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 Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 2:23 pm
[ Message temporarily off-line ]
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Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 2:52 pm
It is a matter of opinion that even that deserves death. My opinion? I've stated it in here and elsewhere I'm sure, but I believe that if we can find a place to put all the people who "deserve" capital punishment, where they are away from humanity and have no way of doing any more damage except maybe to each other, then we should put them there for life, with no parole.
But, barring that... Capital punishment should really be a last resort. Only if the person is really impossible to rehabilitate and is likely to go and try to do it again, or something similar, should they be executed. Otherwise, life in prison without parole. And not that whimpy "40 years" version of life, life life. Forever. 'Till they die.
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Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 2:16 pm
I'm not disagreeing that the fetus didn't do anything wrong, however the fetus didn't do anything wrong in my eyes. In the choicer's eyes the fetus DID do something wrong, whether it meant to or not.
And Andy you hit it right on the nose. That's exactly what I'm getting at, it's a matter of opinion who deserves death and who deserves life. However if we're calling ourselves "pro-life" in terms of human life, than why is it that we feel we have the right to decide which things deserve death, while the choicers aren't allowed?
That's all I'm getting at. Not this, that and the other thing, but the death penalty in relation to pro-life views.
I do agree with harsher sentancing though, like life in prison means life in prison. Here life is about 25 years, and you can still get parole before that. It's sickening.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 7:23 am
Beware the Jabberwock I'm not disagreeing that the fetus didn't do anything wrong, however the fetus didn't do anything wrong in my eyes. In the choicer's eyes the fetus DID do something wrong, whether it meant to or not.
And Andy you hit it right on the nose. That's exactly what I'm getting at, it's a matter of opinion who deserves death and who deserves life. However if we're calling ourselves "pro-life" in terms of human life, than why is it that we feel we have the right to decide which things deserve death, while the choicers aren't allowed?
That's all I'm getting at. Not this, that and the other thing, but the death penalty in relation to pro-life views.
I do agree with harsher sentancing though, like life in prison means life in prison. Here life is about 25 years, and you can still get parole before that. It's sickening. i would agree if we stopped making prison such a happy place... tvs, gyms, food... well, yes, i know food must be supplied, but not good food. we could be feeding the poor while instead we feed murderers and rapists. we should make them do hard labor, make the prisons gain money instead of being a black hole of which cash goes in and never comes out. i know, it is a bit harsh, but that's what prison is. it shouldn't be a hotel you have to stay at for a few years, it should be something people truly abhor and try to avoid getting to.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 7:50 am
divineseraph Beware the Jabberwock I'm not disagreeing that the fetus didn't do anything wrong, however the fetus didn't do anything wrong in my eyes. In the choicer's eyes the fetus DID do something wrong, whether it meant to or not.
And Andy you hit it right on the nose. That's exactly what I'm getting at, it's a matter of opinion who deserves death and who deserves life. However if we're calling ourselves "pro-life" in terms of human life, than why is it that we feel we have the right to decide which things deserve death, while the choicers aren't allowed?
That's all I'm getting at. Not this, that and the other thing, but the death penalty in relation to pro-life views.
I do agree with harsher sentancing though, like life in prison means life in prison. Here life is about 25 years, and you can still get parole before that. It's sickening. i would agree if we stopped making prison such a happy place... tvs, gyms, food... well, yes, i know food must be supplied, but not good food. we could be feeding the poor while instead we feed murderers and rapists. we should make them do hard labor, make the prisons gain money instead of being a black hole of which cash goes in and never comes out. i know, it is a bit harsh, but that's what prison is. it shouldn't be a hotel you have to stay at for a few years, it should be something people truly abhor and try to avoid getting to. Some are. Some prisons are horrible. Not arguing against the death penalty, I think it's a necessary evil, but some prisons are brutal. Then again, some are picnics.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 10:57 am
These are humans we're talking about. Like it or not they're people too, with rights and all that fun stuff. What you're talking about is minimum security prisons, or halfway houses. And you know what it's a good thing to have that kind of stuff. Otherwise you're locking someone up and trying to reform them while making their conditions horrible.
This doesn't help society, all it does is harden these people more, to the point where they can never function in society again. These people have to be reformed so that they can help, so that they're not going to go out and do it all over again. Maybe they'll be afraid of jail but do you think the people who grow up in the ghetto aren't afraid of the ghetto? Of course they are, but that's all they've ever known and so they repeat the same actions that have always been repeated around them. They don't know anything differently.
You try being locked up in a hotel for years and see how well you like it after the first 5. We're not grounding these people, it's not our job to take away their TV, that was up to their parents. Jail takes away their freedom, and you won't understand the significance of that until it's lost.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:14 pm
You do the crime oyu do the time Miranda, it's as simple as that. They are indeed human, but that dosn't take away what they did, whether its theft, rape, murder, etc. They commited a crime and they have to pay for it. The problem is that your thinkign too much of the criminal and not enough of the crime. Its as Kate said, some prisions are horrible, some are cake walks. SOme make you where bright pink clothing, pink mantees, and make you watch the Food Network while you have nothing butch a sandwhich, some milk, and a pear to eat.
