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I know I'm not a moderator or anything, but I don't think we're allowed to have abortion debates in Fire Fall.

ARGUMENTS WE DON'T WANT TO SEE AGAIN

Evolution vs. Creationism:
We see the same arguments over and over in this particular debate. Most of them have been addressed in the Talk Origins FAQ. Please refer to the FAQ before starting any threads on the topic. If your particular question or argument is not addressed there, then feel free to start a thread on the subject.

Homosexuality and Christianity:
Again, we see the same arguments over and over again. Most (if not all) of these have been addressed in The Thesis by Ananel. Please read over The Thesis carefully before starting any thread on the subject. If your particular argument or question is not addressed by The Thesis, then starting a thread would not be out of order.

Catholics (and Mormons, Adventists and other sects):
Do not start any threads arguing for or against the correctness in interpretation and belief of one sect over another. Such threads will be locked and the OP will be warned. Subsequent violations will resulting in the violator being banned from the guild.

Here's my shot at a secular arguement.

The fetus falls under all scientific classifications for life. It consumes sustinance, it grows, it has the capacity to reproduce (at least, the same capacity for any pre-pubescent animal), and has the capacity to 'think' (in the same way animals can, albeit).

There's a few more, but I seem to have forgotten them right now.

I admit, the exact point where a non-person becomes a person is a very sticky subject, but abortions tend to be done far before the fetus enters a grey area.

I disagree with you completally. First off when God was talking to moses he was talking about the women who had sex outside the security of marriage, which is Strictly forbidden In the Bible, and the punishment back then was to be stoned to death. As far as the samaritans there is probabally some reason that they are being ripped up. Instead of taking only certain verses look at the entire context of the verse. The Bible does clearly state in case im mistaken that Murder is wrong...the definiton of murder is the taking of someones life...whether you want to believe it or not and whether the government wants to believe it or not The BABY NOT FETUS is alive at conception and CAN FEEL PAIN

Since this is a rather secular argument, I think I'll address this one.

The question is not whether or not the fetus is living. Plenty of things are living. Muscles are living.

And the question is not whether or not the fetus thinks. Plenty of things think. Mice think.

And the question is not whether or not the fetus has a will to live. Plenty of things have a will to live. Cows have a will to live.

But all of these things can be killed, legally and ethically, without too much of a problem. So your reasons for preserving the life of the fetus obviously do not apply, since the same reasons could apply to other beings which we have no problem killing.

by "potentiation" u r refering to physiological action, correct?... just making sure i understand wut u're saying(don't know how soon i can respond to wutever u say cuz i'm still waiting for the mission's trip ppl to call back)

Long-term memory (LTM) is memory that can last as little as 30 seconds or as long as decades. It differs structurally and functionally from working memory or short-term memory, which ostensibly stores items for only around 30 seconds. Biologically, short-term memory is a temporary potentiation of neural connections that can become long-term memory through the process of rehearsal and meaningful association. The proposed mechanism by which short-term memories move into LTM storage is via long-term potentiation, which leads to a physical change in the structure of neurons. Notably, the time scale involved at each level of memory processing remains under investigation.

i would talk more, but i just got a phone call and have to gather information about some references for a mission's trip... i'll be back in about an hour and 45 minutes... somewhere in there

Wait, how the deuce does a fetus have the "likelihood", but not an egg and a sperm?

And if the mother plans on having an abortion, doesn't that mean that the "likelihood" of the fetus becoming a human is greatly reduced, disqualifying it from its rights as a human?