have no way of knowing whether other people are other players or if they are just NPCs in your game. zz1000zz, am I talking crazy or do I get it? You get it. Priestly But, the trouble is that it supports the idea that the universe was created for me and me alone, or for her and her alone, or for any particular individual and the rest of us are bit players. Is it not more plausible that the universe exists for everyone and isn't created solely for one? No on both accounts. First, my "position" does not support the idea the universe was created for me alone. My "position" states there is no way to know such is not the case. I did not quote the word, I used quotation marks to indicate unusual usage of the term. I would rather you stop telling me to not do what I am not doing. zz1000zz Priestley zz1000zz Second, it is not "more plausible" the universe exists for everyone. There is no basis for saying such is true, (nor arguably is there any basis for saying it is not). There is no way of knowing the "truth" in this case, so any "knowledge" is based upon faith. You cannot know we are both the same. You may assume such is the case, but that is still just an assumption, a leap of faith.
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:09 pm
Priestley zz1000zz You cannot know we are both the same. You may assume such is the case, but that is still just an assumption, a leap of faith. Not that this is even slightly relevant, but feel free to ask "the appropriate professionals." Make sure you ask them to explain the nature of human consciousness, and then have them provide proof it is the same for both of us, as well as every other human. I will promptly dismiss the entire exchange as irrelevant, as would anyone with the simplest knowledge of solipsism, but the responses you get should at least be amusing.
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:34 pm
zz1000zz Priestley zz1000zz You cannot know we are both the same. You may assume such is the case, but that is still just an assumption, a leap of faith. Not that this is even slightly relevant, but feel free to ask "the appropriate professionals." Make sure you ask them to explain the nature of human consciousness, and then have them provide proof it is the same for both of us, as well as every other human. I will promptly dismiss the entire exchange as irrelevant, as would anyone with the simplest knowledge of solipsism, but the responses you get should at least be amusing.
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