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 Posted: Sat May 17, 2014 5:51 pm
@Part II Skill Idea:
Loving it!!
@Semb: Oh, I see... That sounds like a good idea smile (Training ideas)
@Charisma:
It could be a simple option to pass pesky encounters. For example, you could have a few DCs, depending on whether you choose to intimidate, seduce, fight, run away, etc. That would give non-combat options more importance in general.
Loving the idea of Charisma affecting dice rolls, too whee It would just be like the move Attract in Pokemon rofl
@Sawa Charisma/Hidden techniques:
I really wasn't a fan of those... It just didn't make sense to me that these could be on a continuum of improvement. If you go full charisma you'd end up making a character that could intimidate, seduce, sweet-talk diplomats and all that. It might just be me, though. Can't get the image of a hulking dude
"levelling up" and learning to seduce. (Am probably being horrible at explaining my thoughts) What does everyone else think?
@Dodge vs Ninjutsu etc.
Loving it!
I think it'd only be fair to allow blocking to negate the damage entirely. Well, I'm thinking of a worst-case scenario where a support chara gets caught in a fight with a Melee/Taijutsu chara. Could they try to run away? Maybe... because even if they poured loads of points into the block skill, they'd still end up losing, just would take longer to. Well, you could argue that this is the price for choosing such a path though. [I don't have strong opinions either way.]
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Posted: Sat May 17, 2014 11:32 pm
I'm glad you brought up that point, DE. And welcome back to Shima!
My mentaility is that it would completely deflect the attack. Pretty much just Dodge, but with a different name. Having to worry about range and stuff is awesome, but it's something I don't want us to have to keep track of.
So like Sense and Dodge, Block vs Taijutsu would lead to no damage if successful.
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Posted: Sat May 17, 2014 11:42 pm
I really like the combination of Kouri and Semblance's ideas for Charisma.
It would affect certain dice rolls. For instance, if some attractive Kunoichi winked at an attacking Shinobi, he would stumble and have less accuracy or lose out on the roll entirely.
Maya and I were talking earlier on Skype and we briefly spoke about perhaps lumping Charisma into just one thing that could be used in these instances. I like the more simple idea rather than having Lie, Seduce, Intimidate, Persuade and whatever else. There really isn't a reason for the variety.
We also agreed about combining Tumble and Acrobatics into one thing, which was Kouri's idea I believe.
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 10:37 am
You guys, I like the thoughts flying around in here. Sorry I haven't been on, I've been down ill for the past 4-5 days.... Still sick, so if I need to be reached PM me, or McClane, message me on Skype, I should be on later today.
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 1:29 pm
Instead of having 4 skills requiring people to dump points into for missions maybe we could cram them into 2. The skills would cover all of the current skills used for missions under Charisma but in two ways. Good and Evil. Since you can use these current skills in two different ways. Depending on what the mission called for or the situation in the RP you could influence a person in a good way or evil way.
Influence Good
○ Beguile
○ Seduce
○ Perform
Influence Evil
○ Beguile
○ Seduce
○ Intimidate
Example
A guard stands in front of a gate and you must pass him.
Use your influence(one or the other) to proceed.
Influence good you could use Beguile to convince the guard to understand your cause and join your side.
Influence evil you could intimidate the guard in order to pass.
This just seems easier on the people that are going to have to earn these points and makes Charisma a little easier to attain.
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I think that if we add block as a skill so that we can only use it against Taijutsu then our overall amount of battle related points is going to be spread even more thin. Its going to create more work for the students to have to train in three skills instead of two. Instead of dumping points into dodge and sense we will also have to put them into block. Therefore someone will more than likely be terrible at one of these skills. It actually makes it a bit more realistic but it also makes it a little easier to get absolutely slaughtered if you face an opponent that is a whiz kid in the technique of fighting that your very weak against. I am for this though, I like the simplified system it gives battling and it also adds a little architecture for fighting styles.
_____________________________________________________________
I am going to suggest actually moving Genjutsu to Charisma because in my personal opinion the use of genjutsu is to persuade or influence a person in such a way that they believe what is happening to them or the surroundings that they see. Perhaps when using genjutsu you add your skill to half your charisma modifier and half your intelligence modifier. I think this because genjutsu is quite strong like McClane said and it is a mix between the two attributes.
