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 Posted: Fri May 02, 2008 11:35 pm
Edge of Ether Homosexuality is not something you are born with. It is not a disease. It is a choice that someone makes after thinking about it. Actually, it's more like something you discover about yourself. And homosexuality is at least partially genetic. The problem with a lot of people's perceptions in these debates is that they view homosexuality as something that you either "are" or "aren't", when in fact everyone is really just at different degrees of bisexuality.
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Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 6:18 am
Lethkhar Edge of Ether Homosexuality is not something you are born with. It is not a disease. It is a choice that someone makes after thinking about it. Actually, it's more like something you discover about yourself. And homosexuality is at least partially genetic. The problem with a lot of people's perceptions in these debates is that they view homosexuality as something that you either "are" or "aren't", when in fact everyone is really just at different degrees of bisexuality.
Hello there, and I agree with what Lethkar said. 3nodding It's all about what hormones the baby is exposed to while in the womb. I'm not good at explaining, so yeah... xp
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Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 12:49 pm
This isn't a grey matter.
A man is suppose to be with a woman.
No matter what excuses we try to come up with, it's not right.
God says it's wrong, and we should do our best to over come all temptation whatever they might be.
If everything was genetic, though.
No one would be responsible for anything really.
But again, genetic or not.
God gave us free will.
To obey him or not.
(I'm sorry, please don't attack me. o.o)
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Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 12:59 pm
Quote: Have you considered the idea that maybe homosexuality isn't a sin? No. No, I haven't. Wanna know why that is? Because G-d says it's a sin, and I trust G-d exceedingly more on moral matters than I trust a strange athiest I met online who cannot seem to grasp the fact that no matter how annoying he is, people will dissagree with him on certian points.
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Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 1:01 pm
Koutsuku ( I'm sorry, plus don't attack me. o.o) Don't be afraid to speak the truth, even if you'll get attacked or dissagreed with. Which you always will. No matter what you say, someone will always have a different opinion, and some people will be sure to let you know of their differing thoughts on the subject. You just have to keep telling it like it is.
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Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 5:40 pm
The Book Never Written Koutsuku ( I'm sorry, please don't attack me. o.o) Don't be afraid to speak the truth, even if you'll get attacked or dissagreed with. Which you always will. No matter what you say, someone will always have a different opinion, and some people will be sure to let you know of their differing thoughts on the subject. You just have to keep telling it like it is. Thank you. ..;
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 5:49 am
Koutsuku - No, not everything is genetic. If I steal something, it's not because it is in my genes that I must be a theif. But being gay is genetic.
Also, you know there's nothing in the Bible (I don't think, their certainly isn't in the OT) which says that women shouldn't be together, just men.
Also, if you look at things in context, at the time a lot of homosexuals (or, at least, the ones who were open about it; the ones people new of) were very sinful.
eg. using sex to worship pagan gods, or leaving their wives to be with men etc.
This lead to the belief that homosexuality is sinful.
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 11:10 am
Trix Starlight Koutsuku - No, not everything is genetic. If I steal something, it's not because it is in my genes that I must be a theif. But being gay is genetic. Also, you know there's nothing in the Bible (I don't think, their certainly isn't in the OT) which says that women shouldn't be together, just men. Also, if you look at things in context, at the time a lot of homosexuals (or, at least, the ones who were open about it; the ones people new of) were very sinful. eg. using sex to worship pagan gods, or leaving their wives to be with men etc. This lead to the belief that homosexuality is sinful.
If anyone needs any evidence of homosexuality being genetic, I've got a few great articles; I know I quoted one in another thread somewhere. In the meantime, enjoy some generalized statistics (and by generalized, I mean I don't have exact numbers at the moment).
If a person has an identical twin that is gay, chances are they are going to be gay, since all of their DNA is exactly the same. The chances drop slightly when raised apart, but not by much. The chances drop even more if you have fraternal twins raised together, and even further for fraternal twins raised apart.
These kinds of results come from actual studies. People don't just make stuff up. I unfortunately don't have any actual numbers for you, but I can hunt some down if you like.
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 11:57 am
The Book Never Written Quote: Have you considered the idea that maybe homosexuality isn't a sin? No. No, I haven't. Wanna know why that is? Because G-d says it's a sin, and I trust G-d exceedingly more on moral matters than I trust a strange athiest I met online who cannot seem to grasp the fact that no matter how annoying he is, people will dissagree with him on certian points. That seems rather presumptuous of you. I consider myself a fairly open-minded individual. I have said on at least a dozen occasions that I realize that people disagree with me, and they have the right to do so. But you probably hadn't read that. Maybe you should get to know more about the people you're speaking with before you insult them. Or maybe you just shouldn't insult them. In address to the topic: Why would God create people with the tendency to sin? Note: I am not debating with you to tell you that you're wrong. I'm debating with you because I'm recognizing that you depend on your God a lot, and I believe that if this is the case then you should be sure who your God is and what exactly depending on Him entails. Not that I can tell you, I don't know your God, but I think it's something that you need to discover. Now, you might say that you know your God and you know exactly what that entails. But I find that more often than not religious people aren't able to even consider certain questions, which is a problem if their character is defined by what should be providing them with the facilities to do so. So if I seem redundant, forgive me. I'm just trying to help.
