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 Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:55 pm
Tenshi no Hana-chan
I've always just thought that Karin looks like Sasuke, but that's it. She's always seemed to me as a character whose history is not going to be delved into deeper - a tertiary character, if you may. So that alone blows the theory for me.!Pah!
Kishimoto give time to a tertiary female character? Blasphemy!
Sorry to interrupt, but I have to say that I'll be hella annoyed if he does decide to delve deeper into her past. He has hardly payed much attention to the females. Why is he starting now? (Not that I don't want him to start paying attention to females... I'm just being bitter because a few of my favorite females characters hardly recieved any limelight.)
Not to be mean, but if he does the most she should get is a brief description of some small bad incident she experienced when she was younger. Just to be fair, you know?
That is, of course, if she doesn't turn out to be Sasuke's relative or something.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 3:16 am
@KanaRenee: Now that you mentioned it, Sasuke does seem to relate to Juugo within a more human level. I suppose he can understand a part of what Juugo's going through, and on that level, they can communicate. In the team Sasuke's put together, the tandem of Sasuke and Juugo seems to be the one with the most sympathetic bond, just because of the curse the two share. And then there's the fact that Juugo's character flaws has strong ties with Naruto's and Sakura's. It'll be interesting to see more of Sasuke and Juugo's interaction in terms of this fact.
What I really want to see now (though I know this is way, way far off) is Team Kakashi's reaction to Juugo. I'm sure they'd want to help him any way possible. They're just Leaf ninja that way.
@C r a y o l a: I totally agree about Kishi's seeming sexism. He hardly gives the females any credit. I mean, yeah, at one point, there was a whole arc dedicated to Tsunade, but from there she's reduced to sitting behind a desk giving out missions, and not actually being "out there." I suppose that it's understandable, till we look at the second example.
Which is, of course, Sakura. We see her in one arc blowing her former weak self out of the water, and in the next arc, she's crying her heart out again without being able to at least show her strength in front of Sasuke, and in the arc after that, she arrives too late to fight. Where's the fairness in that?
Karin's past, in my opinion, will probably just involve how she was experimented on by Orochi, but it'll never come to any deeper than that.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:44 am
Tenshi no Hana-chan @KanaRenee: Now that you mentioned it, Sasuke does seem to relate to Juugo within a more human level. I suppose he can understand a part of what Juugo's going through, and on that level, they can communicate. In the team Sasuke's put together, the tandem of Sasuke and Juugo seems to be the one with the most sympathetic bond, just because of the curse the two share. And then there's the fact that Juugo's character flaws has strong ties with Naruto's and Sakura's. It'll be interesting to see more of Sasuke and Juugo's interaction in terms of this fact.
What I really want to see now (though I know this is way, way far off) is Team Kakashi's reaction to Juugo. I'm sure they'd want to help him any way possible. They're just Leaf ninja that way.
@C r a y o l a: I totally agree about Kishi's seeming sexism. He hardly gives the females any credit. I mean, yeah, at one point, there was a whole arc dedicated to Tsunade, but from there she's reduced to sitting behind a desk giving out missions, and not actually being "out there." I suppose that it's understandable, till we look at the second example.
Which is, of course, Sakura. We see her in one arc blowing her former weak self out of the water, and in the next arc, she's crying her heart out again without being able to at least show her strength in front of Sasuke, and in the arc after that, she arrives too late to fight. Where's the fairness in that?