Example
1D20 + Genjutsu + 1/2 Intelligence+ 1/2 Charisma = question
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 5:31 pm
I don't like the idea of applying morality to actions. If we were to do that, it would depend on the morality of the target. For instance a guard with a high sense of justice wouldn't be persuaded by a bribe, so even an evil influence wouldn't make him take money in exchange for his ethics, no matter how high a skill you have. But you could convince him that you mean no harm and are trying to help, allowing you to pass against his orders. A person should be able to do that based on their personal skill, not whether their influence is good or evil.
You have a point about block and dodge. I guess we don't have to limit each skill to counter a single skill.
Here's an idea: Instead of having a skill that counters a certain type of skill, those skills should allow for the use of a certain type of skill. Under those circumstances, you could use dodge for tai, nin, and gen, allowing you to perform, for example only, a stealth technique. Block would allow you to perform a counter technique, and sense would allow you to perform an escape technique. Against genjutsu, dodge would be as simple as closing your eyes against visual jutsu, block would use pain to overcome a jutsu, and sense would allow you to release a jutsu.
As for genjutsu, that's not how genjutsu works. If you want to change genjutsu so that it becomes a persuade jutsu, then I'm on board for your idea. We could eliminate the need for persuasive techniques by making them abilities applied by genjutsu. However if we're following Naruto logic, genjutsu molds chakra into illusions. I don't really see how generating clones would rely on charisma, unless we change the purpose of clones to convince a person not to attack.
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 7:54 pm
Demonic Existence
I think that if we add block as a skill so that we can only use it against Taijutsu then our overall amount of battle related points is going to be spread even more thin. Its going to create more work for the students to have to train in three skills instead of two. Instead of dumping points into dodge and sense we will also have to put them into block. Therefore someone will more than likely be terrible at one of these skills. It actually makes it a bit more realistic but it also makes it a little easier to get absolutely slaughtered if you face an opponent that is a whiz kid in the technique of fighting that your very weak against. I am for this though, I like the simplified system it gives battling and it also adds a little architecture for fighting styles.
Say a Ninjutsu user has a really low Block skill and they are fighting a powerful Taijutsu user. We make the Body Replacement Technique add half of your Ninjutsu to your Block skill. So even if you are fighting a Taijutsu whiz, your dominant skill set will be able to assist you if you don't have many points in Block.
And this is precisely what we will be teaching in the Academy. The basics of our game system and three jutsu that boost your defenses:
Ninjutsu
Body Replacement Technique - Add half of your Ninjutsu to Block
Genjutsu
Bunshin no Jutsu - Add half of your Genjutsu to Dodge
Taijutsu
Kai (Release) - Add half of your Taijutsu to your Sense
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 8:04 pm
Semblance You have a point about block and dodge. I guess we don't have to limit each skill to counter a single skill.
Here's an idea: Instead of having a skill that counters a certain type of skill, those skills should allow for the use of a certain type of skill. Under those circumstances, you could use dodge for tai, nin, and gen, allowing you to perform, for example only, a stealth technique. Block would allow you to perform a counter technique, and sense would allow you to perform an escape technique. Against genjutsu, dodge would be as simple as closing your eyes against visual jutsu, block would use pain to overcome a jutsu, and sense would allow you to release a jutsu.
Your game system ideas are awesome Semblance, but many of the people we're going to bring in aren't quite as technical-thinking as you and I are. I want to streamline things so that it's easy enough to pick up, but complicated enough to have to be strategic at the higher levels.
Ideally I'd like the average user to come in, see our system, and think.... "Oh, it's just like Rock-Paper-Scissors but with more options." Then as they learned the system more, they would realize that there were many more ways to counter attacks.
Here is another idea I've had about abilities. As far as I know, and correct me if I'm wrong, there was never a way to determine posting-order in a battle. In my opinion, we should sort it by whoever has the highest amount of points in Agility. So a speedy little guy would be faster than a huge axe-wielding slow guy.
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 8:37 pm
McClane Semblance You have a point about block and dodge. I guess we don't have to limit each skill to counter a single skill.
Here's an idea: Instead of having a skill that counters a certain type of skill, those skills should allow for the use of a certain type of skill. Under those circumstances, you could use dodge for tai, nin, and gen, allowing you to perform, for example only, a stealth technique. Block would allow you to perform a counter technique, and sense would allow you to perform an escape technique. Against genjutsu, dodge would be as simple as closing your eyes against visual jutsu, block would use pain to overcome a jutsu, and sense would allow you to release a jutsu.
