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thatsnozaku

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 9:06 pm


Mrs Joe Trohman
Swearing is like a second nature to me. It's all about how its intended.


Basically, what she said. I try not to do it in excess and actively try to cut back, but it's just a (contextually) bad habit of mine like for many posting here. I simply choose where and when to speak so freely, and apply it with respect for those around me (not just those I'm speaking to) in mind.
PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 3:09 pm


Meh it's a persons choice though. Me personally don't do it much but sometimes it helps to get anger out.

ll bunni ll


davidm843

PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 5:49 pm


PrayThatThisEnds
In fact, if you are a bodhisattva on the first level or higher, you can do any of the negative actions of body or speech - but by then, you are already emanating bodies, visiting Buddhas in other realms, and so on.


This is a complete misunderstanding of the bodhisattva path. Once a bodhisattva reaches the level you are describing, it is utterly impossible for him to engage in negative behaviors.
PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 5:56 pm


Speech is karma. Unwholesome speech is therefore unwholesome karma, and engaging in it will lead to unpleasant consequences. Unwholesome speech plants seeds of negativity in the minds of both the speaker and the listener. Unwholesome speech reflects poorly on the speaker and is a sign of a poor intellect. It has a negative effect on every one.

davidm843


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PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 8:17 pm


I was taught that a "swear" word is actually just a word that people find insulting. On a wide scale, the majority of the English speaking world will know what an English "swear" word is, however if people aren't insulted by it would it still be considered bad?

A couple examples of words that aren't considered swear words, but are still "bad" in some places, include a variety of words from the "N word"(which simply means ignorant and can be used for people that are white or otherwise just as much as black) to words as commonly used as "gay."

Because of this, I believe people who swear should simply follow three simple rules. Being from a military family, these three rules are rules I was taught as soon as the words started slipping into my vocabulary.

Rule 1: No swearing in front of children. Little kids can get in BIG trouble for saying certain words and by swearing in front of them whoever does so is responsible for having taught the words to them. So this is a big one.

Rule 2: No swearing in front of ladies. This rule may be slightly outdated since, nowadays, there are as many girls swearing as there are guys, but this is not meant as a sexist rule. It is simply meant to keep swearing men having the personality or at least the appearance of a gentleman. To keep the rule up to date, the rule simply doesn't apply when around ladies that either don't care or if they themselves swear as well.

Rule 3: No swearing in front of the elderly. This rule is entirely based upon a respect for your elders. If they don't want to hear it, they shouldn't have to, and it's our job to respect that.

David, I think your post is more a matter of interpretation than fact. If the speaker does not see negativity in his speech nor does the listener, I don't believe any negativity would be there because not only was none intended, but none was felt. If the speaker intends negativity, feels negativity, or sounds negative, and the listeners sense the negativity as well, then the negativity is most likely there and I could see unwholesome karma developing from that.
PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 9:09 pm


Master Shadow Kilo
I was taught that a "swear" word is actually just a word that people find insulting. On a wide scale, the majority of the English speaking world will know what an English "swear" word is, however if people aren't insulted by it would it still be considered bad?

A couple examples of words that aren't considered swear words, but are still "bad" in some places, include a variety of words from the "N word"(which simply means ignorant and can be used for people that are white or otherwise just as much as black) to words as commonly used as "gay."

Because of this, I believe people who swear should simply follow three simple rules. Being from a military family, these three rules are rules I was taught as soon as the words started slipping into my vocabulary.

Rule 1: No swearing in front of children. Little kids can get in BIG trouble for saying certain words and by swearing in front of them whoever does so is responsible for having taught the words to them. So this is a big one.

Rule 2: No swearing in front of ladies. This rule may be slightly outdated since, nowadays, there are as many girls swearing as there are guys, but this is not meant as a sexist rule. It is simply meant to keep swearing men having the personality or at least the appearance of a gentleman. To keep the rule up to date, the rule simply doesn't apply when around ladies that either don't care or if they themselves swear as well.

Rule 3: No swearing in front of the elderly. This rule is entirely based upon a respect for your elders. If they don't want to hear it, they shouldn't have to, and it's our job to respect that.

David, I think your post is more a matter of interpretation than fact. If the speaker does not see negativity in his speech nor does the listener, I don't believe any negativity would be there because not only was none intended, but none was felt. If the speaker intends negativity, feels negativity, or sounds negative, and the listeners sense the negativity as well, then the negativity is most likely there and I could see unwholesome karma developing from that.


