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 Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 2:41 pm
OP, it doesn’t sound to me as though your catholic at all. There are many non-Catholic viewpoints stated there and to hold them you’d have to be some other type of Christian. I should know. I was a Catholic for a decade and a half… Though the point is moot, because judging from your avatar, I’m guessing that you’re no longer with us. KyrosDevil XIII Quote: ps. Buddhism not religion, its a way of life, based of a real person. It might be a way of life but it is also counted as one of 'The Big Five' world religions. Just fyi. I know it goes against Buddah, but I guess when society has made up their mind, they don't care to differentiate between a way/standard of life and an actual religion. Also please take note that there is some scientific evidence that says that both Muhammad (the most well known prophet of Islam) and Jesus (the most well known prophet of Judaism) were real people. [I say Jesus was the prophet of Judaism because they don't believe he was the messiah where as Christianity does.] Correct. Buddhism is a religion. It just isn’t centered on the worship of a deity… But I think it’s beyond off-topic to turn this into a debate between the difference between philosophy and religion. Wolfram Asher Davidson The main message of any religion is to love all and respect all. Anyone who refuses to follow these simple rules are hypocrites when they quote their scripture. Incorrect. The WBC is a religion. It is also a hate group, but it is a sect of a religion, as well. It’s very existence proves this statement false. Shilberu Erikku I say we should just destroy all faith and just accept that life is meaningless. Most people seem to think that an afterlife is coterminous with a deity (which is erroneous, in my thinking. If a god wasn't necessary for the creation of this universe, why would he be needed to make another one? ...But that's beside the point). If there is are no gods, no reason for us being here, and no afterlife, doesn't that make the life portion of our existence more meaningful? I'm sure that I'll have more to add later.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 2:49 pm
Matasoga OP, it doesn’t sound to me as though your catholic at all. There are many non-Catholic viewpoints stated there and to hold them you’d have to be some other type of Christian. I should know. I was a Catholic for a decade and a half… Though the point is moot, because judging from your avatar, I’m guessing that you’re no longer with us. What part of his claims do you think go against Catholicism? Quote: Incorrect. The WBC is a religion. It is also a hate group, but it is a sect of a religion, as well. It’s very existence proves this statement false. By that reasoning people who dress up as cats are cats- WBC is a group of prefessional lawyers who use the 1st Amendment to piss people off until they get a reaction- and then they sue. Just because it dresses itself up to look like a religion doesn't mean it is one.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 3:08 pm
Esiris What part of his claims do you think go against Catholicism? See the Apostle's Creed. "We acknowledge one Baptism for the forgiveness of sins." If your sins aren't forgiven then you are going to Hell. That is specifically Catholic, if I'm not mistaken. It's repeated at every service. Then there is the ever popular John 3:16. "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." The obvious implication that those who do not will not. This is reenforced by the statement that went something to the effect of "No one sees my father except through me." He's not the first person to rankle at that. Dante obviously did when he wrote The Inferno. He made the first layer of hell for unbaptized babies and non-Christians who were still good people. It was also a place free of suffering. Esiris By that reasoning people who dress up as cats are cats- WBC is a group of prefessional lawyers who use the 1st Amendment to piss people off until they get a reaction- and then they sue. Just because it dresses itself up to look like a religion doesn't mean it is one. They claim to do what they do in the name of God... And they do. They hoenstly believe in what they're doing. That is visible in all of the interviews. That's why I feel that it is a religion. It just focuses more on hate then love. It still has all of the other trappings of typical western religion. It has a god, a belief system, a strong focus on the afterlife... Where do you justify your point of view that it isn't a religion? It sounds like you're making the argument that "I don't like it so it's not a religion." You haven't really given valid points to indicate otherwise.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 3:16 pm
Matasoga See the Apostle's Creed. "We acknowledge one Baptism for the forgiveness of sins." If your sins aren't forgiven then you are going to Hell. That is specifically Catholic, if I'm not mistaken. It's repeated at every service. The Apostle's Creed is part in slightly different wordings of lots of Christian sects- but I think it's the interpretation of the Creed and Catholicism that's the thing. He's saying other people can be forgiven their ignorance- " The obvious implication that those who do not will not. " This isn't part of what Catholics teach- the Vatican did a series of doctrine statements that say that non-Christians aren't at fault and if they seek God in their own way- they have a chance at salvation too. Quote: They claim to do what they do in the name of God. People can and do lie- the only thing obvious in all their interviews to me is that they're very good trolls. Hell- they trolled Anonymous. My argument is that they're some very cunning lawyers- there are real religious groups that are homophobic and bigoted- but the WBC is mostly made up of 1 extended family- it doesn't accept much in the way of converts and they make their living suing people who shove them during their protests or cities that try and stop them from protesting. That's more a business than a practice of faith.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 3:33 pm