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 3:15 am
Well that's exactly what I'm here to do ^^
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 6:02 am
McClane Ninjutsu Body Replacement Technique - Add half of your Ninjutsu to Block Genjutsu Bunshin no Jutsu - Add half of your Genjutsu to Dodge Taijutsu Kai (Release) - Add half of your Taijutsu to your Sense I like this idea but your not really blocking anything with your body using the body replacement technique even though your are replacing your body with something to replace the attack. This is how it is at the moment. Game System Body Replacement Technique [Kawamiri no Jutsu] This jutsu lets the user quickly switch places with another nearby object, such as a plant (normally a section of a log), an animal, or even another person within reach, leaving the opponent open to a counter-attack. Explosive tags can be attached to the replacement for an added surprise. Fundamentally, all ninja know this technique. If the technique is successful you can use sneak attack to attack your target. CP Cost: 5 Damage: N/A Requirement: Must be taught. Seals: Ram Avoid: Dodge or Ninjutsu roll. Special: + Chakra Mod to Dodge, Sets up for Sneak attack if dodge is successful. Roll: 1d20 + Dodge + Chakra Mod And this is what I would suggest? Changed Suggestion Body Replacement Technique [Kawamiri no Jutsu] This jutsu lets the user quickly switch places with another nearby object, such as a plant (normally a section of a log), an animal, or even another person within reach, leaving the opponent open to a counter-attack. Explosive tags can be attached to the replacement for an added surprise. Fundamentally, all ninja know this technique. If the technique is successful you can use sneak attack to attack your target. CP Cost: 5 Damage: N/A Requirement: Must be taught. Seals: Ram Avoid: Dodge or Ninjutsu roll. Special: + ½ Ninjutsu to Block, Sets up for Sneak attack if block is successful. Roll: 1d20 + Block + ½ Ninjutsu Game System Clone Technique [Bunshin no Jutsu] This technique creates intangible clones of the user. The clones are simply illusions and will dissipate when they come into contact with something. The illusions can usually be seen through by the Byakugan and the Sharingan. A person with normal eyes can also distinguish the clones from the original, since the clones will not disrupt the area around themselves with their movement (won't kick up dust, crush grass, etc.). You use this technique to confuse your opponent in order to attack them more easily. Cp Cost: 2 per bunshin Damage: None Requirements: Must be taught. Seals: Ram, Snake, Tiger Special: If Clone technique is successful you may use sneak attack onto your following attack if it coincides with the technique. Special: If opponent fails the sense/detect check and you choose to fight alongside with your clones, opponent rolls an additional "Luck" dice with their attack. This dice does not count towards their total dice roll. For them to hit you amongst all the clones, they must roll a 11 or higher. If they succeed +Luck Roll to next sense/detect roll against technique. Special: 1 Bunshin per 5 Ranks control. The way we have this set up in the system at the moment its more beneficial as an attacking jutsu. Also would this need to be in effect before the attack is used or it could be used after the attack is launched as a dodge modifier. In my mind the opponent would attack then the defender uses this jutsu so you could add a ¼ of your Genjutsu per clone to dodge. After that the user would roll a hide check and the opponent would need to roll a sense/detect check to identify or fail to identify his opponent. After that then defender would turn to attack phase and be able to sneak attack if his hide was successful. Changed Suggestion Clone Technique [Bunshin no Jutsu] This technique creates intangible clones of the user. The clones are simply illusions and will dissipate when they come into contact with something. The illusions can usually be seen through by the Byakugan and the Sharingan. A person with normal eyes can also distinguish the clones from the original, since the clones will not disrupt the area around themselves with their movement (won't kick up dust, crush grass, etc.). You use this technique to confuse your opponent in order to attack them more easily. Cp Cost: 2 per bunshin Damage: None Requirements: Must be taught. Seals: Ram, Snake, Tiger Special: Can be used to dodge a Ninjutsu attack. Add ¼ of Genjutsu to dodge per clone. After dodge roll a hide check and opponent must roll sense/detect check. Special: If Clone technique is successful you may use sneak attack onto your following attack if it coincides with the technique. Special: If opponent fails the sense/detect check and you choose to fight alongside with your clones, opponent rolls an additional "Luck" dice with their attack. This dice does not count towards their total dice roll. For them to hit you amongst all the clones, they must roll a 11 or higher. If they succeed +Luck Roll to next sense/detect roll against technique. Special: 1 Bunshin per 5 Ranks control. McClane Taijutsu Kai (Release) - Add half of your Taijutsu to your Sense Umm. . . sweatdrop I agree with the idea but I am at a loss for how you would add Taijutsu to Sense. I understand your idea but don't know how they would relate too well. As a Taijutsu user your would train to focus and be quite accurate so it would be easier for them to sense a fake reality using there Taijutsu concepts? sweatdrop
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 6:33 am
We could swap around the jutsu if it made more sense for the Body Replacement to add to Dodge and the Bunshin no Jutsu to add to Block. If it doesn't seem to make enough sense for these jutsu to do this, we could just create new jutsu to add to the defenses. I only chose these three techniques because it seems like they would be taught in the academy.