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 12:47 pm
@Lethkhar
As a Christian, we live to depend on God. =/
He is our strength, our rock, and our love.
We live to worship and love him.
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 12:48 pm
genetics do not determine what you do.
that is the end.
there is nothing more.
as i have said, and this is what i was talking about that whole time, It boils down to choice.;
Even if genetics, upbringing, AND environment are against you, you can *choose* NOT to act on those homosexual impulses.
God has not nor ever will create a homosexual, it is a learned behavior, a learned way of thinking.
hormones do not decide what your actions are, they serve to influence and influence only. Hormones are the start of most, if not all, sexual sins. Whether that be adultery, promiscuity, or homosexuality.
No one is born gay.
If they are born with different hormones, then they could be female-like. OUR SOCIETY is the one that says "if you are female-like, then you must be gay." This is wrong. Those born with more estrogen still have a choice who you fall in love with/sleep with.
It boils down to choice. No matter what else influences, no matter what happens, no matter the situation. you always have choice. God gave us free will specifically for this reason.
If you are born with the so called "gay gene" that you guys are talking about, then instead of just giving in, you should view it as a test of your faith, and pray and speak with God for strength to over come the sin your body wants to commit.
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 1:02 pm
I would like to say that to be a Christian, you are called to be His Disciple.
Disciples do not get to tell the Master what is right or wrong.
To truly call yourself a man or woman of Christ, you have to put aside your thoughts, your opinions, and Accept HIS truth.
When Christ came to earth, he said to all that he does not come to break the Law of the past (i.e. the laws that God put forth), but to complete it.
==================================
as to whomever was talking about females and homosexuality, It does say that it is wrong. The Bible says that God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they would have sex with those that are of the same sex, and the writer lists both male and female.
Aaand usually in the Bible, when it says "Man" it means "Mankind" (i.e. all humans)
Please remember everyone, your opinions are not what you will be judged on when Christ returns.
You will be held to HIS standard, no one else's.
Choosing to ignore those around you that have told you that something you are doing is a sin according to God's word is not an excuse.
There are many many people who call themselves Christian, who have given into the World's view on things, and will not be allowed into heaven.
We are meant to detach ourselves from the world's opinions. We are to live separate from the World, according to God's word. By supporting homosexuality, you are giving into the excuses the World has come up with to justify their sin.
Homosexuality has not been supported by God's Church, and the only church that will support it is one that has fallen to the world.
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 1:09 pm
And one last thing, (sorry for multiple posts, but i am seeing things to respond to after i hit submit -_-)
Do not let science replace faith.
A report somewhere that says that homosexuality is genetic does NOT overwrite God's word. No matter what scientific "evidence" you have, it does not give one permission to exclude anything in God's word.
The World will always come up with new ways to justify sin, instead of repenting it.
Christians are different from the World in that instead of making excuses and finding ways out, we repent.
===============================
If you do not repent, no matter what the sin, you are not a Christian. There is no getting around this statement.
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 1:56 pm
I know many people will disagree with me because no one wants to be told they are wrong. The truth hurts.
"No one enjoys a Prophet's visit." I have been told this many times...
I am not a Prophet in the sense of telling everyone what will come to pass,
I am a Prophet in the sense of how Paul wrote to the Church at Corinth, showing them that they were not living the Christian life.
He has called me to help other Christians to understand God's word.
He has given me the strength and understanding to help others.
I apologize if i have sounded harsh.
The Word of God is both a love letter and a sword who cuts through flesh and spirit.
God bless you all, and I continue to pray for all of you.
(p.s. ^_^;;; i just noticed how many posts i have written in a small amount of time ._. sorry about that .....)
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Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 2:17 pm
What you may not realize is how much we do appreciate your efforts in the guild. We (and by we I mean me- sorry to generalize) understand that God has called you for this purpose and that you are doing as you feel the Spirit is instructing. We are meant the sharpen one another, some of us called a little more loudly than others (you, for example), and that's great that you take the Father's calling so seriously. The problem, however, is that in this day and age we must learn to reconcile both science and faith, which can sometimes be easier said than done. Some people may be trying to justify their sin through the teachings and preachings of science, but I think most are just trying to make sense of it, and fit it into God's teachings. Your continued prayer is very appreciated. heart
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