Karin's past, in my opinion, will probably just involve how she was experimented on by Orochi, but it'll never come to any deeper than that. I’m responding to everything in one, big huge post <3 Tenshi, I like how you mentioned that you see Team Kakashi (if that is the team who goes after Sasuke) trying to help Juugo when they meet him, because they’re ‘leaf shinobi, after all’. How ironic, since most of this Sasuke arc has revolved around Suigetsu’s comments of ‘you really are a Konoha shinobi, Sasuke’. Very, very, very ironic <3 Suigetsu, you’re character would mean nothing to me if you weren’t making innuendos like these. The comments give me hope, and prove what I’ve always been saying—Sasuke is a Konoha shinobi AT HEART. To me, the whole Sasuke and Juugo comparison is way too obvious—it was one of the first things I noticed about the chapter 351. I don’t know why, it’s just something that jumped out at me, and the chapters haven’t been doing much of that at all—and if the spoilers are as I’ve seen, it seems that Sasuke is even more sympathetic and understanding when it comes to Juugo (promising him that if he starts to kill, he’ll be sure to become his ‘jail’, and lock Juugo away, but still insisting he come, as if to make sure Juugo wasn’t locked up because it wasn’t helping him at all). Juugo has many characteristics that connect with Team 7 has a whole, and I think that might be why Sasuke seems to connect more with Juugo than Karin or Suigetsu. As for when it comes to delving into Karin’s character, I’m pretty sure I’ve mentioned before that I don’t think Karin’s going to be a solid aspect of the series for long—she reminds me too much of Kabuto, and in this light, I would expect her and Sakura to face off. Tsunade and Kabuto had their battle, and in a sense, Tsunade WAS defeated by Kabuto. But the whole point of the Sannin comparison is that Team 7 will surpass the Sannin where they faltered, AND this part of the manga is also about the new generation surpassing the last. If Karin is a Kabuto lackey like I think, Saukra’s going to end up defeating her as a way to solidify her position in the ‘surpassing her teacher’ sense. The thing is, the FIRST PERSON in Part 2 to be shown or spoken of as surpassing their teacher is Sakura in the bell training chapter. That was what, 2 or 3 chapters into Part 2 and Kakashi was already saying that Sakura had/would surpass Tsunade because not only was she a medical ninja with inhumane strength, insane analytical skills and perfect chakra control, but she was ALSO a natural genjutsu user. Kishimoto has been hiding Sakura’s real genjutsu abilities from us for a long, long time—just showing us that she has a heightened sense and can release genjutsu easily. There’s a reason for that, and I don’t think it’s because Sakura doesn’t know how to utilize the power. I think it’s something she’s going to spring on us while fighting Karin or Itachi.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 4:28 pm
KanaRenee Bah, Uchihacest. Not that it has anything to do with the theory, but I will state that incestual made children DO HAVE MENTAL DISORDERS AND OTHER PHYSICAL AILMENTS OTHERISE NOT FOUND IN OTHER CHILDREN. -ends her case of why Uchihacest will never happen- That's the only part of your post that makes me squirm.
In many Asian countries (SUCH AS JAPAN*coughcough*), cousin to cousin relationships are LEGAL, and aren't counted as incest. :/ While yeah, there's a chance, it's SMALL.
Like the Hyuuga clan, the Uchiha clan is noble...Never seen a blonde Uchiha, have ya? All black-haired or dark-haired, right? Like the Hyuugas?
I can't help but think that incest is something they use to keep the clans pure. It's been done before.
PLUS, Naruto isn't even set in Japan. It's set in an alertnate universe!
And what kind of manga creator is gonna make a deformed baby? Especially in a shonen manga? (But I did read in a very old series, the Dollanganger Series, when the main character's child died because it was also her brother's child...THEY WERE TRAPPED IN AN ATTIC FOR OVER 3 YEARS IT'S NOT THEIR FAULT! D smile
In Fruits Basket, most of the main pairings are incest, yet you don't find people going: EWWW over Kisa and Hiro, or Haru and Rin, or Kagura's 'love' for Kyo. :/
It's only NejiHina and ItaSasu (love!=D) that freaks people out.
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Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:01 pm
-[Neji][Hina]- KanaRenee Bah, Uchihacest. Not that it has anything to do with the theory, but I will state that incestual made children DO HAVE MENTAL DISORDERS AND OTHER PHYSICAL AILMENTS OTHERISE NOT FOUND IN OTHER CHILDREN. -ends her case of why Uchihacest will never happen- That's the only part of your post that makes me squirm.
In many Asian countries (SUCH AS JAPAN*coughcough*), cousin to cousin relationships are LEGAL, and aren't counted as incest. :/ While yeah, there's a chance, it's SMALL.
Like the Hyuuga clan, the Uchiha clan is noble...Never seen a blonde Uchiha, have ya? All black-haired or dark-haired, right? Like the Hyuugas?
I can't help but think that incest is something they use to keep the clans pure. It's been done before.
PLUS, Naruto isn't even set in Japan. It's set in an alertnate universe!