As far as Taijutsu vs Genjutsu goes, I'm not sure if you follow the anime but in one episode, a character bites down really hard on their own lip in order to escape from a Genjutsu. Now at first glance someone might not think that simply biting down on your lip is complex enough to be classified as Taijutsu, but martial arts is all about finding ways to counter assaults against you. Whether it's deflecting a punch, focusing on pressure points to disable your opponent, or in this case finding a way to counter an illusion. It's a physical way to stop an illusionary attack, so I don't think it's too farfetched to say that we could place it under Taijutsu.
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 7:12 am
McClane We could swap around the jutsu if it made more sense for the Body Replacement to add to Dodge and the Bunshin no Jutsu to add to Block. If it doesn't seem to make enough sense for these jutsu to do this, we could just create new jutsu to add to the defenses. I only chose these three techniques because it seems like they would be taught in the academy.
As far as Taijutsu vs Genjutsu goes, I'm not sure if you follow the anime but in one episode, a character bites down really hard on their own lip in order to escape from a Genjutsu. Now at first glance someone might not think that simply biting down on your lip is complex enough to be classified as Taijutsu, but martial arts is all about finding ways to counter assaults against you. Whether it's deflecting a punch, focusing on pressure points to disable your opponent, or in this case finding a way to counter an illusion. It's a physical way to stop an illusionary attack, so I don't think it's too farfetched to say that we could place it under Taijutsu.
Body Replacement Technique - Add ½ of your Ninjutsu to Dodge
Comment: I think that having dodge on this technique makes more sense.
Genjutsu
Bunshin no Jutsu - Add ¼ of your Genjutsu to Block per clone
Comment: If your hiding among clones you will most likely be more ready to block an attack if it is coming at you. You will be more confident because in your mind the attacker will be less certain the figure his attacking is an actual person or an illusion.
Taijutsu
Kai (Release) - Add half of your Taijutsu to your Sense
Comment: Yes, just yes. rofl
I think these three are the main techniques we need to assemble at the moment because we will have some time before our students are able to learn any other techniques.
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 7:47 am
I really like your modifications, DE. It's really cool that the Bunshin starts out a little weaker, but will become more effective based on how many clones you use. Perhaps we should make the CP requirement a little more steep for this per clone. Otherwise, you're gonna be making like 20 clones and never being able to be touched. Which did actually happen to the main group during the Chuunin Exams, but that was OP ^^;;
Other than that, I completely agree with your suggestions.
And one more thing I wanted to mention about potential balance issues if you run into a master shinobi in a certain kind of attacking style and your defenses against that style are low:
I'd like to emphasize teamwork a little more. So if your character did run into a Master Genjutsu/Taijutsu/Ninjutsu/Weapon user, hopefully your team was smart enough to bring along one person who could defensively stand up to someone like that.
In the same fight I had mentioned earlier, a Master Genjutsu user came to Konoha to kick some leaf shinobi butts - Uchiha Itachi vs Asuma and Kurenai. He was doing pretty well at that until someone who knew how to properly fight against Genjutsu showed up - Might Guy. I'd also like to mention that he used Taijutsu techniques to counter Genjutsu ^_~ Reading movements from Itachi's feet instead of looking at his eyes and getting caught in a Genjutsu.
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 8:09 am
McClane Perhaps we should make the CP requirement a little more steep for this per clone. Otherwise, you're gonna be making like 20 clones and never being able to be touched.
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