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 Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:01 pm
Maduo2 zombies often have souls, as they are still decomposing and whatnot into skeletals, though I have heard of skeletons not having shadows before... but generally you don't see too many rotting piles of flesh that DON'T have shadows xd vamps don't rot in a sense of the definition.. maybe you were the one thinking of the dead when you wrote that wink proven fact: vampires hunt, eat, and sleep, those are basic instincts, you don't need a soul to do those. anyways, i've come to a conclusion that remy is not actually a vampire, but a humanpire.. yup, that's right, she was originally a bat that was bitten by ozzy osbourne and turned into a human. No other solution could possibly make any sense =) Let me dissect and destroy your argument please. First, ZOMBIES, not ANY OTHER TYPE OF UNDEAD, do not have souls on their own. They do however have some kind of controlling force. This force may be external such as a vampire, necromancer, etc. or internal, such as a virus or evil spirit. You may argue that that evil spirit is a soul. Well, yes, this is true, but it is usually NOT the soul of the person when s/he was alive, and I think that is the subject of our conversation. Second, some lower vampires DO rot VERY SLOWLY. That is why they take in blood to slow down and reverse it. Third, to hunt, eat, and sleep on your own DOES require a soul because instincts is part of a soul. The only creatures NOT to have souls are lower level undead, zombies, as you so eloquently pointed out, and mechaniloid-level robots, as opposed to reploids, who do have souls. Finally, Remilia, your theory is... interesting to say the very least, but you're pretty much saying that she's a bat yokai? Well, Mystia did call her a bat in Remilia and Sakuya's story of Imperishable Night, but even if that's the case, I thought it had anything to do with Osbourne. I think it was just through bat meditation and training through a period of time. That's usually how an animal becomes a yokai. A bat yokai would be vampiric by nature. Remilia doesn't seemed to be turned undead either, so... In conclusion, Remilia (and Flandre, by extension) is either a bat yokai, or more much likely, a True Ancestor-class vampire.
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Posted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 4:20 am
MidBossVyers Maduo2 zombies often have souls, as they are still decomposing and whatnot into skeletals, though I have heard of skeletons not having shadows before... but generally you don't see too many rotting piles of flesh that DON'T have shadows xd vamps don't rot in a sense of the definition.. maybe you were the one thinking of the dead when you wrote that wink proven fact: vampires hunt, eat, and sleep, those are basic instincts, you don't need a soul to do those. anyways, i've come to a conclusion that remy is not actually a vampire, but a humanpire.. yup, that's right, she was originally a bat that was bitten by ozzy osbourne and turned into a human. No other solution could possibly make any sense =) Let me dissect and destroy your argument please. First, ZOMBIES, not ANY OTHER TYPE OF UNDEAD, do not have souls on their own. They do however have some kind of controlling force. This force may be external such as a vampire, necromancer, etc. or internal, such as a virus or evil spirit. You may argue that that evil spirit is a soul. Well, yes, this is true, but it is usually NOT the soul of the person when s/he was alive, and I think that is the subject of our conversation. Second, some lower vampires DO rot VERY SLOWLY. That is why they take in blood to slow down and reverse it. Third, to hunt, eat, and sleep on your own DOES require a soul because instincts is part of a soul. The only creatures NOT to have souls are lower level undead, zombies, as you so eloquently pointed out, and mechaniloid-level robots, as opposed to reploids, who do have souls. Finally, Remilia, your theory is... interesting to say the very least, but you're pretty much saying that she's a bat yokai? Well, Mystia did call her a bat in Remilia and Sakuya's story of Imperishable Night, but even if that's the case, I thought it had anything to do with Osbourne. I think it was just through bat meditation and training through a period of time. That's usually how an animal becomes a yokai. A bat yokai would be vampiric by nature. Remilia doesn't seemed to be turned undead either, so... In conclusion, Remilia (and Flandre, by extension) is either a bat yokai, or more much likely, a True Ancestor-class vampire. Instincts are lower than consiousness, so they actually wouldn't indicate that one has a soul. High-level thinking and awareness of self is what would determine that. So yes, Remilia definately has a soul. As for the bat yokai theory, only a vampire, hairy-legged, or white-legged bat would be vampiric. Also, Flandre as a "normal" bat would be...odd.
