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I AM TOO LAZY TO READ ALL THIS STUFF so i read up to page three. if i repeat s**t that has already been said then i apologize, but you will have to deal. LET'S START THIS THING.

Art: Okay, whatevs. I'm happy with whatever you guys decide to do. I think having a few staff artists would be rad because it would help maintain a sense of community, which I believe someone said earlier in the thread. Ultimately art does not concern me as much as...

RP: This is a fine line people. Fa'e has seen some excellent and some absolutely shitty RP in its days as I'm sure any guardian or quester will be able to tell you. No Fa'e is excluded from either category. In the interest of keeping RP fresh, interesting, and most of all high-quality I balk at the notion of letting just anybody get a Fa'e. I don't think questers should just get a stamp of approval and then suddenly be allowed to acquire a Fa'e. That would be opening this community up to a world of pain, because what sounds good in theory may not always be good in practice. I also worry that having too many Fa'e would take all the magic out of the community and make it too confusing/chaotic. I think the appeal of the Fa'e as they are now is that they are all for the most part individuals - if you introduce too many new characters then there is bound to be characters with identical personalities, backgrounds, stories... There may be some superficial differences but seriously, this is what happens when a community grows too large. With growth there is also unwieldiness as well, and seriously this is already a pretty big RP community. If new Fa'e are to be introduced then I recommend patience and a conservative attitude - let them trickle in slowly rather than a sudden FLOOD of new Fa'e. I know everyone is eager to get their paws on a coveted wee baby, but seriously won't someone think of the children!? Or the lack thereof.

This may also be somewhat controversial but I'm also not comfortable with the notion of second gen babies getting passed out to whomever guardians decide to give them to because I feel like it's slightly unfair, and in some ways opens up the community to some potentially shitty writers with equally shitty concepts which will only serve to be dead weight. I haven't been comfortable with this idea from the start. However I can't think of a better system for distributing 2nd gens presently, so I don't know what else to say beyond just making my unease known.

So how do we introduce fresh blood? Well I ask you: what the hell is the problem with good old fashioned writing-based flatsales? Contests/events/etc. have all been covered and I think they're a great idea, but I also kind of like the idea of perhaps handing out pre-designed Fa'e. I know everyone wants their DREAM FA'E!!! and there would still be opportunities for them, but again I don't like the idea of this being such an open community where we all magically get what we want. I understand not everyone will be incredibly fond of the idea, but I think it could lead to some interesting things. For one thing it'll help to open up the "mythic pool" - introduce more obscure/different mythologies that maybe people were afraid to use or didn't know about. It could also help to prevent appearance and personality overlap since the babies would be predesigned and with designated personality traits. (Although obviously there would be room to expand and grow on both these things.) It's an idea that needs more thought/planning but frankly I think it'd be good for the community.

And I don't know if I'm the only one thinking this, but I feel as if several characters, including my own, would benefit greatly from a reboot of sorts. On a more personal level Dil's mythology bugs the ever-loving s**t out of me in how seriously terrible it is. If we're doing this for real then I want to be able to commit to something I have faith in, not Dil's ******** mythology. I feel like several other Fa'e should be "rebooted" as well.

Metaplot-y stuff: Pukio and Kochi, you guys are great but I am not at all comfortable with you guys taking the reins out of our hands entirely and coming up with something behind all our backs. Maybe it's because I've been gone for so long but I have no idea what the hell you guys have planned for the metaplot and if it's something you want people to be involved in then INVOLVE US. The element of surprise is great and grand and all that but frankly it's tough to pull off in the Breedables community and I think it's quite honestly stupid for you guys to be coy about it and not give us the opportunity to give our own input and ideas. Seriously guys, look at the metaplot that happened in Fa'e earlier. Sorry if this hurts any feelings but it was, in a word, awful. Beyond description. Only a handful of Fa'e were involved and it was hard to tell what was going on and I felt as if I had little input into the end result or the metaplot at all.

A metaplot effects all our characters, thus we should all have our own say and our own opportunity to contribute to it.

