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 Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:54 pm
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Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 10:20 pm
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Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:36 pm
I love Rune IX - the Origin of Iron. Mmm.
"Thus is iron in the swamp-lands,
Stretching by the water-courses,
Hidden well for many ages,
Hidden in the birchen forests,
But he could not hide forever
From the searchings of his brother;
Here and there the fire has caught him,
Caught and brought him to his furnace,
That the spears, and swords, and axes,
Might be forged and duly hammered.
In the swamps ran blackened waters,
From the heath the bears came ambling,
And the wolves ran through the marshes.
Iron then made his appearance,
Where the feet of wolves had trodden,
Where the paws of bears had trampled."
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Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 5:55 pm
I haven't read in a while - I should get back to it! ninja
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Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 6:01 pm
Haha, I'm so behind now on my reading. I'm still only on Rune V. I should probably start reading again too. I guess that's what I get for getting such a good start... I was bound to slow down after reading three runes in such a short time.
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Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 8:30 pm
Alright, Rune III! I'm having trouble picturing Wainamoinen. They keep saying he's old and ancient, but I'm not sure whether that means he's aged in appearance or just a dude who lived a long time, long ago. What does "wizard" mean here? Is he a magic-user as well as a bard, or is the word another term for bard in the sense of sung magic, or is it used to indicate particular skill as a singer? They get quite into it. Quote: That the one may judge the other, In a war of wizard sayings. I like that their wisdom and "wizard sayings" seem to relate to the world around them and how it works, where particular fish swim, what breeds when, what eats what.... and then goes on to creation etc. Even though apparently it's "children's wisdom". It reminds me very much of Oðinn's wisdom-duel with whatsisface the giant, where they answer one another's questions and wager their heads.
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Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:40 pm
Sanguina Cruenta Alright, Rune III! I'm having trouble picturing Wainamoinen. They keep saying he's old and ancient, but I'm not sure whether that means he's aged in appearance or just a dude who lived a long time, long ago. What does "wizard" mean here? Is he a magic-user as well as a bard, or is the word another term for bard in the sense of sung magic, or is it used to indicate particular skill as a singer? They get quite into it. Quote: That the one may judge the other, In a war of wizard sayings. I like that their wisdom and "wizard sayings" seem to relate to the world around them and how it works, where particular fish swim, what breeds when, what eats what.... and then goes on to creation etc. Even though apparently it's "children's wisdom". It reminds me very much of Oðinn's wisdom-duel with whatsisface the giant, where they answer one another's questions and wager their heads. As an oral tradition, knowing the origins of things would be very important - something learned from childhood, a foundation that builds into greater things. It makes sense in my mind that a bard - more a skald, really - would be someone who knew and kept this knowledge, and passed it on in song and story, maybe together. Väino is both a magician and a storyteller - and the two aren't separate things, I think.
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Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:48 pm
Morgandria Sanguina Cruenta Alright, Rune III! I'm having trouble picturing Wainamoinen. They keep saying he's old and ancient, but I'm not sure whether that means he's aged in appearance or just a dude who lived a long time, long ago. What does "wizard" mean here? Is he a magic-user as well as a bard, or is the word another term for bard in the sense of sung magic, or is it used to indicate particular skill as a singer? They get quite into it. Quote: That the one may judge the other, In a war of wizard sayings. I like that their wisdom and "wizard sayings" seem to relate to the world around them and how it works, where particular fish swim, what breeds when, what eats what.... and then goes on to creation etc. Even though apparently it's "children's wisdom". It reminds me very much of Oðinn's wisdom-duel with whatsisface the giant, where they answer one another's questions and wager their heads. As an oral tradition, knowing the origins of things would be very important - something learned from childhood, a foundation that builds into greater things. It makes sense in my mind that a bard - more a skald, really - would be someone who knew and kept this knowledge, and passed it on in song and story, maybe together. Väino is both a magician and a storyteller - and the two aren't separate things, I think. Yeah, I second this. The scene reminded me a lot of a scene in Irish lore (though I don't remember the exact story) where two bards start to have a competition, and what begins as a duel of poetry and wisdom ends up with people flying through the air and shapeshifting and stuff like that. Poetry, magic, and wisdom all seem to come from similar sources.... Also, the use of "poetry" versus "wisdom" versus "wizard" might just be poetic license on the part of the translator, to make the verses flow nicely in English.
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Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:09 pm
Translation issues are one reason I wonder about the use of the words in the original. But I'm the sort of person who's interested in nuances of words. I understand the concept of songs and poetry being magic in and of themselves - we have galdr, though what precisely it entails is something else - and so on, I was more wondering what precisely was meant here. On the other hand, I may be over-thinking it.
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Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 1:03 pm
I have fallen behind! I must get more reading in as well.
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Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:36 pm
Did we stall on this one? I only got up to rune 6 or 7... I keep forgetting to read it, and then remembering and feeling guilty that I haven't. I'd still like to finish the Kalevala, but I'm wondering whether others are still interested in discussing it in the group or whether you'd rather put it on the back burner and move the discussion on to the next book?
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Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:40 pm
i think we could probably move on.
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Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:09 pm
I'm sorry sweatdrop
I think I made it though the 4th or 5th, before I got sick. I'll try to get a bit more read if you still want to discuss it.
We can always start something else as well, and just post here when we have the time.
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Posted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 10:07 pm
That's a good idea, Sweet. If I recall, we were going to read "The Spiral Dance" next. Though we should probably wait a couple of weeks anyway for people to prepare.
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Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:13 am
Epic poetry can take a while. At least it does for me. I love it but if I don't take a break every now and then it all just runs together into a jumble of meter and rhyme, with the actual words losing much of their meaning. I am working on it though.
Anyway, I'd be up for moving on to the next book but leaving this thread open for a while longer while we do so.
I would also appreciate a little time to prepare. I don't have a copy of Spiral dance in my hands just now but I think I can find one.
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