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Fenrir SongMoon

PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 1:18 pm


Actually, I think the reason no one suggested it was because Sey said in no uncertain terms that 6 Elemental Spirits were the first beings ever, period.

I didn't mean to make Earth more important, it just seemed to be a good vehicle for the story to make Earth upset over something the others had done, and it explained how the world was created while I was at it. I don't think earth is really favored at all in the story, he just has a different part than all the others which makes him seem more unique. I'm pretty certain I could rewrite it more complex so everyone seemed unique, but I was just putting down words off the top of my head without any forethought.

Also, I know we weren't supposed to be cliche, but I also thought we were supposed to make Dark the bad guy. Everything i've gathered from what Sey has said is that Dark is an evil force in WoG. When I first wrote the story, it made Dark out to be a victim of circumstance, and claimed everything taht he did wrong was an accident. But I remembered he was supposed to be evil, so I went back and changed a few sentences so that it was now on purpose and he seemed jealous because of dialogue. Seriously, I think the difference in the two versions was me deleting three sentences and putting two new ones in. I could easily change it back.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 5:34 pm


Oops, sorry about that, Fen. I guess I missed that. XD. Well, it was an attempt. And, VTMarik, monotheism is kinda boring, but, wouldn't polytheism be boring if it was done a lot, too?

Nicholai Maxwell


Psychotic Nature

PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:30 pm


Nicholai Maxwell
Oops, sorry about that, Fen. I guess I missed that. XD. Well, it was an attempt. And, VTMarik, monotheism is kinda boring, but, wouldn't polytheism be boring if it was done a lot, too?

Not really, cause when you got bored with your gods, you could just make up some more cooler ones. Like Jonavax, Lord of Rhinoplasty.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:50 pm


No reason to apologize to me. whee Actually, I went back and reread what she said, and it isn't that they are the first, it's that they are the ultimate. Of course, that generally goes hand in hand... So... yeah. Of course, it could be said that some power created them, but they got out of control and became more powerful than their creator...

Fenrir SongMoon


Hugin the Raven
Crew

PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 9:05 pm


Okay... here's the deal about Water, Lao Fei's elemental alignment:


  • One of the perfect conduits for both extremes of temperature

  • Works with all of the elements, not against them

  • Can be many forms, and is constantly changing and adapting


If water were personified, she would be a mediator, not a participant in the battle- though water can crash just as easily as it flows. Fight when the other opponent starts, and things of the sort. The peaceful sister, you know?

Just my opinion, though.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 9:52 pm


...

I don't think that we necessarily need to isolate one of the elements as being bad at all. This is supposed to be a free form game with a few rules attached. The reason THE DARKNESS was the enemy in the last version was because Tatriel, who was the main villain, chose to make his character associated with darkness. He could just as easily done a different element, or none at all. Since I took over for him, and am currently associated with darkness, the main villain (I do still qualify for the position, I hope) is of the dark, so the point is moot. I'm not going to revamp my character's entire persona because people think that dark as villain is a cliche; I like Gensou too much as he is. I think you'll find that I come up with creative and fresh ways to work with the material.

As far as I know, I'm the main bad guy, and Lumina is the main bad place.

Now, this doesn't mean that legends have to be made to fit the current story. There can be plenty of legends that aren't biased against the dark element; they just need to be from quite a while ago, and extremely obscure.

Truewind


Hugin the Raven
Crew

PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 10:24 pm


"Darkness is not always synonymous with evil."

-Rett Butler, Rebirth
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 12:00 am


You're quoting from a manga to fling poo at my position? stressed Great source there. Yeah.

In case you hadn't noticed, I never said it was. It just happens to be, in this case. domokun

Truewind


Kairos

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 2:17 am


Darkness may be used to symbolize evil... but then really, what is the true nature of evil? Is one simply born that way, or do they become evil over time? And do they realize that they're evil...? >.> <.<

Well.... I finally got enough gold again to join WoG sweatdrop though I suppose I should redo my bio and everything. Joyous.

On a sidenote, I'll be... scarce... till life becomes unbusy and the stupid computer decides that it wants the internet to bloody WORK DAMMIT.

Yep. And that's all I have to say for now. >.>
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 3:26 am


Mmm, I'm happy with a lot of stuff that I've just read. 3nodding whee Toe curling, warm and fuzzy happy. Either that or my coffee's doing something funny to my head. eek

You might have some people giving you a run for your money on your main antagonist role Truewind domokun I don't want to stuff the evil on only one person's shoulders. Might as well have people duke it out over the ebil role; makes us goodie goodies freak out about how many people are itching to kill our peace and quiet.

I knew I was going to say something else...

Yes Josh, come kill us all. It'll give us something to do. xd

And Truewind, you play RO - do you know of any good wedding guides out there? I was thinking of having the ceremony outside of Prontera Grand Cathedral and at Comodo xd On the stage... Or better yet on one of the islands or something. It's so pretty there... whee I found a good guide on emperium.org but nuffing else. crying

I need to take a headclearing shower before I go off and start commenting on these stories. Reading in a half asleep state isn't fair to the writers or to me. xd

Sey
Captain


Sey
Captain

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 4:26 am


eek That was... a LOT of PMs and bios.