The problem is that most prisons are not concerned with reforming, thats an elective in most of them. You can go into a reform program that tries to help you. Other then that, your doing time, sittign around waiting for the next time you get to go to the yard. Hell, only speacial prisoners who have shown themselves with good behaiver get to do road side clean up.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:37 pm
They're people. Some people just scare me. This guy that used to live with us purposely tried to get back into jail. That sort of thing is kinda disturbing, that people would try to end up there. But some people do a crime that brings about a different sort of prison assignment. They're not going to send a serial killer to a minimum security prison, nor will they send a kid who swiped some cigarettes to a maximum security prison. All prisons shouldn't be the same, and prisons shouldn't be places to strip people of their rights. They can't be nice enough to tempt people to get into them, but they shouldn't be so hard that people are mistreated. Though, what I don't agree with is prisoners being put ahead of people on the organ donation list when they need organs because if they don't get them, it's considered cruel and unusual punishment. I don't understand why they aren't just put on the list instead of skipped ahead of everyone else.
Anyway, even if you're willing to strip so much from guilty people, what about people wrongfully convicted? You're basically putting them through hell for nothing. All you do is teach them that the system sucks. I mean, we NEED to think of the criminal as well as the crime. If we don't, society won't improve.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 4:30 pm
Are the forcibly put on the list? I shoudl hope not, thats abuse of the human body.
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Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:29 am
The prisons are more like five star hotels. They have they have meals three times a day and it tends to be more gourmet than anything else. They have cable TV, books, games, a gym, workout room, a track, etc.... I think we should make the criminals do very hard labor. Like thieves for example should be made to do community service and get a job to pay for what he stole plus interest. I would take out all forms of entertainment for they don't need to be rewared for the crime they commited.
I think the death penalty is good in some cases like that of a Sociopath. A Sociopath is one that feels no guilt for killing or raping. They fake emmotions that they don't feel. I also think petifile should be put to death for there is no way to rehabiliate them. I think if you can rehabilitate some one that has killed then that would be good.
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Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:27 pm
Sage~of~Water The prisons are more like five star hotels. They have they have meals three times a day and it tends to be more gourmet than anything else. They have cable TV, books, games, a gym, workout room, a track, etc.... I think we should make the criminals do very hard labor. Like thieves for example should be made to do community service and get a job to pay for what he stole plus interest. I would take out all forms of entertainment for they don't need to be rewared for the crime they commited. I think the death penalty is good in some cases like that of a Sociopath. A Sociopath is one that feels no guilt for killing or raping. They fake emmotions that they don't feel. I also think petifile should be put to death for there is no way to rehabiliate them. I think if you can rehabilitate some one that has killed then that would be good. you mean *****? meh... not so great an idea- it's not like he killed anyone. yes, having sex with children is wrong and horrible, but still, it's not quite the same as killing said child. i agree that prison should be harder- it is pretty wussy. yes, there are some bad ones, but for the most part, it's a hotel with bars. they should be made to work and produce something for society, not just sit there and suck up tax dollars
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Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:24 pm
Sage~of~Water The prisons are more like five star hotels. They have they have meals three times a day and it tends to be more gourmet than anything else. They have cable TV, books, games, a gym, workout room, a track, etc.... I think we should make the criminals do very hard labor. Like thieves for example should be made to do community service and get a job to pay for what he stole plus interest. I would take out all forms of entertainment for they don't need to be rewared for the crime they commited. There is actualy a prison where the wardon realised that. He took out all the food we would deam quite atsy and replaced it with three squar cold meals. A sandwhich, a pear, a carton of milk, and thats it. He removed the rec rooms, the gyms, had the trac closed off, and the only TV in the enitre prison is in the cafeteria and is on the Food Network perminetly. On top of all this, all theur clothes are electric pink and they don't get underwhere, they get pink frilly manties.
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 12:34 pm
awesome, that's how ya do it. except less on the pink.
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 1:01 pm
Yes, of course, because the best way to get someone to the point where they can become a productive member of society is to strip away all their rights, their dignity, and everything that defines an actual life.
If you want people to reform, you should treat them like actual PEOPLE. Crimes don't mean that people don't deserve their lives. I mean, ********, that's not right at all.
I know that people have to work and EARN these privelages when they live in minimum security prisons, they have to have a job, and they get a certain amount of money for a certain amount of work. Then, after they work, they are allotted these privelages.
I hate that people say prisons are "Five star hotels". Have you ever BEEN to a minimum security? Do you know what it's like?
Then don't make judgements based on your assumptions.
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Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 6:10 pm
Yes, McPhee, thats right. They lost their right to a normal life by commiting the crimes that got them into prison. Yes, in prison, you have no life beyond what the system wants you to have. Its how it works. You take away the life they want, and sooner or later they may decide to start workign to get it back and may just learn how to keep it. This is how you reform a criminal. You can't simply talk to them. Despite what you may think of how humans shoudl be treated, most of these people won't even want counciling untill they realise they actualy need it.
I have been to six diffrent psychiatric correctional facilities, and have taken tours of three juvinile hall centers, and on minimum security prisons. I was placed in one of those programs similer to Scared Straight when I was younger. I saw minimum in person, and detailed videos of maximum. They arn't liek five star hotels, more like apartments slightly above minimum living where you have bars on windows, little privacy, and you can't leave any tiem you want. The disrespect you get is mostly form other prisoners.
Any ways, the point of any form of prison was meant to be a place that you did not want to go back to. Today, thats diffrent. Many repeat offenders don't even care because, liek I said, some prisons have little diffrences between hotels or apartment complexes. Prison is meant to be a place of humiliation where you are granted less respect and rights of a normal citizen. You couldn't be a good little boy/girl, so why should we treat them liek one untill they can show us they deserve that respect again?
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