And what kind of manga creator is gonna make a deformed baby? Especially in a shonen manga? (But I did read in a very old series, the Dollanganger Series, when the main character's child died because it was also her brother's child...THEY WERE TRAPPED IN AN ATTIC FOR OVER 3 YEARS IT'S NOT THEIR FAULT! D smile
In Fruits Basket, most of the main pairings are incest, yet you don't find people going: EWWW over Kisa and Hiro, or Haru and Rin, or Kagura's 'love' for Kyo. :/
It's only NejiHina and ItaSasu (love!=D) that freaks people out. I'm well aware that incest is accepted there XD But I'm just stating medical facts XD
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Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 11:23 am
Okay, the last theory didn't really take off so I'm going to try something a bit different. I'll never run out of ideas, trust me mrgreen exclaim
What is Karin's significance?
My theory:
Karin, although interesting, doesn't seem to be more than a plot device for the manga. She's a very flat character-- easy to anger, Sasuke fangirl, medic nin, smart. And as a plot device, I have a reason for her existance myself.
Karin is a lot like Ino in my book. Ino was someone who's shadow Sakura had to live in in order to feel safe and hide-- and it was surpassing Ino that created the strenght we have in Sakura's character now (along with goading from Sasuke <3).
Sasuke's new team is comprise of a lot of different people, but the only one seemingly interchangable with anyone in Team 7 is Karin with Sakura-- they're both smart, easy to anger, and medical ninja. So waht is my point?
Karin seems to be a plot device to show the bond between Sasuke and Sakura-- not necessarily in a romantic sense (although it could lead to that). Kishimoto has focused a lot on Naruto and Sasuke's bond, and although Sakura and Sasuke's has always been an unspoken one, we need to see it eventaully. Sakura's bond with Sasuke deals a lot with her growth. So to come and find out Sasuke has "replaced" her with Karin, I wonder how she'll react.
This new, Part 2 Sakura is very unlikely to just take that; I'm sure she'd find a way to show Sasuke that she's not a replaceable aspect of his life and that she's been very dedciated to him, Naruto, their team and the bonds that they share. Karin is going to be her rival/obstacle that she needs to overcome or deal with before she can openly expose her bond with Sasuke.
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Posted: Thu May 03, 2007 1:57 am
Well, there are two points that you've made here, so I'll talk about one after the other.
Firstly, I believe that Karin is just there for the female a** kicking. It would be unfair if Kishi didn't write in a female member in a team - there's hardly been a team in the series that doesn't have at least one girl. Kishimoto isn't going to start now, especially with one of the central teams of the plot to date. Also, while I don't want to put assumption with assumption, Karin is probably a medic nin, which would be a good thing for Sasuke. And she's a tracker, from what we've seen in that one chapter. I'm thinking that's her other major purpose.
Secondly, if she WERE a plot device to bring out Sasuke and Sakura's not-so-obvious bond, I'm thinking Sakura would be a little more resigned. She's not selfish anymore - if she thinks that Sasuke isn't getting hurt, she'll let go of the issue. All she wants at this point is to get him to come back, never mind him acknowledging her (although we know that that's a consequence of her showing her strength to him once she tries to drag him home). She doesn't seem to be the type to fight for her man, because she'll be wishing for whatever is best for Sasuke. If she thinks that Karin is the best for Sasuke, then she'll leave it at that.
(Not that, of course, SasuKarin is going to happen.)
But this brings the opportunity for Sasuke himself to bring that bond out.