:: shakes out her semi emptied inbox ::
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 7:52 am


Something that occurred to me yesterday morning. I wouldn't have done one, but this got into my head.

my attempt at a creation story
First there was only free magic, and it existed in a void of black nothingness. This nothingness drew from the free magic and grew in size, power, and intelligence until it became a sentient being known as Dark. It continued to draw from the free magic, becoming more and more powerful. It loved its power and contemplated the extent of it. While experimenting with it, it occurred to Dark that it's power was spread out because of it's size, and so it decided to see how much power it really had by concentrating itself to a single point. In the process of doing so, it removed all darkness from the area it had made to support itself, causing an interesting effect. By removing all of nothing from the space Dark had made to accommodate itself, something was left in its place.

This something was the opposite of Dark, and occupied the former area that Dark did, though it was not yet aware of itself. An Dark reveled in its power, the new thing began to absorb free magic as Dark once did, and became aware. Dark observed the new being in awe, but the more it thought about it, the more it realized that it didn't want anything else taking up it's power. It expanded itself back to full, in an attempt to fill the space once again and swallow up the new being. Though it was largely successful, a little bit remained that could not be consumed. Dark was satisfied that it was only a little point and so accepted it as a creature of similar intelligence but less power, a younger sibling of sorts. The being became known as Light, and though Dark took most power for itself, it could not stop Light from becoming more powerful.

As it did gain power, it began to push against Dark a bit. Eventually, it caused Dark to shrink back when it touched it. Dark became angry and attempted to devour Light once again, but Light fought back and pushed back Dark. This began a long war between the two, who fought over the free magic and the power it brought, as well as over who would ultimately devour who.

As Light became more powerful, Dark eventually figured out how to suppress Light and stop it from destroying it on contact. At this time, however, they were equal in power. They tried, but neither could destroy the other. At some point, Light conceived of an idea. It would make a weapon, one that would catch Dark off guard again and finish it this time. This weapon was known as Fire, and it was a terrible thing. It gave off light, as Light did, but also another force, a burning. It was made to rapidly grow in power by feeding off the free magic. It gained a sentience in the process, but was still wild and destructive. It violently attacked Dark, wounding it greatly again and again. Unfourtunately for the younger Elemental, Dark was finally able to create a counter force to calm the flames before it was destroyed, which later became known as Water.

Dark was furious and decided to create a weapon of its own. This became known as Earth. It could withstand the heat and power of fire, and launched it's earthy attacks at Light. Light was trapped under the barrage, and with Water countering Fire, it was suffering heavily form the combo of Dark and Earth. It contemplated, even as it was being destroyed, on what such power could overcome this new weapon.

Finally, it created what it considered to be the best weapon yet, the force known as Air. Air formed a barrier that kept Earth's attacks from damaging Light (similar to how a meteor would burn up in the atmosphere) As a attack, Light forged for this force a weapon mage of Light and Fire, and it was known as lightning. It would light the darkness and shake the Earth with its roar. The lightning bolts seemed to have an effect on water too, though it was not the damaging effect that was hoped for.

In this war, Air and Water both wished for an end to the conflict. Somewhere along the way, they grew to like each other, though their creators opposed each other. Earth was angered, as they wanted Water for itself, and forever aligned itself against Air. The spirits continued fighting and growing more powerful, Water and Fire canceling out, Air blocking Earth and assaulting Dark, and Light free to support Air. Dark was now in danger of being destroyed, and might have been if a new threat had not presented itself.

Fire, which had grown the most rapidly of all, had continued greedily consuming free magic, and had become insane with its own power. Eventually it reached a point where Water was not enough to stop it. It broke through Water's assault, greatly injuring it. Air, enraged, stopped its assault against Dark and attempted to prevent Fire from destroying Water. Earth also did its part to protect the object of its non returned affections. Dark, realizing what happened also attempted to attack.

As they each approached Fire, they were defeated, and came to the horrible realization that if Fire was now stronger that Water, then it was much stronger than any of them individually. As Light stepped up to Fire and told it to stop attacking Air, it was also smote by Fire, and realized that Fire was out of control. Seeing that everyone was against it, Fire attempted to destroy all of them where they were. All the other spirits were forced to combine their powers to stand against it. The battle raged for eons, until they eventually came up with a plan.

Earth being the strongest (in a physical sense) surrounded Fire and trapped it inside a ball of rock. As Fire began to heat and melt it, Water made a layer of water to cool off the ball. Air, rushing to help its beloved, surrounded the ball with a barrier of air to further trap Fire under the ground. Air and Water joined their powers to create ice, which they used to keep the ball cold. Light and Dark took turns watching over the ball and stopping any breakout attempts by Fire. Light did not trust Dark, so it made the stars to keep an eye on Dark while it was away. Dark did not trust Light either, and created shadows which hid from the light, behind objects, to watch it in case it tried to regain control of Fire.