I might add more to this later when I think of it and sorry if this like somehow offends anyone or hurts any feelings or whatever, but maybe people are getting a little too wrapped up in the excitement of reviving Fa'e - which is super exciting! - and maybe not looking at things from perhaps a more longterm perspective. Unless people said all this s**t after page three, in which case ignore me biggrin .

I think a metaplot for the Fa'e has the potential for greatness - provided it's not a contrite piece of crap like it was previously. If we could establish a legitimate background for all the Fa'e that sort of explains their existence then I think it could be super interesting and engaging. I realize that the metaplot has dragged on but I suggest throwing all the crap that happened in the past out the window since it's so irrelevant and really only effected a small percentage of the cast. I say make a new one from scratch. Why fix something that's broken when you can make something newer, shinier, and ten times better?

I agree with a lot of Puchi's points about bringing in too many Fa'e or otherwise. It really is important to keep high standards in the shop. Both pre-made Fa'e and "rebooting" old Fa'e sounds good too. I mean, there's a lot of potential there for bringing in neglected myths that could really use some exposure. But then again, if I were questing, it's true that I'd be more inclined to try and get my "dream Fa'e" rather than a pre-made one. What are everyone's thoughts on pre-mades?

I don't know anything about the metaplot really, so I'll let that lie. I do know the first one was pretty groan-worthy though, at least that's what some Guardians told me. I don't mind whether Kochi/Pukio do something as a surprise or if everyone does at once.

I do admit I want to see some of Airi. I haven't gotten a chance to and it'd be great to get her back out there.

Maybe a "reboot" of some Fa'e could be tied into the metaplot. (A random thought?)

What do you oldbies think about getting some teams together to oversee various parts of Fa'e? Do you think it should be one person, or several groups of people, etc.? That's one of our priorities right now, because there are so many areas to be worked on, including art.

Yeah, sorry, I appreciate your opinion and whatnot, but this metaplot stuff is already practically finished. It's not coyness or us doing anything behind everyones backs like some dastardly deed. This has been in the works for a hell of a long time now, and we've been doing it when nobody gave a s**t about fa'e, and we did. So we planned and plotted with Sosi to come up with something fun and that would clean up all the loose ends. I really appreciate your opinion, but I'll be ridiculously unhappy if the metaplot stuff comes up for opinions and discussion.

And I'm not sure I'm cool with rebooting a bunch of the fa'e/PRETTYMUCH ditching the entire fa'e plot, which is Airi/Conrad/Chaos. That'd be like making a new shop.

As Sosi said, the metaplot does not need to be adressed at this time, and I'd appreciate it if that was respected.

Maybe, unrelated to Kochi and Pukio's work at the moment, there could be some offshoot of Airi at some point. If she was falling ill previously, maybe a short of other-self could be created by her somehow. That way we wouldn't have to play Airi, since it's true she really is Anya's character and nobody would want someone just taking over theirs. I'm not sure how it could work, but maybe Airi could sort of reserve a part of herself just in case she gets too drained, and this could be another, lesser being, while Airi is missing? Just a random thought. I'm not sure. Puchi's right that it wouldn't be cool if we play someone's character, but also as Chiri says, Airi is pretty essential to the shop. Maybe we could play the Airi/Chaos/Conrad set-up (again this would have to be later, not touching Kochi's/Oukio's work) in a different way. There could be lesser characters in league with them, etc., just random ideas.

Yeah, exactly what we had in mind Puchi. We were thinking about the teams and how many per team and stuff; I was thinking three was a good number too.

I emailed Sosi earlier today to ask her to come into this thread and let us know what she thinks about all this. We need oldbies in here too; you guys know way more than some of us.

I think what was meant about "rebooting" Fa'e wouldn't, yeah, mean taking them back to their first stages necessarily, but a way for Guardians to sort of rework their characters if need be. I know I've been in that position before, make a character and think it's awesome as hell, then a year later I'm like wtf this doesn't even make any sense nor is it awesome, and want to just wipe the slate while keeping the character. It would have to be on a Fa'e-by-Fa'e basis, and I'm not really sure of the details it would incorporate, but there's a few options. Maybe these Fa'e could lose their memories, could have something happen like a quest go wrong or something... Again just random ideas I'm throwing out here. It'd be good to have an avenue for older Guardians to do some tinkering with their characters if we want some to be able to return and be invested in the shop. As Chiri brought up there's stuff like Callix that could happen... I'm not sure how to do it, but I think it's a valid point. It's been years since some of these guys have been created.

