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 Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:03 am
Welcome to my world, the world where everything you do at any given moment get's questioned. I've had it like that since day 1. I've never been able to relax and Roleplay. Kye uses ninjutsu without using anything more than her mind. That is broken. She needs no use of handsigns nor incantation. I never once said that you abused it, but I'd also like to point out that Kye has never been in a battle situation. She mostly just walks around and talks to Yasashii. So of course there isn't a moment where you might have abused it. You've given a loaded question where you can only receive the answer you want. No, it isn't. Could I have Raphael be allowed to use Shadow techniques without incantation or hand signs? Hell no. Hinote wouldn't allow it. Could Luo have his character do the same with Suiton? No. Could any other member be ever allowed to do what Kye does? No. not as long as Hinote holds his position over Custom Talents. Even if you can regulate your character's power in rp, the thought itself is broken. Rules apply to everyone, NOT just people who can't regulate themselves. If Hinote says that he doesn't want someone of Kye's abilities within the guild, then there shouldn't be anyone like that. I couldn't give two ( Insert word of choice here ) about your reputation. To me you're just another member. YOu've got everyone listening to your every word because you can make pretty posts, or you're awesome at roleplaying. Not me, I couldn't care less if with a D rank bare bones shinobi you could kill my S rank if I was ever allowed to have one. Your idea of auto-casting is broken. RULES are there to govern all, not just a select many. Know what else applied to a group of people? The Jim Crow Laws, Black Codes, Segregation Laws, call them what you will. Your line of thinking is that you're above everyone else, when you aren't. You might be better, or more skilled, but you are in no way, shape, or form given more rights than any other human being. Thinking like that is just conceited and narcissistic. Even so, You're breaking rules simply by having it. It's like taking a gun into a school. " I didn't shoot anyone with it! " It is still illegal to have on the school grounds and you could have a felony for it. THAT is the exact defense you just used. I have minimal respect for you because you talked down to me in our initial meeting. But my respect for you is fleeting because you can't even see that you're using a broken object. If you got bored, or if you started to lose, what chance would anyone have when you can simply use a kill shot and kill anyone? If you've got the power to abuse, at one point or another, you're going to use it. Whether you're backed into a corner, or you're simply getting bored. I'm not nit picking, I'm pointing out the obvious. You're given much too much freedom simply because people believe you can police things yourself. You aren't crew, and if you get promoted, you'll just disappear for a couple of months and get demoted again. ( I know you're married, and I know you've got a life. But please don't misconstrue what I'm saying as anything less than you've got a life, and it gets in the way occasionally. ) If you want broken ideas to be allowed, then by all means please, join NUR, I hear they love that sort of thing. But leave them out of PotS, this place DOES employ Logic and Reasoning. It isn't a place where Broken Magnetos can waltz right in and start laying back, being all secretive until they need to kill something. It isn't a place where just because your legs are fast means your arms are fast. Yes, Ninja magic exists here, but there is ALWAYS a reason behind it. Yours given no reason other than because you said so. Kye is broken as her talent is now. It is immensely salvagable, make her have to say something, make a limit to what she can absent mindedly do, make it so that she has to at least look where she is manipulating, hell change her name to Magneto and let her just do body motions. I don't care, but the power is Broken.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:19 pm
Alright, this is starting to get out of hand. Cobra, TvIm, Hinote (I know you didn't say anything yet, its just preemptive), this debate is over.
You both have valid points, but now you're letting your anger seep through, consciously or not, and that's not going to accomplish anything of value.
Given hinote's declaration of wanting to make all S rank jutsu require seals (a worthy goal), the validity of Kye's talent will be reevaluated. However, given her weakness, it will not simply be nerfed to hell. End of discussion until reevaluation.
Now please, Luo, I believe it was your turn for rebuttal against Cobra's latest points.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:43 pm
You want to know why I'm trusted with my customs and why people take a look at Kye and don't normally question if her talent is broken... because they know me. I'm not trying to be arrogant here, but I'm a good RPer. I have a reputation for being a good RPer... one that has been earned through my years of RPing with people responsibly.
You may not care about my reputation, but it speaks to who I am as an RPer. I've proven myself multiple times over to be a good RPer. You may think of me as nothing more then just another member, but you're leaving out large portions of who I am when you don't account for my experience and skill.
I'm not saying that I'm better then others... I'm just saying that I've proven myself to be a good RPer... and all of my experience should count for something in terms of what I'm trusted with. You don't hand the company credit card to an employee you hired two days ago, but when you have a senior employee who has proven himself for 5 years to be trustworthy, you hand it over and know you won't be bankrupt the next day.
You've just about called me every name in the book... Conceited, Narcissistic, Untrustworthy, a Liar, and a Cheater... and I really don't appreciate it. Your comment about the Jim Crow Laws likens me to a White Slave Oppressor, which is INCREDIBLY OFFENSIVE.
You inserted yourself into a conversation that had nothing to do with you and have offended me at multiple levels and even gone as far to call Hinote untrustworthy and bias in all of his approvals. If only you can see the number of things he has DENIED in the process of creating the final products he has approved.