Thus Gaia was created, as well as other things. From the alternating shifts of Light and Dark, day, night, and time itself came into being. The sun was made as the watchman of Light during the day. Light tainted an attempt by Dark and Earth to make a night based version of the sun, thereby creating the moon. As it had the influence of both Light and Dark, their control over it cycled. Sometimes it woul be a full disk of light, and sometimes it appeared non-existant, but usually it was somewhere inbetween. The moon eventually became insane because of this.

Air and Water made the clouds, which have the abilities of them both, as well as the power of ice and cold. These caused the climate of the planet to shift and form seasons. The previous battle had left the spirits somewhat weak and had scattered bits of them around which had formed into smaller spirits. These spirits were made to live on Gaia and help keep the elements in check. The combinations of the elements over the planet brought about other creations, most notably the thing called "life."

The interaction of the powers of Water and Earth formed plants who were fed by light and helped purify the air. Animals arose from the earth. Water used this knowledge to create fish and other creatures of the oceans and seas. Earth wanted to keep this secret to itself, or at least as a thing between it and Water, but Water shared it with Air and so birds were brought into being. They didn't dare share it with Fire, and Light and Dark could only make odd creatures of energy or shadows, save the creation of nocturnal animals and plants with the help of other elements. Light decided to work for the preservation of life, and Dark being its rival, decided to investigate the other aspect of life, namely it's end and that which happens after. Still, Water wanted something that everyone could share. Quickly getting Earth and Dark on its side, it got Air to ask Light, who agreed and, rather than freeing Fire, recreated a bit of the element for the process. Together they combined their powers and made humans. Over time, a few other races were made by the spirits, but they were usually derivations of humans.

Now, though everything was peaceful for a while, there were still underlying conflicts. Light and Dark were still rivals in everything, and Earth was still jealous of Air. It made a deal with Fire to allow it to come to the surface in the form of lava and volcanoes that spewed ash and such into the air. Fire was able to limitedly influence things, though most of it was still trapped in the planet, rather than free to move about the elemental plane.

The spirits then realized that power was one thing to covet, influence and area were others. They looked at the creatures of the planet, particularly the human types. Seeing how the humans worshipped some gods, they desired that kind of admiration for themselves. They chose special people from each and allowed them to be able to use the smaller spirits to perform magical feats. They influenced people and vied for control of the world.

Light and Dark were still rivals, each calling followers of the other blasphemers and heretics. Fire and Water, Air and Earth did so to a lesser extent. The goal of Dark and Light was to fully expand their influence over the world and totally eliminate the other from it. Earth continued plotting the downfall of Air, who itself was carefree and neutral in the matters, though Air had a habit of being a trouble maker for the people of Gaia. Water remained pure and innocent, wanting to better the life of the people and stop bad things if necessary. Fire lived to destroy everything that had been built over him. They controlled and manipulated legions of people and spirits. They also made weapons known as lesser elementals who were able to be called on by some.

As a last thing before they began openly fighting, Water managed to get the others to agree to put a portion of their power into special items that would allow the powers of Gaia to stay in balance even if the Elementals were all destroyed. If they could not stop the fighting, they would at least preserve the planet in case someone won. These items were given to special humans to protect. Now, the spirits continue opposing each other, plotting because of personal reasons, and generally doing the same that they have been doing since before the dawn of time and will continue until they destroy one another and fade away, or perhaps are affected by the intervention of the creatures that they seek to control...

Psychotic Nature


Owle Isohos

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 8:27 am


Whoa. eek PN, that was cool. *gives standing ovation*

And, Truewind, I'm not saying I have anything against a dark-aligned evil guy...cause I don't. 3nodding I'm just saying I don't want the element of Dark itself to be evil. Most people can think it is, and most followers of Dark can be evil, but the element itself should be neutral. I just like it that way, especially because Tiel can't exist if Dark is evil or insane. And I realize that that's more or less exactly what you said.

On that note, Fenny, probably a lot of creation stories do make Dark the bad guy...the bias had to come from somewhere (maybe something people did, or even something Dark did that was misinterpreted.) And the bias is probably written in lots and lots of traditions. I think the creation story I came up with is probably a pretty obscure one...

And, yeah, I know in my creation story that Light and Dark could just as easily have their roles reversed, with Light being the first and Dark being the one Free Magic created. Heck, I could write a version of my story that made Dark evil. eek Which kind of scares me. Actually, I could write two seperate versions of my story that make Dark evil... sweatdrop I need to stop thinking so much.

Nicholai, the reason no one's made some other god give birth to the elements is because Sey doesn't want any higher beings than the elements, which is why she didn't like Jello's story about Destruction and Creation. I think someone said that already, but I don't remember who, so, yeah...
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 10:23 am


Hello... ninja

Zan Ogatai


Owle Isohos

PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2004 11:25 am


Hello! Welcome to WoG. Or, if you were in WoG before and I just never saw you, nice to meet you. 3nodding
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WoG v1.75 - Nostalgia

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