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Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 8:29 am
Tenshi, I didn't see the response before. (stupid Gaia never shows me when things have been responded to and I have go and search). Anyway-- I get your points, but I still stand by my opinion. Here: Quote: Karin, for all decent purposes, is a fangirly character with a very shady side. She has already been pointed out to be a "loyal follower of Orochimaru" by Suigetsu (who seems to be right on the dollar with all of his comments), and as we've already heard, has "done something to Sasuke in the past", tries desperately to stay by his side. She's obviously a medic (a normal shinobi does not understand the things she's been explaining). That about sums Karin up in a few sentences. Kishimoto has used most of Part 2 to focus on the bond between Sasuke and Naruto-- which, indeniably, IS the important bond. But it's not the ONLY bond Sasuke has with someone from Team 7-- he also has a bond with Sakura, which is explained quite clearly in databook 2: Quote: Pg 49 SeparationTowards darkness… The one to appear before him is Sakura. She confesses to him as he tries to leave without looking behind him. She confesses with a blindingly uncompromising mind that does not want to lose him. The one that filled his lonely existence was Sakura. But he cannot let her in. He leaves with just one word of thanks. Sakura was not just a fleeting character he held no bond with. She was not just someone who was THERE with no real reason. She affected him, and when I stop to think about it, it's probably because the path of an "avenger" is one that causes him to destroy-- destory his bonds, destroy his morals, his happiness, and his brother. Sakura was someone he could PROTECT, someone he wanted to preserve-- someone, in affect, that allowed him to be human. Someone who filled his loniliness simply by being who she was. So why has it not been touched on AT ALL in Part 2, other than us seeing that Sakura hasn't given up on Sasuke and he hasn't been inclined, whatsoever, to do harm to her? And now, suddenly, a female character who could cause an issue for Sakura appears. How utterly convienent, no? Lets go back to non-speculation, though. Do we all remember the chapter after Team Kakashi returns from their rendevous with Sasuke? Sakura's first instinct was that there was somethign wrong with how strong Sasuke had become. Her thoughts? Drugs, or a jutsu of some sort. Karin is a medic. Drugs are something a medic would deal with. And what if these "drugs" have somethign to do with the "thing" that Karin did to Sasuke? Besides her character type, Karin is also likely to be a character Sakura has a hard time dealing with. Karin has snide comments and a high, almost egotisical view of herself. She's a medic. That's going to be a mental challenge. But the only person who can deal with the things a medic has done to others, or could do to them, is another medic. Karin, for all distinct purposes, is a rather flat character that makes me feel like she's going to be used mostly a way to bring the bond between Sakura and Sasuke back into light-- whether romantically, or just in a frienship. They've always had a bond, but Karin seems like a relatively good way to show that it's still there from both ends-- Sakura's and Sasuke's. They've always had a bond that never really needed to be spoken-- much like Kurenai and Asuma's. It was just there, and we all knew and accepted it. With Karin, she's there. She's with Sasuke. She's DONE somethign to Sasuke. I get the distinct impression she's not going to be fond of Sakura. Where will that lead? We don't know. But it's the interaction between Sakura and Karin-- which will inevitably lead somewhere with Sasuke, whether it be from his own movement or a comment made by Suigetsu, Karin or Sakura. Maybe this isn't making any sense (I am tired out of my mind and simply rambling XD), but to me it does. Karin's too flat of a character, and seems to be too easy to have betray Sasuke in favor of Orochimaru (remember, Kabuto stated that Orochimaru isn't dead, he's simply not in control-- it's possible that Karin, who is a BIG FOLLOWER OF OROCHIMARU, will have something up her sleeve to awaken the dormant Orochimaru), and the only person who would really be able to do anything for Sasuke will be Sakura. She's the medic. She's the one who could figure out the antidote to a poison that Chiyo couldn't-- someone who was a medic for a far longer time that Sakura or Tsunade. She's the one who's going to surpass Tsunade. And since Karin is with Sasuke, that's where the bond thing is going to occur. Blah. I'm sorry. I'll make a better argument later. Basically, my point is, any interaction between Sakura and Karin is going to reflect upon Sakura and Sasuke-- it's going to be connected in SOME way. Because Sakura is a female in Sasuke's life, and Karin is as well. And Karin, for all distinct purposes, dislikes anyone near Sasuke other than herself. Even if Sakura has better control and is no longer a fangirl, Sasuke IS her goal. These sorts of characteristics can only clash in a way that's going to reflect her bond with Sasuke. The only questionable factor in this all is Sasuke. How will he react to Karin's treatment of Sakura/Saskura's treatment of Karin, but I'm more interested in his reaction to Sakura overall. Since Karin is a part of his team, and someone he needs-- if we get a Team 7 reunion before he finds Itachi, there is no way that Sasuke won't somehow involve himself in a clash between Sakura and Karin, if there is one. He needs Karin's ability. But this also puts him in a place where he has to choose between the person he has never been able to harm physically-- and a person, who was stated from Databook 2 from the goodbye scene, that filled his lonely existance. Someone he cares about. Someone he's always protected. Someone who he's always set on a different level from others. (Also evidenced by comments such as "Revenge wont' make anyone happy. Not you... nor I." <-- Sakura. "Even YOU couldn't stop him?" <-- Shikamaru "I won't let anyone get in my way. Not even you."<-- Sasuke.) I don't know. This again just drawing on the things that Kishimoto mapped out in Part 1-- and concentrating on the bond that he's let simply sit there in question. Karin doesn't seem to serve much purpose otherwise, in my personal opinion-- and it's a good opprotunity to bring forth more of Sasuke's obvious bond with Team 7 that hasn't dwindled like he's wanted.
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