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 Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:22 pm
So apparently I have to make another judgement... again.
And if you're not interested, then theres nothing keeping you from forfeiting.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:30 pm
Man, I dont even know what the hell I just read.
Someone simplify the actions for me.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:34 pm
First two quotes: what it sums up to is you twisting your lower body to plant your legs. Look at it this way. If you are countering my lean and trying to land your legs, what you are doing is starting to twist your body toward me. To complete the setting of your legs, you will have to complete turning me over so the front of your body can further face the ground and allow your body to pivot more to place the setting of your knees. Now, you did acknowledge the fact that I could hit into you, but then is where you started the performance of the arm pull. Now, how can you do something like that after failing to straddle Athena? Looking at the timing of this all, you will already be turning on your back because of that. Athena is still pushing into you, so when you messed up in that attempt to straddle, you went ahead and tried that arm pull, but again, looking at the timing, you would already be turning on your back.
The way you are doing your movements, you believe that despite it all, you still can move without falling over or being placed in another position. Athena is pushing into your upper body with her entire weight. Focusing it all here, that's more than enough to counter against your lean, especially since she has the initiative. I stated before that she was moving away from your legs so she can use a force against Merry's upper body to her advantage while you missed that leg grab. I do know that you can somehow oppose it, but so far, you haven't shown a decent way that is physically possible in the process of these situations.
As for the hand placement, Athena's left hand is grasping Merry's right. Athena is using her right hand to press into Merry's left shoulder, the only hand free, as well as Merry's. I also gave a detailed explanation of that situation, too.
But this is where it becomes complicated because despite it all, we both have our own opinions on how we are suppose to do something, so therefore, that is one flaw of hand to hand combat.
----------------------------------------------
So, how about instead of arguing, let us come to a negotiation. We both let go of one another and move away, return to our feet, and start our assaults again. Clean the slate to say. This is one fight it seems that neither of us can just walk away from without satisfaction, so best that will allow ourselves to learn from our mistakes in our previous posts and start anew. Unlike some of the fights I have seen, and you have too, many of the fighters get too engaged in trying to prove themselves right, and then the fight is ceased. But let us show more maturity and do something more honorable. I am not saying that you are wrong or right. I am only making a deal here that you may like.
Accept?
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:44 pm
Merry: Fail leglock due to knee in stomach. Diverts knee away from stomach, goes for straddle and pin. Parry and counter of Athena's grab at her left arm. Headbutt.
Athena: Shift Merry off to avoid straddle, still lifting self up to knock Merry over. Avoid counter-armgrab into a stalemate hold.
Merry: Fail straddle, return to kneeling with more solid base. Leans hard into Athena to prevent being toppled, also jerks violently on right arm to pull Athena's left arm out from under her. Another attempt at headbutt.
Athena: States that Merry is falling, that Merry jerking her arm is pointless since she's falling, that the knee previously mentioned is still in her stomach. Simultaneously pulling down on Merry's left arm and pushing her left shoulder back with ONLY right hand. Merry falls and Athena goes for an elbow drop to the face.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:51 pm
Skysong Moonsword Merry: Fail leglock due to knee in stomach. Diverts knee away from stomach, goes for straddle and pin. Parry and counter of Athena's grab at her left arm. Headbutt. Athena: Shift Merry off to avoid straddle, still lifting self up to knock Merry over. Avoid counter-armgrab into a stalemate hold. Merry: Fail straddle, return to kneeling with more solid base. Leans hard into Athena to prevent being toppled, also jerks violently on right arm to pull Athena's left arm out from under her. Another attempt at headbutt. Athena: States that Merry is falling, that Merry jerking her arm is pointless since she's falling, that the knee previously mentioned is still in her stomach. Simultaneously pulling down on Merry's left arm and pushing her left shoulder back with ONLY right hand. (Knee is still there because diverting of knee would require more than just a turn of her body. Since her leg had avoided her leg sweep/grab, she was able to push into it, and thus this is where the push begins. If she twists her body to try to divert knee then, would already cause herself to fall backwards, which would place Athena's right knee on the other side of her, which would then seen as a normal straddle. As for clearance of hand positions, left hand is grasping the wrist of the right arm of Merry, who is also grasping back. The right hand of Athena is the only thing free, so pushes it down against Merry's left shoulder. It was only as a way to place a little more force and to support the topple. For if Athena did not place her hand, she wouldn't be able to create a stable force and could be easily thrown otherwise. ) Merry falls and Athena goes for an elbow drop to the face.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:55 pm
I diverted the knee because I wasn't JUST turning my lower body. I was moving forward as well, which would make your knee slide across my stomach/hips and OFF OF MY BODY.
Athena... I know where I am in relation to you. The only time I twisted anything was in the process of trying to straddle, when I change my facing. Instead of you and I being face-to-face like when we landed, I am more on your right side, LIKE I STATED IN MY PM. Since I failed my straddle, all I did was move backwards off of you and readjust my legs under me.
I can do the arm pull even though I failed the straddle, because you're supporting yourself on your left arm, and YOU ARE HOLDING MY RIGHT ARM. Since I failed the straddle, I didn't lean backward, I MOVED MY WHOLE BODY AWAY FROM YOU. I am still upright because I moved away, even thought you're leaning into me.
I am not going to break from this. I can win, it's just a matter of you being able to follow the logic, instead of ignoring what I'm telling you in favor of what you want to/think should happen.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:57 pm
So if my knee is sliding, which way is it being diverted: upwards or back toward the ground?
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:57 pm
To the side. It would be my right and your left.
Technically, your knee would still be moving forward for you... but pushed more toward your other leg.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:59 pm
And so, if the arm pull didn't happen, as an example, then Athena could have her right knee touch the ground to place her on her knees, too, right? And thus, you would be in on my right side, is that what you're trying to say?
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:03 pm
Yes. But since you've never stated that you're fully upright, I'm assuming that you're still using your left arm for support.
Which is, logically, why my arm pull would work. Unless you released my arm entirely, that is.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:06 pm
I did state that I was upright, but on my left side. I am using my left knee and left arm for support as I did say in one of my posts, which is why I was facing you before performing the push into your body.
And Athena is not releasing Merry's arm because Merry has yet to release Athena's.
And finally, how is your left arm and hand positioned? It seems like that's the only body part that looks vague in positioning for me.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:10 pm
I don't know how you can use your right arm for support when it's attached to my left, and I wouldn't give you that kind of support. I'm also more on your right side, so you would have to be simultaneously pushing your right arm away from you to knock me down, and pull back on that same arm to hold you up.
When you went for the grab, I moved my entire forearm above yours, to grasp it above the elbow. You countered by using your forearm against my wrist to grab my arm, which would, if I hadn't gotten a good grip on your upper arm, pushed my hand into your body. But I'm still gripping your upper arm and pushing back into you.
I have a more solid base and more weight on my side, so I'm pretty sure that the leaning-fight is going to fall in my favor.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:12 pm
Sorry. Made a typo, but I just fixed it when you replied. Her left knee and left arm.
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:17 pm
That's fine. But that's precisely why my arm-pull would work, since your left hand his still holding onto my right wrist.
... See? sweatdrop
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:19 pm
Yep. The only thing I was not clear about is how you were moving your body. From the way it was sounding, it was as if you had pivoted over to my right side, as if I was still on my back. But with things now cleared up, I can continue this fight with a better picture.
But one question you haven't answered, how is your left arm in all of this? I need a clearer picture of it so Athena can perform her movements naturally.
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