If it's not wholesome enough to say in front of children, ladies, and the elderly, what it makes it wholesome enough to say in front of other people? It's either correct to say, or it is not. It's when people try to finagle the rules and come up exceptions, they are really just trying to justify and minimize their poor behavior. If you wouldn't say it in front of your grandma or a priest, you shouldn't say it. Karma simply doesn't make exceptions. If you wanna curse, then curse. But it is unskillful and unwholesome karma and there will be unpleasant results. It really is that simple. Don't take my word for it, ask your dharma teacher. That's the beauty (or curse, depending on your mind set) of Buddhadharma, you are responsible, no matter what.

davidm843


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PostPosted: Sun May 02, 2010 9:41 pm


alright guys, i swear.

i don't usually swear in a confrontational manner to people,
such as any names, or any derivative sayings including the word '******** i don't deny the use of such language,
i don't condone losing your vocabulary to it as it may become
a habit that is hard to break.

I also think that use of such language is fine if all parties
present are undeterred by its use, and do not see it offensively.

If offensive to someone, just respect their opinion.
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 5:37 am


davidm843

If it's not wholesome enough to say in front of children, ladies, and the elderly, what it makes it wholesome enough to say in front of other people? It's either correct to say, or it is not. It's when people try to finagle the rules and come up exceptions, they are really just trying to justify and minimize their poor behavior. If you wouldn't say it in front of your grandma or a priest, you shouldn't say it. Karma simply doesn't make exceptions. If you wanna curse, then curse. But it is unskillful and unwholesome karma and there will be unpleasant results. It really is that simple. Don't take my word for it, ask your dharma teacher. That's the beauty (or curse, depending on your mind set) of Buddhadharma, you are responsible, no matter what.


That looks like a very close minded point of view. First of all, I see nothing negative about it nor do those I say such things around, therefore there is nothing negative being formed by myself. Second, the point of the rules is to avoid saying things that would offend others around those that would be offended and, honestly, no matter what you say there is somebody who can, and possibly will, be offended including this conversation we are having right now. Thirdly, karma has allot of catching up to do with me.

I have had things rough, that is true, but it is to my understanding that the punishment for our actions is supposed to be equivalent to our "crime" and no such equivalency has been seen within the past two decades. Considering this fact some time ago, I looked into karma. My conclusion on it is, as surprising as it is to many people, karma exists for one reason and one reason only: we believe it does. If we do not believe in karma, it does not affect us in the same way. If we do believe in karma, it is what is called a self-fulfilled prophecy. It happens because we believe it should. If we don't believe it should, it won't, and that is why it hasn't.

If the punishment is supposed to be for when we get to the next life, so be it. I'll cross those roads when I reach them.

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davidm843

PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 1:51 pm


Master Shadow Kilo
That looks like a very close minded point of view. First of all, I see nothing negative about it nor do those I say such things around, therefore there is nothing negative being formed by myself. Second, the point of the rules is to avoid saying things that would offend others around those that would be offended and, honestly, no matter what you say there is somebody who can, and possibly will, be offended including this conversation we are having right now. Thirdly, karma has allot of catching up to do with me.

I have had things rough, that is true, but it is to my understanding that the punishment for our actions is supposed to be equivalent to our "crime" and no such equivalency has been seen within the past two decades. Considering this fact some time ago, I looked into karma. My conclusion on it is, as surprising as it is to many people, karma exists for one reason and one reason only: we believe it does. If we do not believe in karma, it does not affect us in the same way. If we do believe in karma, it is what is called a self-fulfilled prophecy. It happens because we believe it should. If we don't believe it should, it won't, and that is why it hasn't.

If the punishment is supposed to be for when we get to the next life, so be it. I'll cross those roads when I reach them.


Again I have to ask, WHO is teaching you this? This is not in accord with what the Buddha taught about karma. Do you have a qualified dharma teacher?

The idea of karma being a punishment is a complete misunderstanding of the Buddha's teachings on karma. Karma is (and this is admittedly a gross oversimplification) the law of cause and effect. Do you really think that there are "effects" that arise with no cause, or "causes" that don't produce an effect?
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 2:30 pm


As I have said before, although in other threads and not to you, nobody. I learn what I know from various sources. What I have been talking to you about have come from three.

One: Personal experience, I don't believe in karma because everything I have seen and witnessed states that the only reason karma exists is that we believe it exists. Those who believe in karma, I have seen it affect them. Those that do not, I have not. For severe things you might say it does, a guy robs a bank, gets caught, goes to jail, some call it karma. I call it justice. When it comes to killing bugs and insects: Cause; insect will die. Effect; insect is dead. Does it extend beyond that? If so, who can prove it and how?

Two: Family and friends, I believe that if karma exists at all beyond the confines of the beliefs of others, then it is greatly dependent if not entirely so on the interpretations of the individuals who will be affected. This is a matter of what is good and what is bad, if not there would not be "good" karma and "bad" karma. What is good to others is not necessarily good to others, what is bad to some is not necessarily bad to others. It is entirely based on who is interpreting whether it is good or bad and how they choose to do so.