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Posted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:02 am
No, but instincts are "included" in a soul. Not everything that has a soul thinks "high-levelly". For example, given that humans have souls, I ask, given your logic that only sentient beings have souls, what about homo habilis, homo erectus, etc.? Being sentient and having a soul are two entirely different things. And no, this was not just an excuse to say "homo erectus", so don't make any jokes about that.
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Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:41 am
MidBossVyers No, but instincts are "included" in a soul. Not everything that has a soul thinks "high-levelly". For example, given that humans have souls, I ask, given your logic that only sentient beings have souls, what about homo habilis, homo erectus, etc.? Being sentient and having a soul are two entirely different things. And no, this was not just an excuse to say "homo erectus", so don't make any jokes about that. I'm talking about things waaay lower. Some things don't even have a full brain, if any, and function more like the wiring in a car, screaming at you when you start it up without buckling first.
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Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:51 am
Care to write an example?
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Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:21 am
Okay China, Mid-Boss.
I think I know a way to solve this discussion, But I'll need a pair of tweezers, a giraffe, around two metric tons of boiling spaghetti, a loaf of french bread, the Necronomicon, Rumia, Cirno, some of Yuyuko's butterflies, Shanghai Doll #404, and a Boeing 747.
Oh, and three feet of dental floss, and a chicken pot pie, some road flares, and a roll of duct tape.
......But how am I gonna get the giraffe to tap dance.....?
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Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 2:04 pm
How? Mind control, of course. But anyway, do what you need to to solve this issue. I'd greatly like to see the results of your "experiment". Of course, if mind control fails, then just find a dead giraffe and have Orin "charm" it into doing whatever it is you need it to do.
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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:28 am
Okay then, although.....I totally forgot why it needed the road flares and duct tape. xD
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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:52 am
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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:32 am
Okay then.
.....But I can't help but feel that there was something important they were supposed to do.
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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:02 pm
Well, if you can't figure it out, then it's pointless to think about it, right? On a slightly different note, I want to Touhou-mod my Love Death 2 but can't seem to find the time. As such, I'm planning to allocate my Castlevania playtime to Love Death 2 Touhou-mod time... Yes, that was random.
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Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 2:47 am
I can't think of any at the moment, and I don't really want to spent hours looking for examples, but the parts that are the primitive form of brains are nerve clusters called ganglia. Basically, if something acts entirely out of predetermined actions (instincts) and reacts soley on reflex, it couldn't possibly have a soul. Modern computers are even higher than that.
Really though, what makes something have a soul is conciousness. Unfortunately, we can't measure that. If we knew how all that worked, I'd be working on transfering myself to another body this very moment, if I hadn't already done so.
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Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 1:37 pm
Not-Quite so Mid-Boss, I fall under the TV Tropes category of Mad Scientist Who Must Have Caffeine. If I'm not chugging some sort of carbonated drink or Coffee, I'm screwing around with weird ideas. ....Half of which I forget soon after having. sweatdrop
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Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 4:24 pm
Meiling the Mighty I can't think of any at the moment, and I don't really want to spent hours looking for examples, but the parts that are the primitive form of brains are nerve clusters called ganglia. Basically, if something acts entirely out of predetermined actions (instincts) and reacts soley on reflex, it couldn't possibly have a soul. Modern computers are even higher than that. Really though, what makes something have a soul is conciousness. Unfortunately, we can't measure that. If we knew how all that worked, I'd be working on transfering myself to another body this very moment, if I hadn't already done so. One can reincarnate into any living thing. As such, every living thing has a soul. Higher undeath does not remove said soul.
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