If you think that softly spoken incantations would make's Kye's ability more 'balanced' then I think you're seriously confused about what balance in an RP is. That part was added in because Kye's entire backstory revolves around others not knowing who she is, or that she is a ninja. need I point out that you're again, looking at all the benefits without examining the negative aspect of the talent... she only has one arm. Do you have any idea what that does to her in a fight? Just role-playing getting victims out of a building was difficult for an S-rank because I had to do things in a way so as not to blatantly reveal who she was to Natsu.
You can say whatever you want... but what I just mentioned is a character designed talent which has been fully integrated into the character's personality, which dictates how I role play her. That's how you roleplay a character properly... and that's why that custom talent works for Kye and not for others... because Luo and Raphael have both of their arms... and everyone knows that they are ninja... and they are open about it.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:02 pm
Gregar828 Now please, Luo, I believe it was your turn for rebuttal against Cobra's latest points.
What?... the Fight? Well, that'll continue once we approve everything again.I still can't believe we're making this big of a mess about a fight which we have already all agreed we know the answer to. *Spoiler Alert* Jishaku dies and after some time a new arc will be created.
This is killing the RP, not to mention my will to RP.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:12 pm
Cobra_X Gregar828 Now please, Luo, I believe it was your turn for rebuttal against Cobra's latest points.
What?... the Fight? Well, that'll continue once we approve everything again.I still can't believe we're making this big of a mess about a fight which we have already all agreed we know the answer to. *Spoiler Alert* Jishaku dies and after some time a new arc will be created.
This is killing the RP, not to mention my will to RP.Hey, YOU had the problem with Luo's post, YOU called Luo out on his character, and from what I can tell, Luo has not had a chance to respond to your latest post regarding the issue. I think that redirecting the chatroom back to that is a better use of time than continuing the fight while you guys are apparently still in disagreement regarding the posts.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:20 pm
I'm just saying that if Luo took the hit, or responded to my attack in a way which didn't seek to negate or rewind my post, I would have gladly responded.
Honestly, I could take the hit and still make an attack... I just don't like the principle it sets to allow him to rewind my post so all of my work in making the post/attack amount to nothing.
But I'm sorry... I'll stop arguing and just let people post. I'm done making arguments anymore. Whatever Luo's next response is, i'll just react accordingly, even if it means I have to re-do my post. Arguing about it isn't getting us anywhere and it's just making me more and more upset.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:35 pm
Cobra, I'm going to say this in short sentences. That's all well and good, but reputation shouldn't get you perks like being allowed a broken power. I am accounting for that, I just don't think it matters. The president still has to obey basic laws, when they don't we have things like Watergate happening left and right. ( Kind of a run on sentence, but oh well. ) No, you ARE saying you're better than others. Quote: Rules are there to prevent people who can't control or balance themselves appropriately in an RP. Show me where I haven't done that with Kye, and then you might have a point. It is indirect, but you JUST said that rules don't apply to you, because you claim to be in control of your character's balance. ( More than one sentence, I'm sorry. ) I've called you Conceited and narcissistic, not untrustworthy, not a liar, and not a cheater. I've only called you those two. I AM saying you're in possession of things that shouldn't be within the guild. Thank you for pointing out that you thought I was calling you those things. I'm sure I've clarified that I've only called you two of those things you've listed. As for the comment on the laws I referenced, It wasn't a shot at you, and they came about AFTER Freedom, but that is irrelevant. I'm saying the way you desrcibed it, the rules didn't apply to you. Those rules didn't apply to those that people believed to be superior ( They were horribly wrong might I place. ) and that is what I was referring to. I thought that analogies like that would have been simple. ( Hooray for not short concise sentences, I couldn't condense it anymore than this, I'm sorry Cobra. ) I've inserted myself in the coversation vbecause you all can't come to a point, and it has engulfed all the activity in the entire guild. It DOES involve me as a member of the guild. Also, I didn't call hinote untrustworthy, thanks for putting words into it. I said he lied, but he might have simply overlooked that he approved something he said he'd never allow. I said he was biased, I'll admit that. You and Hinote are good friends, but when we stop and think about it, some of the crew has a problem with the Konaga bloodline ( As a member myself included. ) Then, he DID approve something that he said he never would concerning your rpc. Evidence points to him being Bias, and approving things for you. I trust Hinote, I really do, but when I look at the things he's approved for you, it seems a tad bit off to me. We have the rule that friends can not approve another friend's customs for a reason. I'm asking that that rule be used, and your customs be reviewed. If you don't think your customs are broken, then you have absolutely nothing to fear. ( I don't think I'm even trying at this point... I'm sorry. ) Not Softly, that is idiotic. You'd have to state it, in a normal tone, just like anyone else. Very few people note that they mutter jutsu names in the actual rp. Also, the weakness was pre-existing. If I remember, Gregar asked if you realized that you were making a one armed character, and you said it was fine, thus you should not have been allowed to use it as a weakness. As far as her hiding who she is from everyone, not even close to relevant. You decided that she would be played that way, don't go saying it is a weakness, since it isn't. I can... type with... ellipses... too... It isn't very becoming of someone who claims to be a good Role player though. Sorry about that shot, I just couldn't stand to have you talking down to me yet again. The custom talent is integrated only because you made it so. It is a broken talent, if it had a limit, then it would be better. Alas, it doesn't. I'm sorry that you feel that I'm being unfair, but it shouldn't exist, at least not without limits on what is and isn't auto-cast-able. @ Greg Sorry about that, but it needed to be said. If any of the crew believes I deserve an ougun, I'll accept it willingly.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:32 pm
Well... I truly love coming in from a day of work to find myself slandered... That's... Great.