Esiris The Apostle's Creed is part in slightly different wordings of lots of Christian sects- but I think it's the interpretation of the Creed and Catholicism that's the thing. He's saying other people can be forgiven their ignorance- " The obvious implication that those who do not will not. " This isn't part of what Catholics teach- the Vatican did a series of doctrine statements that say that non-Christians aren't at fault and if they seek God in their own way- they have a chance at salvation too. And what he's saying is at odds with his faith. The best case scenario is that he is a salad-bar Chrisitan, taking the label/title of the faith, as well as the bits that he likes and ignores the rest, even if it's in direct conflict with his religion. I cannot argue with the Vatican statements. I shall have to concede that point, for now, as I have not been following the Vatican statements, and in this instance I am too uninformed to have a valid stake in this argument, any further. If those statements have been made, however, they are at odds with the scripture. Esiris People can and do lie- the only thing obvious in all their interviews to me is that they're very good trolls. Hell- they trolled Anonymous. My argument is that they're some very cunning lawyers- there are real religious groups that are homophobic and bigoted- but the WBC is mostly made up of 1 extended family- it doesn't accept much in the way of converts and they make their living suing people who shove them during their protests or cities that try and stop them from protesting. That's more a business than a practice of faith. You're either ignoring my larger point in asking how you can legitimately conclude that they are not a religion or telling me that having lawyers and being litigious makes them less spiritual, which I will need you to greatly expund upon.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 3:43 pm
Matasoga And what he's saying is at odds with his faith. The best case scenario is that he is a salad-bar Chrisitan, taking the label/title of the faith, as well as the bits that he likes and ignores the rest, even if it's in direct conflict with his religion. I cannot argue with the Vatican statements. I shall have to concede that point, for now, as I have not been following the Vatican statements, and in this instance I am too uninformed to have a valid stake in this argument, any further. If those statements have been made, however, they are at odds with the scripture. Catholics don't believe that scripture is the soul source of God's religion- heck, even the Bible doesn't say it's the only source for the Christian religion. Quote: You're either ignoring my larger point in asking how you can legitimately conclude that they are not a religion or telling me that having lawyers and being litigious makes them less spiritual, which I will need you to greatly expund upon. It's not that it makes them less spiritual- it's their real motivation. The Catholic Church has lawyers and sues people- but their focus is elsewhere- and that's the difference. When being part of the church means you have to be a lawyer so you can sue people who shove you- then it's legal trolling dressed up to look like a religion and not the other way around.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 4:39 pm
Matasoga OP, it doesn’t sound to me as though your catholic at all. There are many non-Catholic viewpoints stated there and to hold them you’d have to be some other type of Christian. I should know. I was a Catholic for a decade and a half… Though the point is moot, because judging from your avatar, I’m guessing that you’re no longer with us. KyrosDevil XIII Quote: ps. Buddhism not religion, its a way of life, based of a real person. It might be a way of life but it is also counted as one of 'The Big Five' world religions. Just fyi. I know it goes against Buddah, but I guess when society has made up their mind, they don't care to differentiate between a way/standard of life and an actual religion. Also please take note that there is some scientific evidence that says that both Muhammad (the most well known prophet of Islam) and Jesus (the most well known prophet of Judaism) were real people. [I say Jesus was the prophet of Judaism because they don't believe he was the messiah where as Christianity does.] Correct. Buddhism is a religion. It just isn’t centered on the worship of a deity… But I think it’s beyond off-topic to turn this into a debate between the difference between philosophy and religion. Wolfram Asher Davidson The main message of any religion is to love all and respect all. Anyone who refuses to follow these simple rules are hypocrites when they quote their scripture. Incorrect. The WBC is a religion. It is also a hate group, but it is a sect of a religion, as well. It’s very existence proves this statement false. Shilberu Erikku I say we should just destroy all faith and just accept that life is meaningless. Most people seem to think that an afterlife is coterminous with a deity (which is erroneous, in my thinking. If a god wasn't necessary for the creation of this universe, why would he be needed to make another one? ...But that's beside the point). If there is are no gods, no reason for us being here, and no afterlife, doesn't that make the life portion of our existence more meaningful? I'm sure that I'll have more to add later. In other words, the people that waste their time actually believing in something are just trying to keep themselves from being depressed due to fears of randomness and death. How pathetic, these people need to accept reality and stop searching for a DEFINITE point to life. After all, one's point in life depends on what that individual makes of it.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 4:55 pm