Three: In the case of the three words, "craving," "desire," and "wanting," it was a book called Essential Spirituality and was written by Roger Walsh. This book is not about Buddhism, it's about Spirituality, and the majority of what is in this book I do trust because the majority of it I learned from personal experience before even knowing it was in existence.

There are other sources for what I know and believe, but most of those would not apply to what we have discussed. Unless I'm forgetting something.

No, I am not 100% entirely Buddhist. If I were to give my beliefs a name, I would have to say that I am a Christian-Buddhist-Taoist, as I have. I follow believes and practices from all three religions and use teachings from all three religions to help others. For the sects, I would be a Southern Baptist Christian and a Zen Buddhist. Taoism I don't know much about sects for, I just read from the Tao Te Ching and do as much research as I can. I am not anywhere near being an expert in Buddhism, nor will I claim to be possibly even once I am, but I will learn more.

I also have some beliefs and traditional practices from my Native American ancestry, I was taught how to smudge and communicate with spirit guides(meditate) while I was young.

Fortunately for me, assuming everything goes as it should, I'll be in Colorado soon and living in an area where it shouldn't be to hard to find a Buddhist and/or a Taoist teacher to help me further my knowledge and maybe even strengthen my dedication.

Lord Alucard Ere Casanova

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davidm843

PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 4:06 pm


Master Shadow Kilo
No, I am not 100% entirely Buddhist. If I were to give my beliefs a name, I would have to say that I am a Christian-Buddhist-Taoist, as I have. I follow believes and practices from all three religions and use teachings from all three religions to help others. For the sects, I would be a Southern Baptist Christian and a Zen Buddhist. Taoism I don't know much about sects for, I just read from the Tao Te Ching and do as much research as I can. I am not anywhere near being an expert in Buddhism, nor will I claim to be possibly even once I am, but I will learn more.

I also have some beliefs and traditional practices from my Native American ancestry, I was taught how to smudge and communicate with spirit guides(meditate) while I was young.

Fortunately for me, assuming everything goes as it should, I'll be in Colorado soon and living in an area where it shouldn't be to hard to find a Buddhist and/or a Taoist teacher to help me further my knowledge and maybe even strengthen my dedication.


This definitely explains why you are so confused about what the Buddha taught. "Buffet spirituality" is very popular now days, I hope it works for you. My experience is that when we choose "a little bit of this and a little of that" from various traditions, we tend to leave out the hard parts that will actually transform our lives. Feels good for a little while, just like selecting solely desserts from the buffet is fun for a while. But after while, it just doesn't provide proper nourishment, and we get sick.
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 4:48 pm


davidm843
This definitely explains why you are so confused about what the Buddha taught. "Buffet spirituality" is very popular now days, I hope it works for you. My experience is that when we choose "a little bit of this and a little of that" from various traditions, we tend to leave out the hard parts that will actually transform our lives. Feels good for a little while, just like selecting solely desserts from the buffet is fun for a while. But after while, it just doesn't provide proper nourishment, and we get sick.


lol, assumptions are bad for your health as well. Not only am I not confused at all, perhaps not informed, but not confused, I am not simply taking "a little of this and a little of that." I take the important things. I take the focus, I take the meditations that enhance my life, I take the mindsets that enhance my life, and I take whatever I can see benefits from, be they short-term or long. I don't just pick and choose here and there, I take as much as possible and discard what I do not see myself getting benefits from.

So far there is only a handful of things and they are not requirements for the belief systems. I am not a vegetarian, I accept the fact that I am an omnivore and will not deny what I am for any reason. I do not go to church, I believe that our spirit/soul is a piece of the Great Spirit(God, Creator, etc) and thus if we know how to look within ourselves we can be with God in this way instead(this also agrees with Taoism, simply placing the Tao as God).

I believe that Taoism and Christianity, with the exception of Christ, is the same thing. The Tao is, in almost every way, God. No matter what language you use for a rose, the rose is still a rose.

Actually, although I choose not to use the name, my religion is known by a single name. This belief combination has been around for a long time, but was only given an individual name in the 70's. The name was taken from Star Wars due the fact that it inspired George Lucas for the Jedi Knights. My religion is called Jediism.

There are three reasons I do not use that name for it though. One is that I'm not a big enough fan of Star Wars to call myself a Jedi, the second is that it would be hard for people to take me seriously when explaining it to them since Jediism isn't very well known, and the third is that Jediism also contains Celtic Druidic concepts and Shinto beliefs. While I did adopt a few Shinto beliefs, easily since they coincided with Native American beliefs, I could not find the Celtic Druidic concepts that were used and everywhere I tried to learn from included Jediism's counterpart.

Someone switched Christianity with Satanism, and Sithism was born. While the Jedi are not going to force people to believe what they believe nor give people a hard time for being different, the Sith saw things differently and loved flaming anyone that was not a Sith. It may be more accurate to call them an official alliance of flamers than a religion, although since they do have religious views and teachings I guess the most accurate category would be religious flamers.

