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I think for a lot of the same-sex partners it's more than that but that is one of the reasons and I've seen it in articles myself.

I wasn't implying that you're a Christian. I can obviously tell you're not. I was just making a general statement.

Just because someone knows what is going to happen, it doesn't necessarily mean that they have to change it from happening. It works like this: God creates you the way you are in hopes of you loving Him back and thus attaining salvation. He knows exactly what is going to happen, and creates you with that knowledge. Now tell me, would it be fair if He decided, say, not to create you just because He knew you weren't going to end up loving Him? No, that's your choice and He gave you a right to live it the way you want to. If you live your life without loving him, than it's your own free will to do so. And about sinning. I think about it this way, one day most of us are hoping to be parents. Well if you really think about it, you know for sure that once in a while your kids are going to be complete headaches and are going to do things you don't want them to be doing. But does that stop you from having them? No because you hope that they will learn to love you as they grow.

Shouldn't that tell you they really believe in what they're talking about? If someone is seriously trying to do what they feel is right, than wouldn't you at least see that they have some convictions of which their actions are coming? If someone dies for a cause, wouldn't you then know that they felt the cause was worth dying for?

"Also, before I forget, I'd like to just make a statement about some of the proclaimed Christians and science. What I don't get is that someone will absolutely hate a "fortune-teller" or things that are scientific and then they'll go hop in a car and go home. People get plastic surgery which changes the features god gives them. People say "let god decide" in all these things like PVS patients, death penalty, and abortions but wouldn't God have decided even if we killed them or something? What if one of them was a profit to kill a new Hitler?" -can you please restate that I didn't quite understand it.

If it's in the Bible, God intended it.
It's in the Bible, I pointed that out already. God isn't pro-homosexuality.

Oh yes, don't worry, I know you're probably laughing at me. Though I never laugh when it comes to things like this. Peoples opinions aren't funny. Especially when they're honest convictions. Don't worry I've heard that before: the making up a God because you want one so badly. And frankly I don't think it's true.

Define religion and define spirituality.

Literalists should not be allowed to read nor know about the book of Revelations.

Woah. Well, I mean, I can't be mad at you for that. You have a point. Whether or not I am Christian or not, I like to question what people say and it seems that a lot of people would automatically think I'm bad for questioning it.

For example, what you say. You seem to have this certainty about what He, whoever He is, does. How can you honestly be so sure of it? Have you actually talked to God? Have you seen him go about doing this? If not, then you're only making claims in which you have no proof of. So, you can't rightly say that He does this and He doesn't do this. My theory could be very plausible even though it goes against their general consensus of Christians. Though, to be fair, my theory can be totally wrong and your theory can be totally right. Personally, I don't think your theory is right. I don't think someone can have free will if the creator knows exactly what you're going to do. I don't see it. I don't see how that's possible. If they already know then you don't have free will.

As of right now, yes. However, that makes no judgement on whether they are right or wrong but merely says that they are willing to go down for what they believe in.

Yeah, sorry, I can see how that can be confusing. Scientists and Christians, or people of God, seem to have a little tention between each other. People of God that are usually devout hate the idea of science and things like fortune-telling. Fortune-telling would be the person's view of what's going to happen rather than let's say what God thinks is going to happen. If people of God are against Science so much, then why do they hop in cars with no problem? Cars, I would say, come from Science. Why do they use computers if they're against Science?

The second part I can see as really confusing if you don't know the cases. First of all PVS is Persistant Vegatative State. It refers to someone basically have no motor skills and they really have no importance to life anymore (that might be a little biased but the basics of it). There have been cases recently involving PVS patients. The most recent one involved Terri Schiavo. She was PVS for years and a judge (judge Greer) ordered the removal of her feeding tube. A feeding tube provides the right type of nutrients and such to keep the person alive. The judge ordered the removal of it. In protesting the decision made by the judge people put out signs saying, "Let God decide." Ultimately that would mean keep them on the tube and let God decide when she should die. However, wouldn't God have decided her death if the judge ordered it? People of God I would think, think that everyone is a person of God, right? So, God could have ordered the judge to do that, per say. Plus, why can't God decide to take the feeding tube out? Right? That's what I meant by that and why it pisses me off. I also hate the fact that people speak for God.

The last question referred to abortions and them justifying abortion as wrong. They justify it by saying something like, "You could be aborting someone like Einstien because his mother was raped." I brought the idea up that you could be aborting someone like Hilter. It was just a contrast. The question was more rhetorical.

Yeah. That's where I think you have major potential to be wrong and you're just spitting out accusations like every other person of God. How do you know that God's intentions are in the bible? How come people back then could write in the bible but people can't write in the bible now? Are you really willing to trust the intentions and writings of people that are thought of to be more ignorant than we are and justify things stupidly?

I don't think people are really all that pious as they say they are. Shouldn't lightning be an act of God? Rather than certain elements forming to make it. Shouldn't fire being an act of God rather than fuel mixing with oxygen?

Yeah, again, that's where I think a lot of people make mistakes. Plus, to say that God isn't pro-homosexuality is ultimately speaking for God. God, someone that you've never seen, doesn't know exist, and all that good stuff. So, how can you honestly know what he would think or what he would be? What if he's changed his opinion since the scripture in the bible? Plus, why would someone that is percieved as so loving be against something that his people does? I just don't see, how he's percieved, that he could honestly be like, "Hey guys. I like p***s's and vaginas going together but none of this p***s on p***s action. Mmk?"

Eh, I laugh and poke fun at everyone's theories. Though, in all seriousness I can't deny the possibility of them being right. All theories of how we are here, why we are here, etc all have possibility.

Yes, but from what I've seen you might think differently. Maybe not. I've seen people that totally hate the theory of God or might not even know the theory of God. They're users of some serious drugs too. Some people will pick them up and help them out. Tell them what God is and things like that. Then they'll be all for it and everything. I've seen people in complete irrationality, crying their guts out and things like that, having absolutely no one in their life, and then turn to god and feel better. Why? I think there's a very huge possibility that they have a need to feel that someone cares about them. God is ultimately viewed as a someone. People don't want to be hated. They want to feel loved, wanted, needed and the God theory ultimately provides that for them. I can't blame 'em for that.

Wooh man. I don't want to make any accusations about this. For example, your soul and things like that. It would prove things. Hm... Spirituality, in general, is your state of being. Religion, in general, is your beliefs and morals. I hate people mixing those. I like the spirituality of the religions because they make people feel good about themselves by singing and things like that. That makes people feel good. Doing things for other people. Things like that. When they start getting into how you should run your life though, I hate that. Often times, people mix those. "The people of that Church are good because they helped build homes for homeless."

Whoops, sorry, I forgot to check this for a few times, but now that it's been bumped back up..

Yeah, I don't really like arguing much, because I know that neither of us will probably end up changing their minds about this topic, but yes I do see where you're coming from and understand what you're saying.

Anyways, I hope there's no hard feelings. I don't look upon you any differently because of what you believe. Actually I think you're cool for speaking your mind. So yeah, feel special.

Aite well back to randomly surfing gaia.

W00t w00t. Yeah, sorry I meant debating, hehe. And yes, that's how I feel to. I do think it sort of appropriate to quit right now, so I'm throwing in the towel. Mostly because it seems to me that with your standpoint, you will be correct in your own mind, and with mine I will be correct in my own opinion, and unless one of us sways to one side slightly, nothing really will be accomplished. But yes, at least I now understand where you're coming from. And I agree, I don't think differently of you, I just know more about you. smile

ok, Leviticus 18:22 says "Do not practice homosexuality; it is a detestale sin."