So, ignoring all of that so that I don't manage to get myself worked up into the same nonsensical rage as you guys apparently have, I shall simply say this.
Shut up. All of you. I've asked Hikaro to step in here when she has the time and moderate the debate, and make a judgement on what needs to be done to move forward, whether that be Luo editing his post, Or Cobra dropping dead and exploding into string cheese, as some people appear to want. But until she has come in, the only posts on this topic I want to see here are between Cobra and Luo, on the matter of the edits requested.
We are all above this childish bickering, and I must say, I'm a bit tired of seeing it. It is killing my desire to even look at POTS, because I don't want to deal with yet another pointless argument. So please, lay off, and behave like adults.
And as a final note, Luo actually does have the ability you said he wouldn't be allowed. It's built right into his bloodline. It's actually one of the main benefits.
Edit: @Timmy: If you truly feel the incredible need to continue with your initial topic (Where you state that I am a blatant liar and biased judge.), you may create a dedicated topic in the debate forum and I will address your concerns. However, given the rather inflammatory nature of your initial post, I will most likely not be kind.
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:28 pm
Blatant: So you're ignoring the fact I said you might have forgotten you approved it. Biased: Would you have approved it for any of the common members of the guild? No, of course you wouldn't have. You approved it because you believe Cobra is responsible, and trustworthy. This doesn't negate the fact it is against the rules. So yeah, perhaps you are a little Biased.
As for how you perceived my post as inflammatory against you, I'm sorry but that was not my goal. I have a bit of a problem putting jokes into things, so the reference of Magneto was purely for mine and whoever else read it's enjoyment. Just like how you commonly speak down to me when you explain something I make comical references and jokes.
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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:04 pm
If you wish to continue this, as I said, make a new topic.
And as my response to both of your statements, no, all three of your statements, read your post again.
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:55 am
I am re-posting this just so Luo doesn't have to search for it.
Also, I'd like to apologize for spamming the thread. I have deep disagreements with many of the statements made, but I can see that multiple people are unhappy with several aspects of my customs, etc. As such, I have done the following:
- Hinote and I are re-evaluating the Konaga Augmentations and making adjustments to increase the stamina drain for progressive use.
- I have re-submitted Shinji's talent with a few edits.
- I have also sent a correction about Satetsu ninjutsu which if added to the bloodline, will make it clear that Hand Seals are required for all techniques.
- I do not believe that Kye's talent needs editing, but I have re-posted it so it can be easily evaluated on the last page of the custom talent thread.Im sorry that I used such harsh tone in my arguments, you're right, you don't deserve to be talked to in that way and I apologize.
Allow me to say that the part about appearing behind you was a misunderstanding on my part. I thought that David had created a platform of sand over the entire pit, so going behind you would have been possible. I have edited my post/attack position accordingly.
However, as to your point on the hand seals, and I have mentioned this to you several times... I will admit that the use of hand seals is not specified... but as Hinote mentioned, this should not indicate that they are not needed, quite the opposite really.
Just to reiterate... I am officially telling you that you NEED hand seals to use that jutsu. That is simply the way it is. You can not execute that technique before Shinji gets to you... and honestly, in fairness to me and my post, you should really just respond to my attack without assuming you have time for another technique. That's how I feel.
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Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:45 am
What is the approvability of a talent which allows a character to utilize Kuchiyose technique in it's forward and reverse forms in conjunction with a Shadowy Gateway technique for extremely rapid movement? ( Kinda like the Assassin's Shadow walking technique, but on a much larger scale. )
Or would that constitute as a custom ninjutsu for the Nara clan itself?
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:14 am
I have almost no idea what you just said, so I'm going to assume... Teleportation? If so, none. Teleportation in combat is just so easily abused, that we've made an effort over the years to exclude it from the guild entirely.
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Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:12 am
Never in combat!
It would be only as a means of travelling quickly from place to place, not possible in combat. While the gate only allows one person through, the fact that you're having to dodge things and set up a rift in space and time using shadows, it would be impossible to do so in combat. The Talent wouldn't be possible until he got the Space and time benefit as an A rank.
EDIT:
Teleporting in combat is as broken as it gets. Isn't that why we removed the Kawarimi technique?
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Hinote Tosatsu Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:25 pm
Yes it is.
Why would you want a non-combat teleportation talent? I mean, there's plenty of rapid transport jutsu already, and you might even be able to push a summoning based custom jutsu past Greg with the same basic idea. But all things considered, outside of combat it's really not worth wasting a talent on, with so many other ways to do it. All you're really doing is removing a few traveling posts.
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