Esiris Catholics don't believe that scripture is the soul source of God's religion- heck, even the Bible doesn't say it's the only source for the Christian religion. I'm going to assume that you meant "sole," because if that was a pun, it was rotten. I have nothing else to say on that topic. Esiris It's not that it makes them less spiritual- it's their real motivation. The Catholic Church has lawyers and sues people- but their focus is elsewhere- and that's the difference. When being part of the church means you have to be a lawyer so you can sue people who shove you- then it's legal trolling dressed up to look like a religion and not the other way around. Their purpose is still elevating what they believe to be the views of their god and their beliefs. That still makes them a religious organization.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 5:56 pm
Personally I think everyone should take a chill pill on religion. If you look very closely at all religions and how alike they all are. Christianity also has many forms like Judaism, Catholic, Presbyterian, Quaker, ext. I was raised Quaker and even tried Buddhism for a year when I was 10. I think we should respect all forms of religion. Unless it's a like a cult that tries to kill people or other religions. And it doesn't if you believe there's a heaven or how you get up into heaven.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 6:53 pm
Yuki_no_Joo Personally I think everyone should take a chill pill on religion. If you look very closely at all religions and how alike they all are. Christianity also has many forms like Judaism, Catholic, Presbyterian, Quaker, ext. I was raised Quaker and even tried Buddhism for a year when I was 10. I think we should respect all forms of religion. Unless it's a like a cult that tries to kill people or other religions. And it doesn't if you believe there's a heaven or how you get up into heaven. Exactly! We should all just live and let live, and resist the human urge to be right. 3nodding
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 7:29 pm
Matasoga I'm going to assume that you meant "sole," because if that was a pun, it was rotten. I have nothing else to say on that topic. It was a bad pun- but the point stands, the Bible doesn't support sola scriptura. 3nodding So- the OP's post is perfectly in line with matters of Catholic doctrine. Quote: Their purpose is still elevating what they believe to be the views of their god and their beliefs. I don't think it is- I think their purpose is to get money by suing the pants off people who lash out at their bad behavior. If I thought for a moment it was like what you say- that it's about what they believe about God, then I'd agree. But there has been enough evidence to convince me that it's a fake out- that they're using these absurd claims in order to troll people into lashing out and then taking them to court.
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 9:36 pm
Yuki_no_Joo Personally I think everyone should take a chill pill on religion. If you look very closely at all religions and how alike they all are. Christianity also has many forms like Judaism, Catholic, Presbyterian, Quaker, ext. I was raised Quaker and even tried Buddhism for a year when I was 10. I think we should respect all forms of religion. Unless it's a like a cult that tries to kill people or other religions. And it doesn't if you believe there's a heaven or how you get up into heaven. Judiasm is not a form of Christianity. I mean... Alright, diplomacy aside are you ******** kidding me? Seriously? How can anyone have the audacity to even open their mouths anywhere near a religious debate without knowing that?
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Posted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 10:38 pm
Yuki_no_Joo Personally I think everyone should take a chill pill on religion. If you look very closely at all religions and how alike they all are. Christianity also has many forms like Judaism, Catholic, Presbyterian, Quaker, ext. I was raised Quaker and even tried Buddhism for a year when I was 10. I think we should respect all forms of religion. Unless it's a like a cult that tries to kill people or other religions. And it doesn't if you believe there's a heaven or how you get up into heaven. Judiasm is NOT a form of christianity! I know this 'cause I happen to be jewish scream .
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Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 7:25 am
Matasoga Yuki_no_Joo Personally I think everyone should take a chill pill on religion. If you look very closely at all religions and how alike they all are. Christianity also has many forms like Judaism, Catholic, Presbyterian, Quaker, ext. I was raised Quaker and even tried Buddhism for a year when I was 10. I think we should respect all forms of religion. Unless it's a like a cult that tries to kill people or other religions. And it doesn't if you believe there's a heaven or how you get up into heaven. Judiasm is not a form of Christianity. I mean... Alright, diplomacy aside are you ******** kidding me? Seriously? How can anyone have the audacity to even open their mouths anywhere near a religious debate without knowing that? She could be talking about the Messianic Jews.
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Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:07 am
Shilberu Erikku Yuki_no_Joo Personally I think everyone should take a chill pill on religion. If you look very closely at all religions and how alike they all are. Christianity also has many forms like Judaism, Catholic, Presbyterian, Quaker, ext. I was raised Quaker and even tried Buddhism for a year when I was 10. I think we should respect all forms of religion. Unless it's a like a cult that tries to kill people or other religions. And it doesn't if you believe there's a heaven or how you get up into heaven. Judiasm is NOT a form of christianity! I know this 'cause I happen to be jewish scream . I was talking about Messianic Jews, sorry to get you all worked up it was a simple error while typing. But Judaism is close to Christianity and Quakerism. I would know about that cause my Quaker meeting house shares is with a Jewish synagogue.
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