/agree with everything Cerena said.

Kochi, I realize that you guys have been working hard on the metaplot and I think that's awesome, and I appreciate that you guys picked up slack when nobody else was. Then again nobody ever asked you guys to, just like nobody asked any of the other guardians. And as far as I can tell you guys never asked any of the other guardians to help out either. Showing initiative like that reflects really well on you, but it's not a particularly good reason to exclude other guardians from being involved in the planning stages. But whatever, I've said my piece. So long as this stuff gets wrapped up and it has relatively little impact on my character I'll be happy.

To explain the reboot idea: I do not, in any way, have a desire to alter Dil or even send him back to a previous stage. The only thing I am dissatisfied with as far as Dil concerned is his mythic background, and that's all that needs to be changed. I know a lot of other guardians would probably agree with me, especially ones who have adopted Fa'e with already established "WTF?" backgrounds. (I've seen Chiri chiming in, for example.) This isn't meant to give me a new Fa'e by any means, it's just to help me establish his background as something legitimate and uh, less... embarrassing. 8D.

OMG, a Puchi! ********, please let Puchi do whatever she wants to regain a desire for RPing Dil, cos god I miss him like crazy, and I think Roth and I both need Puchi/Dil around to smack us out of pussyfooting around and do some goddamn EVIL. Or something.

Imisspuchimkay?

Regarding Airi, I wouldn't feel comfortable with anyone else taking her over. Maybe, as someone in the past page suggested, an offshoot of Airi? Like part of her is reborn to combat her sickness. Which could, in turn, has some side effects on fa'e (that wanted it) and cause them some reworking to previous stages or changed/altered mythos? Or even just giving them complete amnesia, if that's what Guardians want.

I think there's potential in letting some of the Fa'e be reworked, just like there's potential in letting people create a new Guardian for the upcoming metaplot. It just needs to be done smartly, that's all.

Not that I think I'd do anything to Roth, even if we could. As much as I look back on some past events and hate what happened, so much of what I classify as "bad" was driven by RL/OOC things that I personally had no control over. The only stage of his I would even consider re-doing is Youth - which he's currently still at, so I can just move him in the direction I want before worrying about growing to Adult.

But for some others, its not so easy. Particularly, those who are not the first Guardian a Fa'e has had. They may feel they need some reworking in order to make the fa'e more "theirs", or just to clarify things that are starting to conflict with past history, etc.


Abandoning metaplot entirely and heading to the issue of 2nd gens... This is a really slippery slope. It's one thing to say you don't like who someone else is giving their baby to, but would you really want others to block your wishes if it was your fa'e/baby that you were trying to give away? We're opening ourselves to personal bias here - existing guardians who don't like a certain person or myth, despite not breaking any of the rules... I think if we're as careful as we can be about the contests/events we have to let in new Guardians, then other shouldn't really get a say in giving away the 2nd gen babies. Two people are sacrificing their Fa'e's chance at Ancienthood here - or at least, halving their chances. No one else gets the penalty, so why should they get a say on where the baby goes?

At least, that's what I consider fair. Even though I hate a bad RPer as much as the next Guardian, I think we need to trust that other Guardians are making the choices that they feel are right for them and their fa'e. In the end, they're the ones who (hopefully) will spending the most time RPing their fa'e family together.

Don't worry about that, Akina. Got it covered. *thumbs up*

As for the rest, I don't really think it was practical before because all the fa'e were kids.

But now? Now it's an awesome idea. Because jesus, its a bunch of gods in Gaia. They need some organization. To maybe elect a mayor/leader, or appoint a sheriff and stuff. Oh man. An election and stuff would rock. Maybe instead of the HQ they buy an apartment building and all live in it and theres a janitor or or.

Oh. Getting ahead of myself. Anyways, I completely agree that there should be some IC internal organization. Has anyone ever read Fables and are familiar with Fabletown? Something like that, maybe. (Well, except on a far lesser scale.)