Anyways, I've gone a bit off topic. My point is, you shouldn't make assumptions just because something is popular. It's almost as bad, if not equally as bad, as trying to judge someone based on how they look. You assume they must be a certain way because they appear to be a certain way when in fact you haven't the slightest idea whether or not they really are.

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davidm843

PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 5:02 pm


Master Shadow Kilo
davidm843
This definitely explains why you are so confused about what the Buddha taught. "Buffet spirituality" is very popular now days, I hope it works for you. My experience is that when we choose "a little bit of this and a little of that" from various traditions, we tend to leave out the hard parts that will actually transform our lives. Feels good for a little while, just like selecting solely desserts from the buffet is fun for a while. But after while, it just doesn't provide proper nourishment, and we get sick.


lol, assumptions are bad for your health as well. Not only am I not confused at all, perhaps not informed, but not confused, I am not simply taking "a little of this and a little of that." I take the important things. I take the focus, I take the meditations that enhance my life, I take the mindsets that enhance my life, and I take whatever I can see benefits from, be they short-term or long. I don't just pick and choose here and there, I take as much as possible and discard what I do not see myself getting benefits from.

So far there is only a handful of things and they are not requirements for the belief systems. I am not a vegetarian, I accept the fact that I am an omnivore and will not deny what I am for any reason. I do not go to church, I believe that our spirit/soul is a piece of the Great Spirit(God, Creator, etc) and thus if we know how to look within ourselves we can be with God in this way instead(this also agrees with Taoism, simply placing the Tao as God).

I believe that Taoism and Christianity, with the exception of Christ, is the same thing. The Tao is, in almost every way, God. No matter what language you use for a rose, the rose is still a rose.

Actually, although I choose not to use the name, my religion is known by a single name. This belief combination has been around for a long time, but was only given an individual name in the 70's. The name was taken from Star Wars due the fact that it inspired George Lucas for the Jedi Knights. My religion is called Jediism.

There are three reasons I do not use that name for it though. One is that I'm not a big enough fan of Star Wars to call myself a Jedi, the second is that it would be hard for people to take me seriously when explaining it to them since Jediism isn't very well known, and the third is that Jediism also contains Celtic Druidic concepts and Shinto beliefs. While I did adopt a few Shinto beliefs, easily since they coincided with Native American beliefs, I could not find the Celtic Druidic concepts that were used and everywhere I tried to learn from included Jediism's counterpart.

Someone switched Christianity with Satanism, and Sithism was born. While the Jedi are not going to force people to believe what they believe nor give people a hard time for being different, the Sith saw things differently and loved flaming anyone that was not a Sith. It may be more accurate to call them an official alliance of flamers than a religion, although since they do have religious views and teachings I guess the most accurate category would be religious flamers.

Anyways, I've gone a bit off topic. My point is, you shouldn't make assumptions just because something is popular. It's almost as bad, if not equally as bad, as trying to judge someone based on how they look. You assume they must be a certain way because they appear to be a certain way when in fact you haven't the slightest idea whether or not they really are.


Oooookay! Good luck with that. rofl
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 5:32 pm


davidm843

Oooookay! Good luck with that. rofl

lol, you can add this to that list I gave you in the thread about vegetarianism. This one comes off as mockery. Prior to this one, five word post, I thought you might be someone I could learn from. You have just, with one short little post, switched my opinion to being more along the lines of seeing you talk the talk, but not walk the walk.

"No matter how many holy words you speak, no matter how many you may read, what good are they if you do not practice them?" -Buddha.

Mockery is not an act of compassion.

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PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2010 7:00 pm


i swear often, but i also am a very word-mindful person. i do not say anything that i don't mean if i can help it. i'll admit sometimes i make mistakes, i havn't had the best education... but i use my swearing and cursing in very careful ways. i won't use words like "damned and ********" and such to refer to people or things i respect. i will use them to describe some concepts though.

swearing is my nature, and i don't particularly care to change that. i feel comfortable with it. it does become a problem though sometimes when i am in a setting where i feel it would be improper or disrespectful of me to swear, and i get worked up emotionally... because when i realy get irritated with a person or what they are saying, i will not check myself before speaking. i will say exactly what i mean, even when i wanted to be civil. actually, this happened earlier in this guild too, and i feel awful about it. i still meant what i said, but i didn't want to say it here, because it just doesn't seem like the place. xp

when i curse i always make sure that i arrange the wording to fit exactly what i mean. it isn't always clear to some people, th may find that when i attack their methods or opinions i am attacking them personally. i hope to fit in here without having to change who i am. i appologize in advance for any more slip-ups i might make. i'll understand if i end up getting kicked out of here eventualy for obscene behavior, but i will say this. it is my intention not to blow up again. xp i am sure that the environment will stay peaceful.
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